| Sensten |
Hexcrafter Magus w/ 1 lvl Sorcerer dip (tattoo sorcerer/crossblooded - orc/marid)
Preface: After I read Walters Guide to the Magus and STR Ranger's Hexcrafter Guide, I really wanted to make one. It'll be my first time playing Pathfinder Society games though so I'm a little worried.
Tiefling
+2 Int, +2 Dex, -2 Cha
Fiendish Resistance (5 resist, cold, fire, electricity)
Vestigal wings (instead of skilled), +4 fly
1d6 Bite (instead of darkness SLA)
Prehensile Tail (instead of fiendish sorcery)
Darkvision (60)
Traits: Magical Lineage (shocking grasp), Wayang Spellhunter (Frostbite)
20pt buy
STR 8 DEX 16(+2) CON 14 WIS 13 INT 19(+2) CHA 5(-2)
Feats
1 Magus1 Arcane Pool, Spell Combat, Cantrips, Feat - Weapon Finesse
2 M2 Spellstrike
3 Sorcerer1 Crossblooded/Tattooed Orc/Marid, Tattoo Familiar (Compsognathus), Mage Tattoo (Evocation), Feat - Intensify Spell
4 M3 Arcana - Arcane Accuracy , +1 INT
5 M4 Hex- Evil Eye, Feat - Sickening Spell
6 M5 Bonus Feat - Flight Hex
7 M6 Arcana- Prehensile Hair Hex, Feat - Extra Arcana (Slumber)
8 M7 Knowledge Pool, Medium Armor, +1 WIS
9 M8 Improved Spell Combat, Feat - Enforcer
10 M9 Greater Spell Combat, Arcana - Hasted Assault
11 M10 Fighter Training, Feat - Extra Arcana (Misfortune)
12 M11 Spell Recall, Bonus Feat - Multiattack (Or combat reflexes), +1 CHA
Main spells: Brand, Shocking Grasp, Frostbite, Fireball, Monstrous Physique
From the Sorc dip, I get +30ft darkvision, light sensitivity (?), Alertness, +4 initiative, +1 caster level for evocation spells, +1 damage/die, and I can change any of my energy spell to cold, a really low level familiar who will probably spend most of his time as a tattoo.
I'll pick up one (or two) Lesser rods of Rime and entangle at least once every fight. I'll hold on to it with my tail. With Sickened frostbite, I can potentially leave opponents Sickened, Fatigued, Entangled, and Shaken. I should be able to make all my Weapon attacks + hair and bite, or if I use monstrous physique I can pick up a lot more (multiattack makes them all at Full BAB -2). Between Shocking Grasp and an agile, keen rapier, my damage should be reasonable while Rime ensures good crowd control and debuffing.
But I have some questions
Regarding PFS legality, is multiattack legal? Can I use Crossblooded and Tattooed archetypes together? Is there anything else I've done wrong?
Can Monkey Familiars use wands (with reasonable success)? Either way, if my familiar is carrying something and it turns back into a tattoo, does the thing it's carrying go with it? Is there a way to my familiar to carry my stuff for me (that is, can I give it a handy haversack and/or muleback cords). Do I keep alertness when my familiar is in tattoo form?
What would be good gear recommendations? Obviously my stat gear is Int then Dex, but is there any thing else? Robe of Runes looked good but I don't know if I can afford that by level 12 (with everything else I need).
If I have darkvision before I get the orc bloodline, do I still get light sensitivity?
Someone posted this in a thread a long time ago but never really got an answer. Since Prehensile Hair uses Int for str checks, my medium/heavy load is quite high. Could I use it to carry my party while flying?
How many glaring weaknesses does this have? I know a low str and cha is going to be problematic at times (I'm thinking of adventuring naked until I get my handy haversack to avoid encumberance) but am I underestimating it?
Any other suggestions?
| Bigtuna |
1) Ask your GM if you can use natural attacks with spell combat.
This isn't a given. In fact it depends on how you read weapon finesse. If you and your GM thinks what is written under "special" (natural weapons counts as light weapons) - is a generel rule, then go head. You can use natural attacks with spell combate.
IMHO - you can't. But you could use all you natural attacks when not using spell combat.
2) The debuff with rime, sickend, fatigued sounds great. How do you get shakened?
3) Hasted Assault - make sure to check with your GM. By RAW you don't get an extra attack while using spellcombat while hasted - but it seems obvious that it was meant to work..
| Sensten |
1) Ask your GM if you can use natural attacks with spell combat.
This isn't a given. In fact it depends on how you read weapon finesse. If you and your GM thinks what is written under "special" (natural weapons counts as light weapons) - is a generel rule, then go head. You can use natural attacks with spell combate.
IMHO - you can't. But you could use all you natural attacks when not using spell combat.2) The debuff with rime, sickend, fatigued sounds great. How do you get shakened?
3) Hasted Assault - make sure to check with your GM. By RAW you don't get an extra attack while using spellcombat while hasted - but it seems obvious that it was meant to work..
1. Interesting, thanks for the heads up
2. Enforcer. Frostbite does non-lethal damage. Enforcer gives a free Intimidate check
3. Wait, what? Is it that Haste doesn't work with Spell Combat or Hasted Assault? Why wouldn't it?
Thanks for your reply :D
| Stome |
Look into improved unarmed strike + Hex strike with Feral combat training. Feat heavy yes but you can now deliver hexes with your attack.
As for using spellcombat with NA that is indeed a murky area. Not sure the PFS ruling there. Though feral combat might even help here. It says "as well as effects that augment an unarmed strike". Now unarmed strikes are always considered a weapon. So would spellstrike be an effect that augments unarmed strike?
Again murky area. One that is much more murky then it needs to be in fact. Some cleaner writing and more exact rules (NA being weapons really needs to be flat out stated in more then just weapon finesse)
| Sensten |
Look into improved unarmed strike + Hex strike with Feral combat training. Feat heavy yes but you can now deliver hexes with your attack.
As for using spellcombat with NA that is indeed a murky area. Not sure the PFS ruling there. Though feral combat might even help here. It says "as well as effects that augment an unarmed strike". Now unarmed strikes are always considered a weapon. So would spellstrike be an effect that augments unarmed strike?
Again murky area. One that is much more murky then it needs to be in fact. Some cleaner writing and more exact rules (NA being weapons really needs to be flat out stated in more then just weapon finesse)
Ah, murky areas make me sad. The murky area that is stealth is why I've turned my back on my favorite type of character for this PFS jaunt. Whatever happened with that playtest they ran for new stealth rules? I liked those.
| STR Ranger |
HAIR builds are great. They are Mathawei Ap Niall's contribution to the guide but for PFS I would stick with something that doesn't operate in a grey area.
I also think maybe you are trying to accomplish too much.
Your build takes a sorc level for blaster damage, then spends most of its feat and arcanas on a Debuff Hair build.
I'd pick one or the other.
For simplicity sake go with the blaster since that is straightforward and should cause any rules headaches.
I'd also learn grab Rime Spell (instead of Sickening use a rod later), And enforcer by level 3. A Rime Frostbite that shakes an enemy is a -5 to attack, -2 saves, -1AC and 1/2 movement. Coupled with the bonus damage that is HUGE at low levels and still a damn good deal later.
The increased value is it compensates for being in light armor.
I would dump Finesse but I made my point on why I hate dex builds in the guide. Chain shirt, 14 Dex and Shield spell is decent armor at low levels. They aren't likely to hit anything once sucking a -5 to hit from a rime, shaken frostbite.
Mathwei ap Niall
|
Hexcrafter Magus w/ 1 lvl Sorcerer dip (tattoo sorcerer/crossblooded - orc/marid)
Preface: After I read Walters Guide to the Magus and STR Ranger's Hexcrafter Guide, I really wanted to make one. It'll be my first time playing Pathfinder Society games though so I'm a little worried.
Tiefling
+2 Int, +2 Dex, -2 ChaFiendish Resistance (5 resist, cold, fire, electricity)
Vestigal wings (instead of skilled), +4 fly
1d6 Bite (instead of darkness SLA)
Prehensile Tail (instead of fiendish sorcery)
Darkvision (60)Traits: Magical Lineage (shocking grasp), Wayang Spellhunter (Frostbite)
20pt buy
STR 8 DEX 16(+2) CON 14 WIS 13 INT 19(+2) CHA 5(-2)
Feats
1 Magus1 Arcane Pool, Spell Combat, Cantrips, Feat - Weapon Finesse
2 M2 Spellstrike
3 Sorcerer1 Crossblooded/Tattooed Orc/Marid, Tattoo Familiar (Compsognathus), Mage Tattoo (Evocation), Feat - Intensify Spell
4 M3 Arcana - Arcane Accuracy , +1 INT
5 M4 Hex- Evil Eye, Feat - Sickening Spell
6 M5 Bonus Feat - Flight Hex
7 M6 Arcana- Prehensile Hair Hex, Feat - Extra Arcana (Slumber)
8 M7 Knowledge Pool, Medium Armor, +1 WIS
9 M8 Improved Spell Combat, Feat - Enforcer
10 M9 Greater Spell Combat, Arcana - Hasted Assault
11 M10 Fighter Training, Feat - Extra Arcana (Misfortune)
12 M11 Spell Recall, Bonus Feat - Multiattack (Or combat reflexes), +1 CHAMain spells: Brand, Shocking Grasp, Frostbite, Fireball, Monstrous Physique
From the Sorc dip, I get +30ft darkvision, light sensitivity (?), Alertness, +4 initiative, +1 caster level for evocation spells, +1 damage/die, and I can change any of my energy spell to cold, a really low level familiar who will probably spend most of his time as a tattoo.
I'll pick up one (or two) Lesser rods of Rime and entangle at least once every fight. I'll hold on to it with my tail. With Sickened frostbite, I can potentially leave opponents Sickened, Fatigued, Entangled, and Shaken. I should be able to...
Well lets address your build errors first:
Your tail will allow you to hold a rod but not use it, the tail doesn't function as a hand so can't wield/manipulate an item like a rod. You'll need to switch it to your real hand (which prevents you from casting since both hands would be full) or switch it to your hair and cast.
1. Multiattack, no it's not a legal choice in PFS for you (some other classes CAN get it but the magus/sorceror cannot).
2. Monkey familiars cannot use wands or any command activated items. Only specific improved familiars can do that (imps, brownies, lyrakiens, etc.)
3. Hair for carrying, yes you can use your hair to carry things while flying, just keep track of time spent while doing it.
Now for recommendations for PFS, I will HIGHLY recommend against dex builds. Since you will have such a restricted list of feats/abilities you can use and a much lower level cap you will quickly regret a dex build for PFS. Stay with Int-> Str builds and decide if you want to blast or debuff. Blasting is the sub-optimal choice but can work if you focus on it enough.
Also, there is no real doubt on using spellcombat with natural weapons, it does work and only the most grasping reaching idea could ever make it not work.
But haste and hasted assault definitely do not work with spell combat which is annoying as all get out. Fortunately the defiler builds all focus on charged spells so it only affects them one out of every 3/4 rounds.
| Sensten |
HAIR builds are great. They are Mathawei Ap Niall's contribution to the guide but for PFS I would stick with something that doesn't operate in a grey area.
I also think maybe you are trying to accomplish too much.
Your build takes a sorc level for blaster damage, then spends most of its feat and arcanas on a Debuff Hair build.I'd pick one or the other.
For simplicity sake go with the blaster since that is straightforward and should cause any rules headaches.
I'd also learn grab Rime Spell (instead of Sickening use a rod later), And enforcer by level 3. A Rime Frostbite that shakes an enemy is a -5 to attack, -2 saves, -1AC and 1/2 movement. Coupled with the bonus damage that is HUGE at low levels and still a damn good deal later.
The increased value is it compensates for being in light armor.I would dump Finesse but I made my point on why I hate dex builds in the guide. Chain shirt, 14 Dex and Shield spell is decent armor at low levels. They aren't likely to hit anything once sucking a -5 to hit from a rime, shaken frostbite.
Thanks for the reply. When both the author's of the hexcrafter guide pop in to comment on your hexcrafter, that can only make it better.
I have a couple of questions/clarifications.
First, my reasoning on dex is that it does a lot more than just AC: it add to reflex saves, ranged attack rolls, AOOs, and initiative. With one feat and a +1 weapon mod, it also does melee hit/damage. I'm not convinced that that's not amazing.
Second, my level in sorc isn't just for more damage. Since Marid allows me to change any spells damage to cold, I can entangle with any spell with a Rime Rod at no increased spell slot (entangle fireball, frostbite, shocking grasp, etc). Rime rods are pretty cheap too. That said, I thought rods worked just by holding them, I didn't realize they needed a hand to work. I could still pass it from tail to hair and back, but that could end up being cumbersome.
That said, I'm definitely going to take another look at your guide and my build. It seems like I've made a number of rookie errors, especially where PFS is concerned
| Sensten |
Thanks for your reply :D
Well lets address your build errors first:Your tail will allow you to hold a rod but not use it, the tail doesn't function as a hand so can't wield/manipulate an item like a rod. You'll need to switch it to your real hand (which prevents you from casting since both hands would be full) or switch it to your hair and cast.
I did not realize that :( My bad
1. Multiattack, no it's not a legal choice in PFS for you (some other classes CAN get it but the magus/sorceror cannot).
I just learned this in another thread :(
Now for recommendations for PFS, I will HIGHLY recommend against dex builds. Since you will have such a restricted list of feats/abilities you can use and a much lower level cap you will quickly regret a dex build for PFS. Stay with Int-> Str builds and decide if you want to blast or debuff. Blasting is the sub-optimal choice but can work if you focus on it enough.Also, there is no real doubt on using spellcombat with natural weapons, it does work and only the most grasping reaching idea could ever make it not work.
But haste and hasted assault definitely do not work with spell combat which is annoying as all get out. Fortunately the defiler builds all focus on charged spells so it only affects them one out of every 3/4 rounds.
I responded to some of these points with STR Ranger's post above, but in short: sorc dip + rime rod lets me blast and debuff simultaneously (unless I'm completely wrong, which is possible)
As I said to STR Ranger, I'm going to reexamine my build and your guide, so thank you for your help
| Bigtuna |
1) haste vs Spell combat - bad wording of spell combat - haste works on a full attack only, spell combat is a full-round action (but I haven't meet a Gm who didn't ignore the wording an allow it.
2) Enforcer - that's pretty cool. the magus has a lot of non-lethal damage spell. But Intimidate... It's
a class skill (+3) but cha is your dump stat (-3) so you have d20+skills.
Vs a "The DC of this check is equal to 10 + the target’s Hit Dice + the target’s Wisdom modifier." A bit below 50/50 chance...
And Enforcer says "Whenever you deal nonlethal damage with a melee weapon" some would argue you don't deal non-lethal with your weapon but with your spell, the weapon id just the means of delivery (you do it with the pointy end instead of just the fingertips)...
- Damn I want this to work... I'll have to think about this...
Mathwei ap Niall
|
1) haste vs Spell combat - bad wording of spell combat - haste works on a full attack only, spell combat is a full-round action (but I haven't meet a Gm who didn't ignore the wording an allow it.
2) Enforcer - that's pretty cool. the magus has a lot of non-lethal damage spell. But Intimidate... It's
a class skill (+3) but cha is your dump stat (-3) so you have d20+skills.
Vs a "The DC of this check is equal to 10 + the target’s Hit Dice + the target’s Wisdom modifier." A bit below 50/50 chance...
And Enforcer says "Whenever you deal nonlethal damage with a melee weapon" some would argue you don't deal non-lethal with your weapon but with your spell, the weapon id just the means of delivery (you do it with the pointy end instead of just the fingertips)...- Damn I want this to work... I'll have to think about this...
It does work but you're looking at the wrong feat. Don't take enforcer take Cornugon Smash instead. This only requires you to hit the target with a power attack and doesn't care what weapon or spell you use. It also opens you up for taking intimidating prowess and any of a half dozen other bonuses you can add to your intimidate skill to guarantee a successful check every time. This is why Int/Str builds are the preferred route. Slightly slower at the beginning but by 5th-6th level you are consistently doing more damage and more effects then a dex build ever can.
The only thing a dex build beats a str build on is reflex saves and the occasional extra AoO (but those really don't happen often, how many times have you ever seen more than 2 opportunities for an AoO in a given round?)