Oh, and another thing about Forgotten Trick: if you don't take Combat Trick as one of your permanent choices, you can use Forgotten Trick to gain any Combat Feat whose prereq you meet, for <level> rounds. Too bad they expressly forbade Rogue Talents.
This is legal, or are we all mistaken...at level 3 with forgotten trick as ninja, with two weapon fighting, and weapon finesse I could pop weapon focus for 3 rounds...or a quick dip into say improved initive...example...
so the dm says roll perception...and I detect a group of mobs around us..swift action forgoten trick..improved inititive, after intitive is determined and on my turn as swift action gain agile maneuvers, or even weapon focus....
This changes the game big time if its true...wish I had known this from the begining it would have changed how I have played bigtime....
It costs a lot of ki, and ninja is hardly the only one with a "pull a feat out of my ***" ability. War Domain cleric gets a similar ability, albeit at level 8. And the Paragon Surge spell allows the gaining of ANY feat, not just combat. And can be abused to give oracles and sorcerors instant spells known via Expanded Arcana feat.
So, not that crazy in the grand scheme of things. And it means not taking Combat Trick...that's kind of painful...
That's 2 Ki + However many it takes to use that Trick normally, and Ki pools are pretty slim, Jim.
Seems okay to me.
Rynjin wrote: That's 2 Ki + However many it takes to use that Trick normally, and Ki pools are pretty slim, Jim.
Seems okay to me.
for the feats its 2 ki for ninja level of rounds,no additional charge..so I could do so 2x in a day ,using this ability costs no more than 2 ki. Went through the combat feats I qualify for and wow...nearly 28 feats...
Str 10 dex 18 con 12 int 17 9 wis cha 16 with just 4ki
I can use nearly 28 different feats...
from improved init, weapon focus, dodge +1 ac, theoritically I can make my initive +8, then focus for +1hit and +1 damage...this is huge at low levels since only level 3 ....how does this work and can it stack...
lets look at my load out
weapon dual wakazachi bab 2 +4 dex finesse +1 focus -2 dual wield, for a +5hit +1 damage
Both attacks get +5/3 too hit +1 damage
So standard sneak would be 1d6 +5hit +1 dam, + 2d6 +5hit +1 damage
off hand would do 1d6 +3hit +1 dam + 2d6 *+3 hit +1 damage correct
if wrong in math please say so...if math is correct I could attack again using ki full attack bab...
if i use ki ability too attack again, do I get full attack action, or 1 attack..ie 2more attacks or 1 how many attacks to I get at level 3 +ki attack... bonuses and negatives greatly appreciated....
no expenditure of ki...lo initive drops by 4...no use of ki too
At higher level a ring of ki mastery would cut your cost to 1 ki a use so keep that in mind. Though you have to keep 2 ki in the ring for that to work.
garvdart wrote: if wrong in math please say so...if math is correct I could attack again using ki full attack bab... Your math is a bit off.
First, Weapon Focus only increases attack, not damage. Second, the penalty for two-weapon fighting with the feat and light weapons (such as wakizashis) is -2 to each attack, not -2 on the main hand and -4 on the off. I'm also not sure what you mean by separating out your Sneak Attack and regular weapon damage. Anyway, your attack routine would be:
Main Hand Wakizashi +5 (1d6 damage), Off-hand Wakizashi +5 (1d6 damage).
If you are in a situation to sneak Attack, you would add +2d6 damage to each of those hits. If you used a ki point, you could make one more attack with a wakizashi (not both) at the same to-hit and damage. Honestly, that is a much better bet than using your ki to get Weapon Focus (and by extension +1 to attack) for two rounds. Forgotten Trick is okay, but at such low level 2 ki points is just too huge a cost.
Perfectly legal use of Forgotten Trick. Even better, if you have the ki, you can get chains of feats over the course of a few rounds; for example a style feat and its follow-up feat (getting Style Master and Combat Trick with the Forgotten Trick).
thank you for the suggestions, but i consulted with my gm and no I cant use this trick like this...wish i could but he is letting me replace ki charge for forgotten trick,
my gm says no
i thought about that, feat improved initive...+weapon focus...for me would +8 initive, and +1hit and +1 dam
but i also see how broken that would be....feat run anyone............
Not broken at all.
Adaptability doesn't break the game. Even with an infinite amount of Ki and no other Talents but Forgotten Trick, that ninja is never going to be operating outside the expectations of the class at their particular level. They aren't doing tons of damage, they aren't impossible to hurt. They're just able to alter their mechanics slightly to deal with a particular problem at a rate of one feat per round.
By the time they'll have perfectly tailored themselves to a particular challenge, it'll be over, or the situation will have changed in ways they didn't see coming and they'll have to change feats out again.
And they *still* wouldn't have the versatility of a Sorcerer with Shadow Conjuration.
thanks i will see if i can get my dm around too allowing it...i love this ability and utility, being able too nab agile manuevers for a couple of rounds would be great..since I seem too be the meatshield although we gained a barbarian recently so we shall see...
Also please note you don't get a +1 to Weapon Damage with Weapon Focus. It only affects attack rolls.
mort the cleverly named, thanks for the clearfication, thats a huge boost too what I thought was the mechanic...still new too pathfinder so fuzzy on how certain mechanics work...as I posted before I believe I can talk my dm into it by, justifying my training and backstory, especially since we started at level one but she recieved nearly 60 years of training...elf..and also yes it is like I gain two levels for all of just 3 rounds....and its also within spell lists for multiple classes....stream of the sky War Domain cleric gets a similar ability, albeit at level 8. And the Paragon Surge spell allows the gaining of ANY feat, not just combat. And can be abused to give oracles and sorcerors instant spells known via Expanded Arcana feat.
Thank you all for your observations..and input....my conclusion would be of course sitiuational but will allow me too be a better rogue aka ninja.....and really help me contribute more too our group...improved initive, agile man, and ki extra attack just became even more benefical....even If I can only do so for 3-6 rounds...
Sorry for spelling, but well drinking and thinking...not the best combintation....
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