Venture-Captain, Ireland—Belfast
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Oh, one last question...Will the Angel-blooded still be considered Aasimar? I wanted the the ability to True Speaker racial trait.
Hi
As far as I remember Angel Blooded is fine. The way to find out is to check the official Additional Resources info:
http://paizo.com/pathfinderSociety/about/additionalResources
Pathfinder Player Companion: Blood of Angels
Bloodlines: martyred bloodline is legal for Pathfinder Society but the bonus feat Leadership remains unavailable; Heritages: all heritages, and associated traits, on pages 21–23 are legal; Feats: all feats on pages 24–25 are legal except Supernal Feast; Magic: bard masterpieces are legal; Other: variant assimar abilities are not legal for Pathfinder Society; Oracle Curses on page 26 are legal; Inquisitons on pages 26–27 are legal; Subdomains: all subdomains on page 27 are legal; Traits: all traits on pages 30–31 are legal except ethical leader. Clergy member is useable once per scenario instead of once per week. Faith healer may be used for Day Job checks.
Pathfinder Player Companion: Blood of Angels has the Angel-Blooded (Angelkin) on page 21. So it looks like it is still legal.
As for True Speaker which is an alternate racial trait from the the ARG:
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Advanced Player's Guide:Aasimars: all alternate racial traits, favored class options, racial archetypes, racial equipment, feats, magic items, and spells are legal for play.
So as far as I can see you are good to go!
W
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Alright, I found something else I wanted to ask, If I took the Social Trait adopted ( half -Elf ) can I get the the Ancestral Arms Alternate Racial Trait from Advanced Racial Guide? I am sorry to be a bother you all, thanks for helping me so far.
Nope, sorry Des. Ancestral Arms is a racial trait and adopted only allows you to take a half elf race trait. While similar in name they are actually completely different things.
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Alright, I found something else I wanted to ask, If I took the Social Trait adopted ( half -Elf ) can I get the the Ancestral Arms Alternate Racial Trait from Advanced Racial Guide? I am sorry to be a bother you all, thanks for helping me so far.Nope, sorry Des. Ancestral Arms is a racial trait and adopted only allows you to take a half elf race trait. While similar in name they are actually completely different things.
Jeffrey Fox is correct.
You may take a RACE trait with adopted. You may not take a RACIAL trait. So taking something like bity (half-orc) is okay, but taking Acenstral Arms is a no-no.
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Venture-Captain, Ireland—Belfast
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Oh, one last question...Will the Angel-blooded still be considered Aasimar? I wanted the the ability to True Speaker racial trait.The problem is true speaker replaces skilled so if alternate racial traits work like archtypes it would not be legal with any alternate Aasimars
Now I am definitely no expert but does the fact that the heritage aasimar has two different skills than the standard "model" mean that it cannot be swapped?
For that matter as I am bit hazy on the rules here, (and I know this is not just for PFS only, but as I am here already)
Using say angel-blooded as an example....
The Racial Traits listed for the standard Aasimar are
Ability Mods
Size
Speed
Vision
Skilled
Spell Llike Ability
Celestial Resistance
Languages
Blood of Angels just specifies that the new ability mods, spell like abilities and skill modifiers replace the racial traits. (it also added 2 race (rather than racial) traits)
Is the idea that the heritage aasimar loses just the three things listed or some or all of the other standard racial traits?
W
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Now I am definitely no expert but does the fact that the heritage aasimar has two different skills than the standard "model" mean that it cannot be swapped?Oh, one last question...Will the Angel-blooded still be considered Aasimar? I wanted the the ability to True Speaker racial trait.The problem is true speaker replaces skilled so if alternate racial traits work like archtypes it would not be legal with any alternate Aasimars
If Alternate racial traits work like archtypes then you cannot replace anything already replaced. And here's the line confirming that they work like archtypes (meaning no alternate aasimar/tiefling can have anything that replaces skilled or the spell like)
You can exchange one or several of your character's normal racial traits, but of course you cannot exchange the same racial trait more then once.
For that matter as I am bit hazy on the rules here, (and I know this is not just for PFS only, but as I am here already)
Using say angel-blooded as an example....
The Racial Traits listed for the standard Aasimar are
Ability Mods
Size
Speed
Vision
Skilled
Spell Llike Ability
Celestial Resistance
LanguagesBlood of Angels just specifies that the new ability mods, spell like abilities and skill modifiers replace the racial traits. (it also added 2 race (rather than racial) traits)
Is the idea that the heritage aasimar loses just the three things listed or some or all of the other standard racial traits?
W
Alternate Aasimar only replace ability mods, spell like ability and skilled as far as I am aware (I do not have blood of angels, but I have blood of fiends, and this is what the alternate tieflings replace.)
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Venture-Captain, Ireland—Belfast
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Dylos.
Thanks for that. The bit about changing a trait twice sites the example of an elf taking fleet foot being not being able to the take urbanite as both replaced the same std trait: keen senses.
I would not have read that to mean that the choice of skills mentioned in a 'skilled' trait counted as a separate trait every time. If though this is widely accept interpretation I can live with it.
Thanks again
W
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Dylos.
Thanks for that. The bit about changing a trait twice sites the example of an elf taking fleet foot being not being able to the take urbanite as both replaced the same std trait: keen senses.
I would not have read that to mean that the choice of skills mentioned in a 'skilled' trait counted as a separate trait every time. If though this is widely accept interpretation I can live with it.
Thanks again
W
It's a strict interpretation of the rule, but it is rules as written, it may be intended that you can replace an alternate aasimar's skilled or spell like with an alternate racial, but I do not know of any rules as written that support it and it is rules as written that matter in PFS, so unless someone at Paizo says otherwise rules as written says that the same racial trait cannot be replaced twice.
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Venture-Captain, Ireland—Belfast
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I see your point but given the fact that the rules as written actually include context in the following sentence (all this on pg. 9 I think) it gives me pause for thought. The reason given in the example as to why it cannot be done is because the 2nd trait (urbanite) also replaces Keen Senses... In the case of swapping the heritage version of "Skiled", there is no "also" here, it is "instead of"
I would also focus on the wording. ...."you cannot exchange the same racial trait twice".
Adopting a heritage when creating a character could in light of the context the next sentence gives, be interpreted as a separate action to an exchange of traits as per the rules on pg 9.
As I say though if a consensus already exists then c'est la vie but i think the idea is to stop the same racial trait being swapped for two different traits not to stop someone witha heritage PC customising it with one swap.
Thanks
W
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| 3 people marked this as FAQ candidate. Answered in the FAQ. 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
It's a strict interpretation of the rule, but it is rules as written, it may be intended that you can replace an alternate aasimar's skilled or spell like with an alternate racial, but I do not know of any rules as written that support it and it is rules as written that matter in PFS, so unless someone at Paizo says otherwise rules as written says that the same racial trait cannot be replaced twice.Dylos.
Thanks for that. The bit about changing a trait twice sites the example of an elf taking fleet foot being not being able to the take urbanite as both replaced the same std trait: keen senses.
I would not have read that to mean that the choice of skills mentioned in a 'skilled' trait counted as a separate trait every time. If though this is widely accept interpretation I can live with it.
Thanks again
W
I'm sorry, but in my opinion, you are wrong. I have Blood of Angels in front of me and there is nothing in the Heritages that changes the Racial Trait from being the Skilled Trait. It changes what that Trait does for the character. Skilled is a trait that exists for multiple races and it means something different to each race. Also they provide an example of what they mean in the ARG that specifically makes it clear that they mean that you can't get two alternative traits for the same trait. Therefore if you use what we have for RAW and apply the GM Common Sense rule, it becomes clear to me that Alternative Heritages can still use the alternative Traits from ARG that exchange the Skilled Trait for other items, I would apply the same to those that replace the spell-like ability.
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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@graywulfe, heretic, and Dylos:
Remember that the rules for archetypes say "none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the core class". The rule for alternate racial traits that heretic referenced only talks about actually exchanging, not altering. A musetouched aasimar still has the Skilled racial trait, it's just been modified; and nowhere in the race rules does it prohibit swapping out a racial trait that's been modified.
Heretic has made the (very common and understandable) error of seeing something that closely resembles something else, and then assuming that the former is identical to the latter when it's actually not.
To sum up:
• There is no rule saying a modified racial trait can't still be swapped out.
• There is no text stating that racial traits work like archetypes.
• Racial traits and archetypes do not share equivalent text on how they work.
• Therefore, there is no connection between racial rules and archetypes. The rules for races work as written.
A character can swap out the Skilled trait regardless of what their heritage says that trait does.
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@graywulfe, heretic, and Dylos:
Remember that the rules for archetypes say "none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the core class". The rule for alternate racial traits that heretic referenced only talks about actually exchanging, not altering. A musetouched aasimar still has the Skilled racial trait, it's just been modified; and nowhere in the race rules does it prohibit swapping out a racial trait that's been modified.Heretic has made the (very common and understandable) error of seeing something that closely resembles something else, and then assuming that the former is identical to the latter when it's actually not.
To sum up:
• There is no rule saying a modified racial trait can't still be swapped out.
• There is no text stating that racial traits work like archetypes.
• Racial traits and archetypes do not share equivalent text on how they work.
• Therefore, there is no connection between racial rules and archetypes. The rules for races work as written.A character can swap out the Skilled trait regardless of what their heritage says that trait does.
Thank you for saying what I was trying to say, much better.
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Venture-Captain, Ireland—Belfast
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@graywulfe, heretic, and Dylos:
Remember that the rules for archetypes say "none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the core class". The rule for alternate racial traits that heretic referenced only talks about actually exchanging, not altering. A musetouched aasimar still has the Skilled racial trait, it's just been modified; and nowhere in the race rules does it prohibit swapping out a racial trait that's been modified.Heretic has made the (very common and understandable) error of seeing something that closely resembles something else, and then assuming that the former is identical to the latter when it's actually not.
To sum up:
• There is no rule saying a modified racial trait can't still be swapped out.
• There is no text stating that racial traits work like archetypes.
• Racial traits and archetypes do not share equivalent text on how they work.
• Therefore, there is no connection between racial rules and archetypes. The rules for races work as written.A character can swap out the Skilled trait regardless of what their heritage says that trait does.
Umm. Jiggy, Just checking......I actually agree with what you are saying. Am I missing something? Was the thing that closely resembles something you refer to the rules on Archetypes? If so I suspect I might not be the droid you're looking for?
W
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Venture-Captain, Ireland—Belfast
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I may have mis-followed the quote tunnel. :/
Cool. Just as long as I am not more bewildered than usual!
The problem I think stems from the fact the heritage chapter simply states that racial traits are replaced by the data on the following pages. Taken literally that means that you would delete all the std racial traits and only have what the heritage offers. Thanks for putting the case for allowing swapping so succinctly.
I wonder if this convinces those who didn't agree in the first place ;-)
Thanks
W
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For PFS you have only 20 pts for your abilities. Does taking the aasimar race deduct points from those?
Quick question to help track down where this question is coming from...
Why do you think playing an Aasimar would reduce the point allocation for abilities?
Edit: To answer your question... No, though I still would love to know the answer to my question above.
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Because Aasimars, start with a +2 advantage. Every other race has +2/+2/-2, where Aasimar have only +2/+2 and no -2. Thus they are 'better' than all other PCs who have to give lose 2 points in some ability.
To answer Drakkurtok, Aasimars are just a superior species to humans, elves, orcs or anyone else for that matter. (I'm jesting here but with a bit of truth.)
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Aasimar and tieflings themselves aren't the problems so much as the plethora of variants approaching "pick the mental and physical stat you want". Instead of just making uber clerics, the variant races turn them into uber EVERYTHING with the floating stat boosts of a human along with darkvision and a few other goodies.
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Which is why 80% of all new characters I've seen in PFS are now either Aasimar or Tieflings.I've seen 1 aasimar. A few more teiflings, but still mostly humans...
You might have seen my human. (Scion of Humanity) and I wouldn't tell you I'm an Aasimar at the game table. I role play my Aasimar as one who doesn't want to be revealed as an Aasimar. Others role-play them as ones who don't even know that they are.
So, are you sure that 'human' going along with you, was a 'human'? :D GL
