When it is possible to use the "Start / Complete Full-Round Action"?

[Diego Rossi]

PRD wrote:

Start/Complete Full-Round Action

The “start full-round action” standard action lets you start undertaking a full-round action, which you can complete in the following round by using another standard action. You can't use this action to start or complete a full attack, charge, run, or withdraw.

I thought it was possible to use it only if you were limited to a standard action, but apparently you can use it without limitations as long as you don't use it "to start or complete a full attack, charge, run, or withdraw."

That leave weird corner cases, as an example Spell combat is a full round action but not a full attack.

So, following RAW, I can:
- Declare to use spell combat.
- start it with a "Start Full-Round Action"
- move
next round
- cast my spell, do my full attack
- move away?

I am sure it is not RAI, but if you can use "Start/Complete Full-Round Action" any time you want it seem to follow RAW.

[SlimGauge]

It doesn't work that way. Once you "Start Full-Round Action", you can't do anything except "Complete Full-round Action" or abort the full-round action you started in favor of something else like lying there bleeding (if someone struck you down below 0 hp between your turns) or if you lost the spell (because someone struck you for damage between your turns and you blew the concentration check and now can't complete the spell).

So you can't
-start full round-spell
-move
next round
-finish full round-spell
-move again

but you CAN
-move into position
-start casting a full-round spell
Next round
-complete casting full-round spell
-move away

[Diego Rossi]

As the rule is all in the piece I cited, where it say that?

And even with that interpretation, it only change the order of actions, it don't disallow it:

So, following RAW, I can:
- move
- Declare to use spell combat.
- start it with a "Start Full-Round Action"
next round
- cast my spell, do my full attack
- move away?

[DM_Blake]

I don't think your example works. You can't normally move while you are in the middle of a full-round action. More like this:

First Round:
- Move normally
- Start Spell Combat using "Start Full-Round Action"
Next Round:
- Complete Spell Combat
- Move away

My question would be to figure out which parts of the Spell Combat (casting a spell and attacking) happen in the first round and which parts happen in the second round. I might argue to split those in half. Then again, I just might argue that Spell Combat is not eligible for the "Start Full-Round Action".

In fact, thinking about that, I am quite sure that Spell Combat is not eligible. Yes, I know, the FAQ already says that Spell Combat is not a full-attack and therefore by RAW Spell Combat is not excluded. But the "Start Full-Round Action" rule was written when Spell Combat did not exist so they couldn't have listed it as an exclusion when it did not exist yet, but I bet dollars to doughnuts that they would have.

This question might be FAQ-worthy, just to get a ruling on it, but for me, I'm fine with it as a houserule.

[Diego Rossi]

I am sure that it is not RAI, the problem is RAW.
And what other things you can do with that option.

As an example:
Use a touch spell on up to six friends

So I can touch a few friend this turn, a few friends the next?

[DM_Blake]

Diego Rossi wrote:

As the rule is all in the piece I cited, where it say that?

Core Rule Book, Full-Round Action:

"A full-round action consumes all your effort during a round. The only movement you can take during a full-round action is a 5-foot step before, during, or after the action."

This rule is still in effect, even if you begin the Full-Round action in one round and complete it in the next round.

[SlimGauge]

Diego Rossi wrote:

As the rule is all in the piece I cited, where it say that?

It's in the nature of the full round action.

'PRD' wrote:

Full-Round Action: A full-round action consumes all your effort during a round. The only movement you can take during a full-round action is a 5-foot step before, during, or after the action. You can also perform free actions and swift actions (see below). See Table: Actions in Combat for a list of full-round actions.

If you begin a full-round action, you man NOT move (excepting the five foot step) until that full-round action is over.

You used "Begin Full Round Action". You can't move until you "Complete Full Round Action".

Edit: Blasted dragon ninjas

[Reecy]

The spell lasts as long as you concentrate on it. Concentrating to maintain a spell is a standard action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity. Anything that could break your concentration when casting a spell can also break your concentration while you're maintaining one, causing the spell to end. See concentration.

Concentration under Spell Casting is technically a Standard action

To cast a spell, you must concentrate. If something interrupts your concentration while you're casting, you must make a concentration check or lose the spell. When you make a concentration check, you roll d20 and add your caster level and the ability score modifier used to determine bonus spells of the same type. Clerics, druids, and rangers add their Wisdom modifier. Bards, paladins, and sorcerers add their Charisma modifier. Finally, wizards add their Intelligence modifier. The more distracting the interruption and the higher the level of the spell you are trying to cast, the higher the DC (see Table: Concentration Check DCs). If you fail the check, you lose the spell just as if you had cast it to no effect.

So basically what is saying is You cast a Spell as a standard Action
but it doesnt go off until the Start of your next Round.

[DM_Blake]

SlimGauge wrote:

Edit: Blasted dragon ninjas

For the record, we tarrasques eat dragons for breakfast (and we're hungry again by lunch).

[Robert A Matthews]

It doesn't say that spell combat is a full attack even though it works like one. I would say RAW, you can spell combat using start/complete full round action. I would rule that nothing occurs until you finish the full round action. If your target withdraws, then you can't finish the full round action(unless you spell combat a dimension door to close the gap).

[Reecy]

Like Robert Said

Here is how I rule it

Cast Spell
No Move Spell Goes off at the begining of the turn

Cast Spell
Move
Takes the Standard action from new round and you get your Move Action for the second round

[Diego Rossi]

One weird use is with this full round action: "Use a touch spell on up to six friends".
The common reading is "you can touch up to six friends as a full round action in the round in which you cast the spell". But with the Start/complete action you can move, start the casting+touch part as a start full round action and complete it the next round.
As this will allow your friends to gather around you it seem very convenient.

The question now is if you can touch some friend the first round and how many.

[Eridan]

I would rule that you only can touch friends in the round you are finishing the full-round action. RAW is not clear so it depends on the GM. Maybe another GM would rule that you can touch up to 3 friends in the first and another 3 in the second round.

[Kazaan]

In all cases where you use the "start/complete full-round action", no result takes place in the first round. The whole point is that you're spreading the action economy over two rounds but you still have to wait for the action to complete in order to get results. If you're casting a full-round spell, all results of that spell will come online in the round you complete it while nothing at all happens in the round you start it. This would apply to all other actions, even those with sub-behaviors like casting a touch spell for multiple allies or Spell Combat. You don't get "some touches now and the rest later" and you don't get "your spell first and attacks next round". You finish the spell and get all 6 touches in the second round; you make your attacks and cast your spell in the second round. There's no splitting of the results.