Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Now, this is just theory-crafting and discussion, as Goblinworks has not released anything concrete about how many 'free' structures can be built on a Hex besides the Settlement itself.
What about Players who, through overpopulation or choice, cannot build their own house, or indeed find a room to claim as their own, inside a Settlement, yet they have the wealth to build their own?
I have a couple of theories.
Each 'Hex' is broken up into 6 or 7 smaller Hexes that occupy the space within it, I believe, with a variety of terrain types for the 'Hex' that is controlled. IE, a single Chapter might control a Primary Hex (the larger one), and inside that Primary Hex is 6 or 7 different terrain types, for the purpose of this discussion we'll call them Micro-Hexes.
Each Micro-Hex has some of the semi-hidden 'Hideouts' scattered about, as well as some building locations that may or may not be suitable for specific buildings.
You wouldn't build a Lumber Mill in the Plains, and you don't have a Quarry next to a lake, for example.
Farms, I think, would be the more likely candidate for 'anywhere you can', but depending upon the type of Primary Hex you end up with, the terrain type of the Micro-Hexes is going to be a big roadblock for most Chapters to work with in the first few months.
Let's say players want to build a Farm. Start off small, single room building for sleeping/storage, barn to hold the animals and produce, cheap fence around a starter-size field/pasture, yada yada yada.
Over the next few weeks, the players have managed to build the farm up to a very profitable level, making the original 'house into a large 2-storey structure with a basement, with plenty of individual rooms for the 'workers' to occupy, solid walls and a slate roof to make the 'house' a fortress in case of the bandit attack, several barns now, dozens of fields and pastures, it's looking good.
But how many Farms are we going to be able to build on this Micro-Hex? Just the one, or dozens? Is there a maximum size a Farm can grow to, necessitating all the Farmers specialise in individual types of farming, to ensure a wide selection of produce is available and that nobody is in direct competition with each other, or can a Farm spread out indefinitely?
Likewise, Lumber Mills can become insatiable if the demand for wood for building structures, for firewood, for crafting of weapons and other tools, and it might be possible for a Lumber Mill that is irresponsibly run to clear-cut a Forest-type Micro-Hex, causing a great many problems, such as now-homeless monsters, furious Druids and Fey incursions or environmental problems that might spread to other Micro-Hexes within the Primary.
And what about homes? Building a 'House' outside of a Settlement might be possible, with the right money to the right person, but obviously Goblinworks wishes to avoid the 'wall of sheds' that other MMOs that have allowed freeform buildings have endured, with Guilds of Griefers going out of their way to 'lock' other players within areas.
I could see people getting sick of the 'noise' of other players going out with some friends and making a 'lodge' in a relatively secluded area, and over time, this might even become a mini-settlement on it's own as the need to make their own crafting/training stations to keep up with their increasing skills makes the owners of the 'lodge' build up their little paradise.
Over the course of several weeks ... there are 2 'Settlements' within the Primary Hex, although within 2 different Micro-Hexes. What can/will the Controlling Faction of the Primary Hex do? Do they welcome the increasing Development Indexes this 'Secondary' Settlement will provide for their domain, do they (rightly) fear this new Settlement might very well become the home base of a rival/hostile Company/Charter/Guild?
Can individual Buildings outside of a Settlement be razed to the ground? How many individual Buildings can be built outside of a Settlement before the Game goes 'no more' because all the development sites are taken?
I could fully see large Merchant Charters/Guilds building their own 'safe houses' outside of the Settlements, where convoys of their people can pull in and store goods under lock and key, before a second convoy comes in to pick up the items and finish the job. Rather than a single Convoy having to wend it's way through multiple Hexes, having 2 or 3 convoys 'passing the baton', if that makes sense, allows the Merchants to get back to their home Hexes quickly to keep an eye on more sales/chances for profit/'home' warehouses and given the sizes of the Primary and Micro-Hexes, also ensures nobody is stuck in the saddle for 5+ hours to deliver turnips to Sir Doucheadin.
That said, having a 'drop off' point also makes a solid target for Bandits and Raiders, who now don't have to camp every deer-trail and smuggler's route in hopes of catching a Convoy with it's collective pants down.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Ah, I did mis-read then.
That actually makes things a little more interesting then. If the Hexes really are smaller, then does that mean a Settlement will take up the majority of a Hex, and that other types of buildings, Farms, Lumber Mills, Quarries etc, will do the same? Hmm...
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Just for clarity: Unofficial Pathfinder Online Map
4) Scaling from the Unofficial Map, a large hex is approx 1778 m (5832 ft) across while a small hex is approximately 593 m (1945 ft) across. If the ratios are correct (and there is still a great deal of doubt about that) then a small hex in the map is a little over 3 times the extent of the Environmental Experience.
I guess these numbers are somewhat experimental? The smaller hex size for a settlement of about 593m, would that be at least 80%-100% settlement, I'm wondering (about 475m & up) for a settlement hex?
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
@Avena
I think Harad's numbers are based on the Over the Hill and Far Away blog.
Previously our plan was to target 200+ hexes for the Crusader Road area, each about a little larger than a mile across with a settlement at the center of each. After some mucking around with maps and technical issues, we realized this plan would mean that war between settlements had to be an all-or-nothing affair; the only thing you could do to another settlement was sack it. There was no real sense of fighting for territory since the only territory you controlled was the hex around your settlement, and the only way to lose territory was to lose your settlement. We wanted settlement loss to be the climax of a massive struggle, not the only step, so we have decided to subdivide our previous "big" hexes into seven smaller hexes each, creating more discrete units of territory to fight over.
Before anyone panics, the total size of the game is not changing; if anything it may get bigger, since there are now a lot more hexes. Currently our hex-size experiments are falling into the range of 400 to 1000 meters across per new, smaller hex.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Regarding hex size and types of hexes, and what can be (currently planned) built outside Settlements, from blog, Over Hill and Far Away:
Hex Size
Territorial control and resource production are some of the major gameplay facets in Pathfinder Online, so we've been working on tuning up the map to try and make things more fun and interesting. We've revamped our early thinking on implementing the hex system to increase fun and allow for more gradations of conquest, conflict, and resource collection. There have been a number of discussion threads recently about hexes, so we thought this would be a good time to bring everyone up to speed on our latest thinking.
Previously our plan was to target 200+ hexes for the Crusader Road area, each about a little larger than a mile across with a settlement at the center of each. After some mucking around with maps and technical issues, we realized this plan would mean that war between settlements had to be an all-or-nothing affair; the only thing you could do to another settlement was sack it. There was no real sense of fighting for territory since the only territory you controlled was the hex around your settlement, and the only way to lose territory was to lose your settlement. We wanted settlement loss to be the climax of a massive struggle, not the only step, so we have decided to subdivide our previous "big" hexes into seven smaller hexes each, creating more discrete units of territory to fight over.
Before anyone panics, the total size of the game is not changing; if anything it may get bigger, since there are now a lot more hexes. Currently our hex-size experiments are falling into the range of 400 to 1000 meters across per new, smaller hex.
Types of Hexes
First, hexes come in four types: settlement hexes, wilderness hexes, monster hexes, and NPC hexes.
Settlement Hex: Settlement hexes are where you build settlements. Not every hex in the Crusader Road area is a potential settlement site—roughly 1 hex in 10 actually has the potential to become a town. These hexes are seeded throughout the game area, surrounded by wilderness hexes.
Settlement hexes do not produce resources aside from what the structures in a settlement produce.
Initially, settlement hexes are empty of structures, and any settlement must be built at the town site near the center of the hex.
Each settlement hex provides base values for the starting development indexes of a settlement built in that hex (see Development Indexes, below)—different town sites offer different natural advantages and disadvantages.Wilderness Hex: Most hexes are wilderness hexes. Each settlement hex is surrounded by six wilderness hexes. In addition there are "extra" wilderness hexes seeded across the map to make things interesting and less regular.
Wilderness hexes are mostly undeveloped land with a space for a point of interest (an inn, watchtower, farm, or similar structure) to be built near the center.
Wilderness hexes are where most resources are found, with each wilderness hex having a selection of Common, Uncommon, Rare, and Very Rare resources. No one hex produces all resources, and they produce resources corresponding to the terrain. For example, forests may produce multiple types of wood, while hills produce metals and stone.
A wilderness hex is controlled by whatever settlement controls the point of interest. The number and type of wilderness hexes a settlement controls boosts the development indexes of the controlling settlement (see Development Indexes, below).Settlements can build outlying structures in the points of interest of wilderness hexes they control. Constructing a point of interest structure requires money and resources, as does maintaining it. Different point of interest structures provide different boosts to the controlling settlement's development indexes. For example, farms produce food and primarily boost the controlling settlement's population and industry, while watchtowers allow members of the settlement to see further into neighboring hexes and boosts settlement security. Other point of interest structures might include mines, inns, logging camps, or shrines that function as temples away from settlements.
Monster Hex: Located among wilderness hexes (and never next to a settlement hex), monster hexes are hostile spaces were monsters often lurk.
Settlements cannot control monster hexes, and they do not affect development potential of nearby settlements.
Monster hexes are where escalation cycles begin, which are events where monsters will move into an area and spread from hex to hex. Monsters may disrupt control of the hexes they spread into if they are not stopped by destroying their base in the source monster hex.
Monster hexes produce resources but are very difficult to harvest due to all the hostile forces.NPC Hex: A limited number of hexes are controlled by NPC settlements, such as Thornkeep and Fort Inevitable. In addition, certain major trade routes are also chains of NPC hexes.
These cannot be controlled by settlements and do not affect their development.
Resources can be harvested in these hexes, but tend to be lower quality overall.
These hexes provide some level of protection for players in the form of NPC guards or patrols.
New players start in NPC hexes, where they can more safely learn the basics of the game. Once they outgrow the resources and training available in the NPC hexes, most players will move on to other hexes.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I for one would like to be able to run off into the wilderness and build my own little house without having to be tied to any settlement. That's not likely to happen though. It would be hard to keep and defend such a place without the resources of a settlement and constant vigilance. You wouldn't be able to go adventuring without risking mob escalation destroying it or PCs ransacking the place.
I guess I'll have to leave such ideals in Minecraft..
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I could fully see building a 'lodge', or a house with multiple bedrooms with lockable doors outside of a settlement or a Settlement Hex would be quite useful as a 'waypoint' for adventurer's heading out to gather materials for the Settlement.
Provides a roof over their head and a warm bed to help recover from debilitating injuries such as poisons, diseases and critical damage that spells may or may not be strong enough to repair at once.
Provides a place where excess loot and materials can be stored with relative safety until allied Merchants can come and ferry the goods away to the Settlement.
Provides a role-play 'hook' that doesn't involve the bloody taverns ....
Could serve as a home base for an organisation that the Controlling Faction of the nearby Hexes want to keep around, but for political reasons cannot be openly associated with.
could serve as a cover for a cult/thieves guild/secret society/training hall for 'unsightly' classes, such as Necromancers, Thieves or Barbarians (in a highly Lawful Hex at least!)
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
As I remember (awaiting Nihimon-ding) the current buildings available for building in a PoI are inns, watchtowers, forts, and harvesting camps. I may be missing some (long day). I believe that you could make a watchtower or fort into the type of residence you require. A fort is more desirable as it takes siege engines to destroy. I'm wondering if I could make a watchtower into a monastery, or will I have to go full bore with a fort.
I have been wondering if one could just build a tavern in the middle of nowhere and, with the help of some friendly parties/CCs, hold onto it.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Kobold Cleaver: I think Vancent was right about the risks involved in maintaining something less secure than a fort, but I also think that with a fairly small group of helpers (mostly to provide defense coverage while the owner works, eats and sleeps), it would be quite an adventure.
Even if the house/manor/tavern was eventually burned down by goblins or overrun by a zombie horde, the stories about how you built it, ran it, then lost it could be epic.
