This is probably a stupid question re: Two Weapon fighting...

[Sensten]

Is there a difference between TWF and fighting with two weapons?

What I mean is, suppose you have 6 BAB. In one hand you hold a longsword, in the other a dagger.

1 If you take 2 attacks with the longsword, are you penalized?

2 If you take one attack with the longsword and one with the dagger, are you penalized then?

3 Or are you only penalized when you attempt a third attack with your offhand weapon (2 longsword attacks, 1 dagger)?

Here's a more specific scenario:

Bobert the ninja has BAB 11, a wakizashi and a pouch full of shuriken. He's adjacent to a monster and full attacks. The monster was already teetering and Bobert's first two attacks kill him. But the next monster is ten feet away. He can't 5 foot step over. Can he use his last attack to throw a shuriken?

[Rynjin]

1.) I don't believe so.
2.) Yes, at that point you are using both weapons and would take the -8 penalty.
3.) I don't think you CAN do that without TWF. Pretty sure you need TWF to make more than one attack with your off-hand.

Bobert is using Shuriken, which are a free action to draw. So yes, he could, as long as he didn't declare he was using all of his attacks on the original monster.

[blackbloodtroll]

Unless you are gaining the extra attack from two-weapon fighting, you suffer no penalty.

Simply attacking with different weapon during a full-attack incurs no penalty.

So, extra attack = penalty, no extra attack = no penalty.

[Sensten]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Unless you are gaining the extra attack from two-weapon fighting, you suffer no penalty.

Simply attacking with different weapon during a full-attack incurs no penalty.

So, extra attack = penalty, no extra attack = no penalty.

Thanks :)

[Sensten]

Rynjin wrote:

1.) I don't believe so.

2.) Yes, at that point you are using both weapons and would take the -8 penalty.
3.) I don't think you CAN do that without TWF. Pretty sure you need TWF to make more than one attack with your off-hand.

Bobert is using Shuriken, which are a free action to draw. So yes, he could, as long as he didn't declare he was using all of his attacks on the original monster.

And Bobert is pleased, everyone can have a day off

[Skylancer4]

In your example you couldn't take the extra attack. You didn't take the penalty to attack for TWFing on your initial attacks.

The rules for the full round attack state you can make one attack as a standard action and choose to do a full round attack after. TWFing requires a full round attack action declaration from the start due to penalties on the attacks across the board.

End result, there is a difference between TWFing and a standard action turned full round action.

[blackbloodtroll]

See FAQ here.

[Sensten]

Skylancer4 wrote:

In your example you couldn't take the extra attack. You didn't take the penalty to attack for TWFing on your initial attacks.

The rules for the full round attack state you can make one attack as a standard action and choose to do a full round attack after. TWFing requires a full round attack action declaration from the start due to penalties on the attacks across the board.

End result, there is a difference between TWFing and a standard action turned full round action.

Now I'm confused again. I wasn't taking an extra attack. I was taking my normal three attacks from having 11 BAB. Can you clarify for me?

Edit: Nevermind, Blackbloodtroll linked to the FAQ, I get it now

[blackbloodtroll]

You are not the first to be confused.

This is why the FAQ was created.

[Shin Bilirubin]

Sensten wrote:

2.) Yes, at that point you are using both weapons and would take the -8 penalty.

If I'm not mistaken, which I don't think I am from the FAQ, you wouldn't take the two weapon penalties for using two weapons, so long as you're using only you attack from you BAB, i.e. +6/+1 means you can attack with two weapons, one at +6, the second at +1.

[blackbloodtroll]

Rynjin is wrong. The FAQ is right.

[Rynjin]

Yeah, ignore mah post. If I could delete it I would but I can't so I won't.