Spell Prerequisites for Magic Item Creation

[Gargoyle13]

My question is this.
When crafting a magic item with a spell prerequisite listed in the construction requirements section, how does it work if the item creator does not have the spell.
Is it...
1) The item creator adds +5 DC for the item and can ignore the spell prerequisite?
or
2) The item creator adds +5 DC for the item but has to get the required spell from another source (an item, scroll, or another caster, etc)?

I have read numerous posts on the messageboards trying to understand this and there are varied opinions. I know what the CRB says, and to me personally, it seems a bit unclear. The CRB says add +5 DC for not meeting the prerequisite but in a couple different places it also talks about having others assist you in the creation. I would be thankful for developer response to this. If anyone knows if this question has been specifically answered somewhere and could point me to it, that would be great.

[MC Templar]

Depends on the item:

Most weapons, armor, wondrous items: 1) The item creator adds +5 DC for the item and can ignore the spell prerequisite?

Wands, scroll and other spell completion items: 2) The item creator adds +5 DC for the item but has to get the required spell from another source (an item, scroll, or another caster, etc)? (i'm not sure the italicized part is accurate)

When I'm GM'ing it is pretty simple... (personal rules below)
... if the magic item has the ability to cast that spell a certain number of times or a certain number of times per day... you need to have the spell from another source.
... if the magic item has an effect that is thematically near to the spell but doesn't actually replicate it on demand, it can be bypassed with merely adding 5 to the DC.

[wraithstrike]

The caster has two options.

A. Add +5 to the DC and ignore the spell

B. Get the spell from another source..

If he can get access to the spell he does not have to deal with the +5 DC.

There is an official answer. I will see if I can find it for you so you know that I know what I am talking about..

PS: Potions can not be made by adding +5 to the DC if the spell is not available. You must have access to the spell

[wraithstrike]

The rules say you pay the +5 only when you can not meet the requirement. So if you can meet the requirement then you don't pay the +5.

Offical FAQ wrote:

Crafting and Spell Requirements: When crafting an item, can an arcane caster use a divine scroll to fulfill an item's divine spell requirement?

Yes. (Likewise, a divine caster could use an arcane scroll to fulfill an item's arcane spell requirement.)
However, the character has to be able to activate the scroll somehow as part of the crafting process. This probably requires the arcane caster to succeed at a Use Magic Device check to activate the divine spell. If the caster fails to cast the divine spell from the scroll, he makes no progress on the item that day unless he has another source for that divine spell (such as another copy of the scroll).

This established that using such items fill the requirement. If you would still have to get the spell from another source then you are not ignoring the requirement.

[LazarX]

wraithstrike wrote:

The caster has two options.

A. Add +5 to the DC and ignore the spell

B. Get the spell from another source..

If he can get access to the spell he does not have to deal with the +5 DC.

There is an official answer. I will see if I can find it for you so you know that I know what I am talking about..

PS: Potions can not be made by adding +5 to the DC if the spell is not available. You must have access to the spell

For scrolls and wands, A, is not an option, and B is questionable at best.

[wraithstrike]

LazarX wrote:

wraithstrike wrote:

The caster has two options.

A. Add +5 to the DC and ignore the spell

B. Get the spell from another source..

If he can get access to the spell he does not have to deal with the +5 DC.

There is an official answer. I will see if I can find it for you so you know that I know what I am talking about..

PS: Potions can not be made by adding +5 to the DC if the spell is not available. You must have access to the spell

For scrolls and wands, A, is not an option, and B is questionable at best.

I agree with you on A.

The rules say the requirement must be met. They don't see you have to cast the spell. To say you can add the +5 without the spell, and you still have to add the +5 even if you have the spell from another source makes no sense at all.

Quote:

As presented on page 549 of the Core Rulebook, there are no limitations other than (1) you have to have the item creation feat, and (2) you cannot create potions, spell-trigger, or spell-completion magic items without meeting their spell prerequisites. So racial requirements, specific spell requirements, math requirements (such as "caster level must be at least three times the enhancement bonus"), and so on, are all subject to the +5 DC rule.

According to the book the +5 DCs can be ignored if you make the new spellcraft DC.