To find if an object has magic properties and what kind of them I should use detect magic, spellcraft skill check, or both? What happens in the case of finding the spell being cast?
Detect magic will tell you if it is magic. Detect and spellcraft are both use to identify the properties of a magical item. If a spell is being cast you only need spellcraft. If that fails sometimes you can use knowledge arcana, but the DC will be a little higher.
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Question 1: (CRB p106) In order to identify magic properties on a magic item you need to cast Detect Magic and then make a spellcraft check with a DC of 15+item caster level.
Question 2: To identify a spell being cast: Make a spellcraft check (no detect magic required).
Bonus Question 3: To identify an in place magic effect (such as a Wall of Fire) make a Knowledge Arcana check.
Bonus Question 4: To identify a magic aura while using Detect Magic make a Knowledge Arcana check.
(Yes, Spellcraft and Knowledge arcana overlap in some ways. Some people, myself included, think this needs fixing.)
- Gauss
Question 1: (CRB p106) In order to identify magic properties on a magic item you need to cast Detect Magic and then make a spellcraft check with a DC of 15+item caster level.
Question 2: To identify a spell being cast: Make a spellcraft check (no detect magic required).
Bonus Question 3: To identify an in place magic effect (such as a Wall of Fire) make a Knowledge Arcana check.
Bonus Question 4: To identify a magic aura while using Detect Magic make a Knowledge Arcana check.
(Yes, Spellcraft and Knowledge arcana overlap in some ways. Some people, myself included, think this needs fixing.)
- Gauss
I don't know, Gauss. It seems to be pretty consistent.
Spellcraft check for Magical Items (Items - Craft) and a spell being cast ("Crafting" a spell - Craft).Knowledge Arcana to identify active magic. Active Wall of Fire, or an active emanating aura.
Question 1: (CRB p106) In order to identify magic properties on a magic item you need to cast Detect Magic and then make a spellcraft check with a DC of 15+item caster level.
Question 2: To identify a spell being cast: Make a spellcraft check (no detect magic required).
Bonus Question 3: To identify an in place magic effect (such as a Wall of Fire) make a Knowledge Arcana check.
Bonus Question 4: To identify a magic aura while using Detect Magic make a Knowledge Arcana check.
(Yes, Spellcraft and Knowledge arcana overlap in some ways. Some people, myself included, think this needs fixing.)
- Gauss
I don't know, Gauss. It seems to be pretty consistent.
Spellcraft check for Magical Items (Items - Craft) and a spell being cast ("Crafting" a spell - Craft).
Knowledge Arcana to identify active magic. Active Wall of Fire, or an active emanating aura.
"Identify a spell effect that is in place" is what it says. By saying magic it would include supernatural affects, but spells are not supernatural. I also wish they would have specified visible magical effects. By the current wording the alarm spell can be identified even though you there are no visible indicators as to which spell the aura is coming from. The fact that both can identify spells does show overlap, which is what Guass was pointing out.
Your use of the word craft has nothing to do with spells being crafted. The skill is in no way related to the "craft" skills. Crafting a spell if there were such a skill would be more akin to creating a new spell, not just performing magic which can be done without spells or SLA's.
Wraithstrike explained my point perfectly despite misidentifying who said it. (Man, I really need to get rid of Guass, he is annoying me by taking the credit for things I say.)
My group has discussed merging Spellcraft into Knowledge Arcana. We are still on the fence about it.
- Gauss
"Identify a spell effect that is in place" is what it says. By saying magic it would include supernatural affects, but spells are not supernatural. I also wish they would have specified visible magical effects. By the current wording the alarm spell can be identified even though you there are no visible indicators as to which spell the aura is coming from. The fact that both can identify spells does show overlap, which is what Guass was pointing out.
Your use of the word craft has nothing to do with spells being crafted. The skill is in no way related to the "craft" skills. Crafting a spell if there were such a skill would be more akin to creating a new spell, not just performing magic which can be done without spells or SLA's.
I apologize for the miscommunication. My use of the word "Craft" was only an attempt to make an easy determination on when to use a Spellcraft check, and when to use a Knowledge(Arcana) check. It was not at all intended to seem like it was related to Craft skills, as Craft (Spells) is not listed as a Craft skill.
The only way Spellcraft is related to any craft is in the case of magic items, as you need the Craft skill or Craft Feat in order to create weapons, armor, potions, wands, etc.If the aura emanates from a magic item, you can attempt to identify its properties (see Spellcraft).
Now, for while a spell is being cast, I was going for the fact that the spell effect has not been created yet (or "crafted"), so use a Spellcraft check in order to determine the spell being cast. Again, just trying to determine a simple means for folks to say "Hey, I know to use Spellcraft here, and not Knowledge(Arcana)."
Now, within the Detect Magic entry, Knowledge(Arcana) is only mentioned once.3rd Round: The strength and location of each aura. If the items or creatures bearing the auras are in line of sight, you can make Knowledge(Arcana) skill check to determine the school of magic involved in each.
This says to me, "Hey, I sense an active magical aura. I want to use Knowledge(Arcana) to find out what school of magic that is involved with this aura."
No where within Detect Magic or the description for Knowledge(Arcana) does it say that either will determine a specific spell. For this discussion, only Spellcraft can do that, and it must be identified as one of the properties of a magical item, or identifying what spell a caster is casting before the spell is complete.
so whenever I cast detect magic I have roll a spellcraft check?
Only if you are trying to find identity the properties of a magic item. If you are trying to identify a spell as it is being cast then you only need to make a spellcraft check.
Detect magic duration is 1 min/caster level and it takes 3 round to get all the info it provides. So if not interrupted I only have to cast it once to get its full effect, right?
Right.
Yes detect magic takes 3 rounds to get all of the info that it can give, but if the target moves, assuming it can, out of the 60 foot cone you have to start all over again.
Great answers! Thanks everybody.
Could I theoretically use detect magic to detect if somebody is using an invincibility spell to hide from me?
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Could I theoretically use detect magic to detect if somebody is using an invincibility spell to hide from me?
Invisibility? Yes. Take careful note of what information you get in each of 3 rounds. If the invisible person stays in the detection cone for 3 rounds and you detect the magic's location, you know there's a magic aura in that square (an illusion, if you make your Knowledge (arcana) check) but still can't see him.