Ranger switch-hitter advice


Advice


The D&D 3.0 campaign I have been playing in for the last 10 years is very likely to end on our next session. We are level 19, and we are fully buffed and standing outside the BBEG's chamber. One way or another, it will end...

During these ten years the group (of players) has seen two marriages, 4 births and one near-fatal stroke. We are all considerably fatter and greyer then we were when we started, and we now drink tea while we play instead of beer.

Anyway, once we finish we are going to start a Pathfinder game! I have been playing a wizard (with a cleric henchman) and I am absolutely sick of all the paperwork. I have decided to play a martial character of some sort, and after much deliberation I think I'm starting to settle on a Ranger switch-hitter.

I'd like a bit of advice on my build (to 6th, although we will be starting at 1st), and any suggestions would be welcome. I've also laid out how I think combat will go and I'd be grateful if any glaring errors could be highlighted...

Human Ranger
Str: 18
Dex: 15
Con: 12
Int: 10
Wis: 14
Cha: 7

Feats:
1: Combat Reflexes/Quick Draw
2: Rapid Shot
3: Power Attack
4: +1 Dex
5: Deadly Aim
6: Manyshot

He will be carrying a bucketload of weapons:

A bardiche (normally carried in hand)
A lucern hammer
A mighty long composite bow
Spiked armour
4 chakrams
A greatsword

So an encounter begins, with the following possible scenarios:

1) I win initiative, enemy is at long range (unlikely to reach me this turn). In this situation I would:
drop the bardiche (free action)
draw longbow (free action)
make full round ranged attack
The enemy moves up in its turn, possibly casting/using ranged attacks. In my next turn:
If an enemy seems to be moving towards melee with me, I take a full round ranged attack
Drop the longbow (free action)
Draw lucerne hammer to get AoO on the enemy as it closes.

2) I lose initiative. Enemy engages me in melee.
I take AoOs as enemy closes
On my turn I either take a 5' step to full attack with lucerne hammer, or if not possible drop lucerne hammer (free action), draw greatsword (free action) and make a full attack.

3) I win initiative, enemy is at close range.
Release one hand from holding bardiche (Free action)
Make full round ranged attack with chakrams (drawing each is free action)
re-grip bardiche in two-hands to get AoOs as enemy closes.

Is that all about right?

Many thanks in advance!


Any advice on magic items I could look out for would also be appreciated.


That all looks correct to me.

Here is a useful list of magic gear.


I would not worry about a reach weapon for a switch hitter. If your opponent is not in your face you keep using the bow. You want to a good solid two handed melee weapon as your melee weapon. Also your bow is going to be the weapon in hand instead of your melee weapon.

Quick draw is not needed until about 5th level when you are about to get your second attack. Take power attack at 1st level instead. The extra damage at the early levels means you will pretty much one shot everything. Deadly aim should also be taken earlier to get the extra damage.

Using the chakrams still provokes an attack of opportunity so I would not bother with them. If the enemy is to close for you to use the bow use a melee weapon. A weapon with a good critical range is going to be more effective than one with a better base damage. The falchion is probably the best for this especially if you get keen or improved critical.

Just your weapons, armor and some real basic gear is going to put your carried weight at over 100 pounds. Even with a 18 strength that puts you into medium encumbrance. Also having all those weapons enchanted is going to be incredibly expensive. Stick with two main weapons instead of six weapons.

Pick up heavy armor proficiency and get a set of mithrial full plate as soon as you can. AC is one of a switch hitters weak spots.

Also consider picking up Iron will. You fortitude and reflex saves are good, but even with a 12 wisdom your will saves are going to be weak. Will saves are probably the most important save in the game. A failed reflex save usually means you just take some extra damage. A failed Fortitude save usually means you are out of the combat. A failed will save often puts you against your party.

Sczarni

Yeah, if you're not dead set on using a reach weapon, I'd consider dropping Combat Reflexes all together. This opens up a feat slot where you could take;

- Boon Companion to bolster your Animal Companion.
- Big Game Hunter (if permitted), its a pretty good feat.
- Opening Volley, which is pretty much tailor made for the Switch-Hitter.

Of course this is all just a matter of taste, you will have no shortage of valuable feats you could take. I just find that Combat Reflexes is wasted without an increased threatened area.


I agree with dropping combat reflexes unless you have a very important reason for taking it.. Also I might switch Dex and Strength. Slghtly higher initiative, more accuracy with bows, especially if you're taking stacked penalties for Rapid Shot and Deadly Aim.


All good and interesting points, so thank you. The reason I'm thinking of combat reflexes and a reach weapon is mainly to get in some AoOs in the event the party is taken by surprise and attacked.

As far as I can see there is no functional difference between carrying a bow in hand and carrying a polearm, as quick draw will allow me to drop the polearm and have the bow ready without spending any actions - so why not have a polearm? Maybe I'm missing something.

I'm considering chakrams for those times the enemy appears within short range - I can throw those and still have my polearm in hand. The difference between those and and a bow is minimal until I get Manyshot.


Durinor wrote:
so why not have a polearm?

Because it weighs 12 lbs and will cost you 2000gp or more to enchant. If you're so desperate to get Reach, just buy a few dozen potions of Enlarge Person, which will come out cheaper in the long run.


Mysterious Stranger wrote:

I would not worry about a reach weapon for a switch hitter. If your opponent is not in your face you keep using the bow. You want to a good solid two handed melee weapon as your melee weapon. Also your bow is going to be the weapon in hand instead of your melee weapon.

Quick draw is not needed until about 5th level when you are about to get your second attack. Take power attack at 1st level instead. The extra damage at the early levels means you will pretty much one shot everything. Deadly aim should also be taken earlier to get the extra damage.

Using the chakrams still provokes an attack of opportunity so I would not bother with them. If the enemy is to close for you to use the bow use a melee weapon. A weapon with a good critical range is going to be more effective than one with a better base damage. The falchion is probably the best for this especially if you get keen or improved critical.

Just your weapons, armor and some real basic gear is going to put your carried weight at over 100 pounds. Even with a 18 strength that puts you into medium encumbrance. Also having all those weapons enchanted is going to be incredibly expensive. Stick with two main weapons instead of six weapons.

Pick up heavy armor proficiency and get a set of mithrial full plate as soon as you can. AC is one of a switch hitters weak spots.

Also consider picking up Iron will. You fortitude and reflex saves are good, but even with a 12 wisdom your will saves are going to be weak. Will saves are probably the most important save in the game. A failed reflex save usually means you just take some extra damage. A failed Fortitude save usually means you are out of the combat. A failed will save often puts you against your party.

There's a lot here I agree and disagree with.

Power Attack and Deadly Aim are both very important feats to have by level 5, as is Quickdraw. Combat Reflexes I feel is less important, as the switch hitter is more about being mobile and going to an enemy rather than stay in one place and wait. I always recommend the Spring Attack chain to not only make up for AC lost due to the lack of heavy armor while doing said moving around, but also because it helps you stay on the move.

I am completely against taking Heavy Armor Proficiency as it is a waste of a feat if you are just taking it to get mithral fullplate access, a mithral breastplate should suffice just fine with what should be a high DEX. If you really want to invest in some 'heavy' armor, go with this one here. It counts as medium for all purposes (including proficiency meaning you don't have to waste the feat) and functions as full plate.

Speaking of that DEX mod, if you are going to play a human, I would recommend balancing the DEX and STR scores a bit better at lower levels. Buying a 16 DEX and a 15 STR means both modifiers are +3 for the first 3 levels, and that extra +1 AC/initiative/attack bonus to half your combat prowess will be important, and you will be glad you did it. Dual Talent humans can get a +2 to 2 different stats, at the cost of your feat and free skill point, depending on the build it may be worth it (since you get extra feats from combat style and 6 ranks/level anyway) to get +3's in both stats (or a +4 and a +3) and be able to have two +4's by level 4. (Not relying on items is good for you, especially since pathfinder makes you spend a lot more gp for improving more than one stat than 3.x did.)

I also agree with sticking to 2 main weapons, my votes being a greatsword and a composite bow. Keep spares in a bag of holding once it really matters, but for the most part you shouldn't have a DM making you worry about stuff getting stolen or sundered that early in your character's career.

Recommended build:
STR 18
DEX 17
CON 12
INT 10
WIS 14
CHA 7

1) Power Attack
2) Rapid Shot
3) Deadly Aim
5) Quickdraw
6) Manyshot

Combat should always start with you lobbing arrows at enemies, and only getting close when your buddy needs a flanker or when DR gets ridiculous (barring necessity because an enemy is in your face, but that should be obvious).

Remember, even though you get a d10 hit die now, you are still squishy with that 12 CON, and you aren't the paladin who can heal as a swift action x+charisma times per day, nor are you the barbarian who can rage out and gain a bonus to CON.

Skills are also important, Survival, Perception, and Stealth should be maxed, with the other 3 skill ranks per level spreading out to get you class skill bonus in all of your skills that you have available. (Handle animal is on that list above if you plan on having an animal companion, especially with the negative CHA.)


You're a ranger. High Perception keeps you from getting surprised, Improved Initiative and a high Dex help you attack first. Combat Reflexes helps you a little bit in one situation -- but without tripping, you can't really stop them from getting close anyway, unless you do enough damage with the AoO to oneshot them.


tonyz wrote:
You're a ranger. High Perception keeps you from getting surprised, Improved Initiative and a high Dex help you attack first. Combat Reflexes helps you a little bit in one situation -- but without tripping, you can't really stop them from getting close anyway, unless you do enough damage with the AoO to oneshot them.

This, rangers are scouting characters by nature (no pun intended). It should be your character's job to make sure you guys are never surprised unless the DM uses DM magic and forces it on you.

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