Okay, so things could have gone better in my last session, but due to certain things happening, I need to send a player off to Magnimar for Trial and work out how the remaining PC's (1! and my GMPC) can leave the Glasswork's now, to return later and continue with Tsuto once more.
Seeing as Tsuto would now be alerted as three of the Goblins managed to flee, this is now a problem.
Also, where in the book does it state that Lonjiku is the molten glass mess in the middle of the main ground floor room? I don't really know how I can explain this to the Player's.
Three of the five (4 PC's, 1 GMPC I control and have in temporarily atm) PC's have been killed/are in the process of being killed, mainly because the two Barbarian's didn't get along.
Sessions beforehand had Dack (the victim below) constantly hit and knock out Jeffrey (the other Barb who caused this latest problem) because he wanted to sleep with every woman going, even if it was against their will. The player made it so Jeffrey was an ex-noble turned Barbarian who speaks posh and is in search of the world's finest Wench.
Oh and Dack also attacked my GMPC as soon as an optional Bandit fight I made was over, because he saw my PC revive a fallen bandit (I allowed another player who wanted to game that night use my GMPC) and didn't care that my GMPC was healing the Bandit due to being a medic (though a drunk) and was in the process of bringing him in (even though my Cleric offered him a drink, holding out a glass tankerd full to the brim with Ale), so turned on my Cleric and the other Barb, with the PC Witch casting Enlarge Person on him, to try and kill my GMPC and the other wench seeking Barb. They both failed and I had the Sheriff intervene to throw Brik (GMPC), Jeffrey and Dack in prison overnight, all in different cells.
I would have brought in the Witch for assisting too, but she knew the Sheriff and as such he trusted her and none of the other PC's told him she helped, so as I didn't want to meta-game, she got off scott free.
Anyway, promised to be on their best behaviour and having their alcohol confiscated and instead, having their keg filled up with water instead of ale (Brik), everyone headed towards the Glasswork's.
Upon entering (with Tristan's *Magus/Rogue* natural 20 on Disable Device), people didn't fully heal overnight and so I had them search through the rooms and eventually follow a trail of blood into the main Glassworking room.
Unfortunately, my GMPC Cleric (Brik Wahl...27 AC - I made him my own iconic and brought him in as a level 4 character. He's just in there to aid really, is 3 level's Cleric and 1 Fighter, focusing in attacking people with Improvised Weapons, so his damage is the weakest out of the entire party) didn't get to them in time to save them all, as he had a little trouble on the toilet, whilst drinking his favourite Ale (from his secret stash - don't ask where he kept it...), because he was too paraletic to know what was going on, due to the fact he is quite possibly Golarion's biggest Alcoholic.
Note: He's Comic Relief but acts more serious when he's been sobered up (which is hardly ever, as I've made him immune to the negative effects of alcohol, so I don't have to keep making saving throws for him).
Anyway, one of the Goblins tripped the Barbarian and on the AoO, the Barb rolled a 1, pulled out a Crit Card and his Earthbreaker hammer shattered. His Masterwork weapon was no more...
The Goblin then grappled him, where another one jumped on top of him until eventually about 6 of them were carrying him over to the furnace.
Then, the other Barb decided to help them....
The victim (Dack, the original problematic character) couldn't break out of this. It was practically impossible for him and so he was cast into the fire.
Brik miraculously turned up and came running in, healed Dack after taking 32 fire damage (only had 4hp left in his minuses), but restored him back to consciousness with a Cure Mod of 19. Then, Dack woke up in the furnace, tried to escape whilst having his skin melt away and completely failed, only for the other Barb to attack through Brik's square (-4 due to concealment) and outright kill the other PC.
Hannah (the Witch) died shortly before this, which was unfortunate as she cast Enlarge Person to prevent the Goblins from carrying him off, but as she died (was only on 10hp), the spell wore off, which is what allowed them to carry Dack off.
Afterwards, Brik and Tristan kept fighting (Tristan is my gf's character, Brik is almost un-hittable), but where Tristan was taking out Goblins, Brik was taking out Goblins and duking it out with Jeffrey the now very very bad Barb.
After Brik lost 5 of his 50 life (from a Crit that couldn't confirm), Jeffrey ran, everyone got an AoO on him and Jeffrey was then dropped unconscious as he ran off, suffering from I think it was Brik's critical (he drinks alcohol in a fight and smashes his glass tankerds over his enemies heads with every finished drink, so I said his damage is piercing or slashing as it's glass, so he suffered from punctured lung).
Anyway, Brik....as a man of the Law (kind of), decided to restore him so he didn't die and now that the remaining three Goblins fled, he's going to call over Tristan (the fostered Son of Belor Hemlock) to cuff him, where he can revive him and send him off to Magnimar, to do things properly.
So, to conclude the outcome of this, Tsuto would be alerted and I have no idea how to get the PC's to continue the Glassworks, as I have no idea where to go with this, now that everyone knows the PC's are there.
I also don't know how to say that the man in the centre of the room is Lonjiku, as Tsuto should have his journal on him and it appears that there's no info (that I can see), stating that the glass mess is Lonjiku.
What a mess.
Ah, PC's. :p
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I wouldn't worry about the in-game stuff yet - you've got far more serious issues than that.
If you've got players whose characters don't co-operate (and in fact kill each other), a GMPC who is comic relief (which quite often knocks the stuffing out of any suspense or other atmosphere), and other characters who seem to be tagging along to satisfy their own ulterior motives, rather than investing in the storyline of the adventure path, then your problems are only going to get worse.
Thanks for the response, Tinalles!
1. A perception check of 20 should suffice, shouldn't it? The only thing I'm worried about overly is the fact two of the player's PC's are alive, but there's currently only one in the group who isn't controlled by me, who would be fit for this. The other is the Barbarian who's going to be sent off to Magnimar.
2. When they go to the basement, I'll get them to make a Perception check and have a conveniently placed wardrobe/book shelf, hiding the entrance tot he catacmob's of wrath.
3. Jeffrey is the guy going to Magnimar for trial (Belor is currently in Magnimar, but as the PC's venture there later anyway, I don't think I need to worry about other things for the PC's to do there, so I'll just get on with the trial. The charges are murder (killing the other Barb) and betrayal of trust(putting the party in danger as a result and attacking the Cleric afterwards, which helped to allow the Goblins to kill two PC's).
4. That sounds like a great idea, though the PC's will have to fight the Goblins as currently they're only level 2 (nearing 3, but still). However, I did make an extra side quest for them to eradicate all sczarni from Sandpoint, with Jubrayl Vhiski being the leader and plot hook, so they can get their exp that way.
I'm thinking that now the Glasswork's is a crime scene, get Tristan to search the place (Rogue/Magus) and report his findings to the guards, telling them not to act until the Sheriff returns, but to secure the area (or whatever she roleplays her character to do), then head to Magnimar with Brik Wahl, to attend Jeffrey's trial.
Once convicted, Tristan and Brik will return together (hopefully after bumping into the new PC's), leaving Belor in Magnimar to finish off his business as he was a day late leaving, thanks to the party members the previous night.
Then, I'll have the new PC's go after the rest of the Sczarni, catching up on the exp they lost out from the Glasswork's, so they can actually stand a chance against everyone at Thistletop, whilst playing up an injured Shalelu who will work as a guide to get them to Thistletop the fastest and sneakiest way possible (rolling a percentile to see if they come across one of the Goblin tribes), where they can then prepare to enter the building.
5. I'll say Lonjiku had a Cane with some kind of design on it that served as one of his trademarks (though I'll have to look into details for his character beforehand) and hopefully find a picture of him on Obsidian Portal or something, explaining something like "In this mangled corpse of an old man's, reflective, blackened, glass covered hand is an unusual cane with beautifully carved designs, spiralling upward from the centre of the stick, forming the handle this man once used to hold".
Something like that anyway.
Thanks very much for the help!
I didn't quite know it would de-rail the plot SO much, but it was their own actions that caused this and even though I'm the GM, I don't like to interfere with what the players choose to do, so just figured "go for it", knowing the end result would be anything but good.
*Sigh*
Edit: Hey John. :)
The Witch wanted to play the story from the very start (being my usual GM), my girlfriend enjoys it and likes the inclusion of the comic relief Cleric (who I won't ever have permanently in the party. I have him hang back when the suspense is around, then just have him turn up at some random point later that doesn't effect the story. That's how I've been playing him), also enjoying the storyline and well, the Barbarian who died always likes to play the story, but has a habit of either annoying another PC in every campaign or has characters who tend to punch other PC's in the face for actions his PC doesn't agree with.....
Then we have my brother who played Jeffrey.
He plays as he has nothing better to do right now, which I don't mind, but as some of the bosses in this are actually really cool, I'd prefer it if he stuck to the story a little, rather than purposely going out of his way to hunt other PC's down.
Usually things work out fine regardless, but it's just unfortunate for those really interested in the game, just how far away from the plot this event has taken the AP. Not to mention (again), the fact two of the PC's are dead and one is about to be tried and executed (no doubt).
Should I allow Jeffrey to try an escape artist from the hangman's noose? If my brother only wants to be foolish, I could have him come in as a recurring boss or something, just to keep him happy. That is of course, only if he somehow escapes and creating an event to allow such a thing to happen, would take a lot of work.
To be fair though, the Witch and both Barbarian's did it to themselves, because their personalities all conflicted.
I'm just hoping their new characters will get along better.
One question I have though:
My usual GM (the controllerof the now dead Witch) refuses to make another character until he's spoken with the dead Barbarian's player about what Class he's going to play, as he's going to choose dependent on what the other player chooses.
I said I don't want to allow that as I want it to be a surprise, but he's being pretty stubborn about it.
Do I just allow it, no matter how much I'm against it, or do I say he has to roll a different character after he decides?
It's a tough one because the player should always choose his/her character, but I don't agree with this as it's choosing via meta-gaming reasons.
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My impression is that capital crimes are tried in Magnimar. Magnimar I don't believe hang hardened criminals, they get sentenced to the mines to work. There is a rumor in the original AP that there are devils down in the mines as well, tormenting the prisoners. So no need to slip the noose, sentence him to the mines and give him a way to escape if you want to give him another chance.
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I think you've got a tough choice to make.
One the one hand, you want your party characters to get along with each other.
But you also don't want players to meta-game when deciding on their characters.
I see those goals as incompatible.
I'm just about to start running RotRL myself. I've decided having a cohesive and compatible party that covers all the major bases (damage dealer, healer and/or buffer, face, skill monkey, arcane caster) is the primary goal - after all, they're supposed to stick together for six books! So my player group are definitely using meta-game knowledge in party selection. I don't see that as a big problem; let's face it, why would any character undertake a mission like this with a group of fellow-adventurers he didn't even like? As a character, I'm not going to trust my life to someone I wouldn't even trust with my coin purse, and I'm not going to set out on a mission with a group of companions that is missing an important capability.
Another group I know of (running Skulls & Shackles) had a slightly different approach; there was no pre-game consultation, but each player came to the kick-off session with two characters prepared. The rest of the players got to pick which of the two they would rather see join the party.
On the last detail - your brother - you have a tough call to make. Which is more important: letting your brother have free rein, or encouraging your player group to work together? Any player who deliberately disrupted my group wouldn't be asked back to my table. While there is truth in the old saw that you can pick your friends, but you can't pick your family, that doesn't mean you have to include him in your gaming sessions if he isn't prepared to do it on your terms.
If he can live with that (and if the player of the other barbarian can try to play something a little less abrasive, so people will be more inclined to work with him), you'd have a better chance. It sounds as though you have a good selection of ideas for trying to drag the party back somewhere in the vicinity of the plot.
Finally: remember this is supposed to be fun for everybody at the table. That includes you! If your player group is giving you a hard time, let them know what behaviour you'd like them to change.
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I can't say I have major GM experience but your players seem troublesome. What it might seem fun now, might become burden later. Roleplaying characters isn't excuse for poor behavior.
Regarding your player playing witch. Do him a favor and tell him what player that played barbarian plays. It doesn't seem like he is enjoying the game to much.
Notes:
- Sandpoint is also small town so pretty much everything is known to everyone. If your PC is grabing women on the street sheriff would already find out before he even tried to do so.
- Sandpoint has almost 0 crime, so bandits on the street are rather unusual sight. You might wanna focus quests on non-fights or on some detective work.
- Your PCs seemed to be lv3-4 already. I doubt they need help of your NPC cleric. You might even punish them right now, by saying that Brik refuses to be with them anymore until they shapen up a bit.
- Sandpoint is it's own boss somewhat. They can solve their crimes on their own. They are all city states as much as I figured out from descriptions of Varisia so PC doesn't have to be shiped to Magnimar for trial.
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Personally, I think you should put your GM foot down and demand that your payers do not engage in any activity that disrupts the group; through whatever background the players want to come up with for their characters to make it work, the characters must get along and work together for a common party goal.
@Malag - Nah, they've only just recently reached level 2. Level 3-4 APL encounters would be way too high!
There isn't much to do in the town of Sandpoint right now, as apart from my made up sidequest, there's only the main stuff to do...and now Magnimar. :/
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@Bandavaar
You are the GM. There is no limit in what you can do.
I am still in process of going through first game, and I am already making up a sidequest regarding Chopper murderer. It will involve a bit of exploration and lots of questions, much like detective work.
Not everything in game should be combat oriented or it will become grind house and your PCs will get bored soon.
Yea, I know.
It's just I dragged out the Boar hunt into something more than it was, which was well received on here and now I have the Sczarni mission going on (which I also created/am still in the process of creating encounters for), so it's not a matter of what I can do, but more a case of what I can keep track of effectively and at the minute, I'm fairly comfortable with how much I have going on.
I'm not really worried about making a Chopper event as that's in Sandpoint's past, so I don't feel the need to bring it up again with a Chopper number 2.
In order to create an event that heavily involves detective work would mean I have to put in more time than I currently have on my own hands, so I'm going with what I can do.
I don't want to create a huge amount of content myself, but when it comes to including optional creatures, that's where my priority is mainly.
That and I don't want to de-rail the plot so much that it goes from a creepy tale into a comedic mess of quests that get in the way of the main story.
It's my first time GM'ing, following an Adventure Path as I tried to create my own one previously and one person refused to play after finding a spoon of revival (it was a vampires vs werewolves thing I made), so I refused to ever GM again because I put a lot of effort in and for them to stop playing over such a trivial thing, it annoyed me.
Anyways, this one is going well as they're not breaking from the norm with Homebrew stuff and are instead sticking with the Pathfinder rules.
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@Bandavaar
So set yourself a limit. Nobody can keep a track of 10 active quests, this isn't a video game. I would keep 2-3 subquests going on and main story.
I didn't intend to put Chopper n0.2 but simply familiarize PCs with Chopper and grant them a walk to his island for some "fetch that item" minor subquest. Entire Chopper story would be 1 of parts of introducing the town with his history in it.
This kind of stuff encourages exploration and roleplaying, and beside that, Sandpoint is city which they will encounter alot, they should know everything about it.
Well, I run things differently.
I wait for the PC's to say what they'd like to do and then act from there.
If they want to go to Chopper's Isle, there's not much to do really, so I could just say they find a long abandoned mansion and as they search, I could maybe throw in a few traps or simply just have them search the place for a few rewards and info on the Chopper's murders, but again it's all way too time consuming and I'd much sooner stick with the main story.
Also, there are 7 encounters with the Sczarni mission left and I include them at points where not much is going on. On top of that I also have to sort this all out in Magnimar, so I need to make a small little quest for that too. So, effectively I have 8 quests running currently alongside the main story. :)
It's good for them to know things, but the main focus is the story in my game, so I don't feel I need to educate them about the entire town of Sandpoint.
Besides, nobody has Knowledge Local and nobody has cared enough to ask anyone of Sandpoint's past. Roleplaying is light about 95% of the time in my game. The fighter types only really roleplay in combat, but like to randomly roleplay now and again between missions and quests.
Hoo, boy. You asked for advice, not a critique, so here goes:
#1: Just because the PCs go somewhere doesn't mean you have to put something there.
For example, you have the Sczarni quest, the expanded boar hunt, and
If they want to go to Chopper's Isle...I could maybe throw in a few traps...
I like the fact that you want your PCs to feel they have free rein; I GM the same way. But it sounds like you're trying really hard to find something for them to DO when they have that free rein. If, no matter which direction they go or what they do, they find something to do that gives them EXP, then they have no reason to pursue the main plot.
Sometimes an empty house is just an empty house.
Just for comparison, our first session lasted 8 hours, and the PCs only made it to the end of the Swallowtail festival. It wasn't because of conflicts or finding clues or investigating a mystery, it was because they were checking out all the NPCs and shops of Sandpoint. I didn't have to add anything and I didn't give the PCs "something to do", I just played out the NPCs and let the PCs wander.
#2: Actions have consequences.
You point out that one of your party members was taking women unwillingly. Was this in Sandpoint? What did Sheriff Hemlock do? The town guard?
I used to play with a similarly-rowdy group that thought terrorizing the locals (and each other) was hilarious. I made sure I had stats on the guards and sheriff so out-of-line PCs would rapidly find themselves locked up (or dead).
#3: Intra-party conflict will cause some players to be miserable.
Our old group out-and-out encouraged intra-party conflict; we had one infamous three-session stretch that ended with 12 dead PCs without even starting the scenario. On the other hand, we lost at least half a dozen players who refused to tolerate this behavior. Looks like you're on the verge of losing a player. Is the intra-party stuff entertaining enough that you're willing to let him go?
#4: Power gaming breaks APs
The encounter you describe is designed for four 1st-level characters. You have a 4th level GM NPC with 50 HP running around saving other characters' lives. That eliminates the threat of the baddies. The only reason characters died in that encounter was because they were busy killing each other. I know you're discussing his inclusion with others on this thread as "comedy relief" and "an alcoholic", but if the players have that underlying feeling that they're going to get bailed out any time they get in over their heads, they're going to take the AP a lot less seriously (which it's fairly clear they're doing).
Why can't he be a 1st-level GM NPC? It seems like the safety net is encouraging the PC misbehavior.
Anyway, as I said, I'm hoping this is helpful.
Hey, Nobodyshome. :)
1. I would just like areas to have nothing of particular interest going on, so I guess I can get away with just explaining things as they are (a creepy house, that once held Sandpoint's most feared murderer).
2. The Barbarian didn't do that. He won a wench at the festival, but they seemed to like each other, so he slept with her before and after every quest event, but he kept making moves on the Witch, so she was afraid of him.
3. Which player are you thinking is likely to leave? Nobody has said they wanted to and everyone that died is in the process of making characters for next time. :)
4. Brik may be level 4, but he's only third level Cleric, next to a party of level 2's. He's not in the party permanently and I've told a few of the party members that.
He just comes in every so often to aid them and deals a maximum of 6 damage per round. I save his cure light and cure mods for when people really need it, but currently as there are no other PC's left alive (other than Tristan), he's going to aid Tristan and accompany him until a new party is formed.
I don't ever like playing the healer bot (even though my favourite character was a Charm Cleric who just recently died in Kingmaker and I healed better than the main party Cleric when I needed to!)and Brik really isn't that reliable in general.
He'll help out, but being drunk he's always doing something elsewhere, rarely paying attention to the PC's, but has OCD with regards to healing, so if he actually notices things are going badly, he'll aid them, but yea, I didn't make him overpowered. I just optimised him as much as I could for AC, so my Iconic actually stays alive and can protect the party as a wall when needed. :)
I'm on top of that anyway. He wasn't even in the room when people started attacking each other. He appeared towards the end and tried to help, but after his healing of max Cure Mod to the guy in the fire, Jeffrey's coup de grace finished it off and now Brik has had to drunkenly enforce the law upon the Barbarian, with only the Magus/Rogue left.
I knew that something silly would happen, so he is my town guard and the Sheriff is out at Magnimar atm, like he's meant to be (as written in the AP). :)
The Barbarian didn't pull random women off the street and do things, otherwise people would notice and seeing as the Witch and other PC's didn't report Jeffrey's behaviour to the Town Guard, none of the people in Sandpoint were aware of his behaviour.
I just wanted to chip in with my 2 coppers on the group dynamics.
First, if your brother is playing just because he is bored, tell him to find something else to do. I'm sure you love your brother very much, but it sounded like he was the primary instigator of many of the problems. You have 3 people who actually wanted to play for the story, and 1 who is only playing to kill time. Why let that one ruin it for the others? Tell him to either play someone less evil (and yes, a violent rapist is evil), or do something else.
Second, it isn't metagaming to let players choose classes that complement each other. Or rather, no more than usual. Think about it - if you really wanted to be "authentic" you should randomly choose the race, gender, homeland, social position, and stats of the players, and then only let them choose classes and life story which complemented those. If you are letting people choose their own race/class/stats, you are already metagaming, in a sense. So it really isn't that big a deal to let your players collaborate on character creation and make choices that don't conflict.
Well yea, but at the same time I want there to still be the surprise of meeting other characters and getting to know them, so I don't really want to allow it, but I guess I have no choice in the matter as they seem set on doing it.
Anyway, I had a word with my brother about why he did that and to be fair, it made sense and I realised it wasn't a meta-gaming reason.
His character didn't rape people and wasn't a rapist. He just loved a good wench, but as there was a female in the party, he kept trying to make moves on her but didn't ever touch her.
Dack (the murdered Barb) stuck up for the Witch, but without thinking of the consequences, kept pushing Jeffrey (Brother's Barb) around and knocking him out, hitting him any time he looked at the Witch, whilst also turning to attack him with his sword.
They duked it out and Jeffrey won, but left Dack alive.
Anyway, after more disagreement's Jeffrey decided he hated Dack and feeling pressured by him all of the time, not knowing when he would turn on him next, he saw the Goblins throwing him into the Furnace as an opportunity and took it.
Realising what he had done and that he would be charged with murder, he decided he would try to take out the rest of the party so that there were no witnesses and he could carry on with the adventure, explaining they were outnumbered and that he was the only one left.
That idea failed though, because Brik Wahl made sure of that.
So, I can see his point, but both Barb's caused this and as a result three party members are now useless and/or dead.
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I put more of the blame on Dack to be honest. It sounds like Dack was being a bully, and Jeffrey just went over the line. At least from the first post.
Of course, I wouldn't have stood for it either. Jeffrey would have been hauled off to Magnimar. In fact, I would have made your brother hand over the character sheet and:
Yea, I think that's exactly what happened really.
I mean technically they're both as bad as each other, but if someone bullies another, the recipient will eventually flip and that's exactly what happened.
Ah, okay then. Thanks. :)
Now, if he wants to, from here he could fight the PC's when they face Xanesha, orrrrrr he could play the double agent and double cross Xanesha to ensure the parties victory!
The choice would be his, though the penalty would be having the entire town hate him as he is a bit of a trouble maker already, but getting away with murder is in an entirely different league altogether!
What do you think about this? :D
Time to research Judge (Justice) Ironbriar and read a lot of book two then!
This trip is a one off until the real Magnimar trip anyway. :D
Next question is:
I've already statted up Nualia to be a level 6 Cleric/Anti-Paladin and with her Yeth Hound by her side, she's going to be a tough fight, but due to how the events of last week turned out, would Tsuto, now back at T-top, not be at Nualia's side at all times, as her lover?
I could maybe make it a 50% chance he's with her, as I'm sure they'd both have their own things to do, but the trouble is I just don't know what those things would be.
This would also make the encounter incredibly hard, so maybe Brik should accompany them here?
Edit: Sorry, I forgot to include that my brother is more excited to control his backup character (Ironman), so is no longer interested in playing Jeffrey.
I could call the mission "Jeffrey, the Corrupted" and have a bit of detective work for the pc's, so they can uncover the truth behind Judge Ironbriar and the Magnimarian officials, where they would see the link to Xanesha.
Only downer is I have no idea on how to create such an event, or why the Judge would have recruited him, or how he could have convinced the Barbarian to join him (other than the fact he might be persuaded by a hot Wench).
Any ideas guys, or shall I make a new topic for this?
Yea, but as he's seeing her, I figured they'd be together? Now that he can't be found at the Glasswork's.
I think the PC's only find his notebook when they kill him though. Hmm, they can do some investigating with the Glasswork's still though.
The CoW might be fun for them.
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She is using him for her own goals, it's more likely that he is never near her enough because she keeps him on the leash. The greater the expectations, the greater the devotion. She can do with him whatever she likes. That's how I see it. Hit reality in and everything becomes clear.
PCs can find his notebook yes, but some spell which can make him talk or simple charm is enough to tell them even more, almost entire plot.
I am holding special creepy stuff for catacombs. It needs to be creepy and scary, and of course, dangerous.
I disagree with Malag. Whether Nualia actually loves Tsuto or is just using him is irrelevant. He is going to be near her, because she likes $^&@ing him. There's actually numerous references to this through the adventure, including the sightings by the goblin druid of them out in the woods "going at it like rabbits". It's the reason Lyrie is so pissy, or at least one of them.
And remember she's a follower of Lamashtu - making squicky babies is a religious act for Nualia. So I'd fully expect at least a good chance Tsuto's with her if he escaped... and even a chance the encounter gets a bit easier with neither of them wearing armor, of you catch my meaning.
I disagree with Malag. Whether Nualia actually loves Tsuto or is just using him is irrelevant. He is going to be near her, because she likes $^&@ing him. There's actually numerous references to this through the adventure, including the sightings by the goblin druid of them out in the woods "going at it like rabbits". It's the reason Lyrie is so pissy, or at least one of them.
And remember she's a follower of Lamashtu - making squicky babies is a religious act for Nualia. So I'd fully expect at least a good chance Tsuto's with her if he escaped... and even a chance the encounter gets a bit easier with neither of them wearing armor, of you catch my meaning.
That's exactly what I thought, but I did a search through all of the books, searching "at it like rabbits" as you typed it in speech marks, suggesting it's written that way word for word, but I found nothing.
Is there somewhere I can find more info on this, so I can work everything out properly?
Sorry, I had a word mixup. From page 45, on info Gogmurt can provide: "Gogmurt suspects that the half elf and the angry woman with the torn-up belly are lovers, because he’s seen them 'going at it like donkey rats' in the woods at times." I don't recall where all the info came from, some I may be remembering from the 3.5 version and I don't have that on hand anymore.
Page 36 on the old Burnt Offerings book. :)
Just found it there, so thanks!
The newer book might be cool but as I have the first one and haven't ever used it before running my current campaign, I'm not going to be buying the new one, so will be working on things in the old fashioned way. :p
I'm a little unsure on how to get the pc's to find out about...
Also, the only player with a character still alive is currently with my GMPC (Brik) and seeing as Jeffrey is currently out cold on the floor and the Goblins have only just run off, Tsuto would in fact still be in the building, so I don't think it's in his nature to run away whilst his Goblins are still alive, so I guess the fight's not over yet!
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Solution to party conflict!
-All PCs must be Good.
-If a character begins to act in a non-Good way they cease being a PC and become an NPC.
-Get rid of your pet.
What now!
-A sinspawn comes up from the catacomb, PCs kill and investigate.
-Shalelu warns of goblin threat, asks for help
Problem PCs!
-Let them hang, new PCs at level one with starting gold and 0xp.
-Explain that this is an adventure foe heroes. Non-heroes can go in another room and read a book until the AP is over.
Haha.
I don't actually control my GMPC to heal fallen foe and since reverting to having full control over him, no player has had a problem with him, apart from the guy that usually GM's for us, as he said there's no way he should have an AC that high, when actually there is because he just has a load of +1 equipment through borrowing money off of people and buying stuff without paying them back.
He does all this while drunk and seemingly so far has had no memory of it...
The players mainly like the GMPC. He's there to aid them at times anyway. Other times he'll be nowhere in sight, probably getting drunk in some tavern or something.
Right now though, he needs to stick with the only surviving PC to finish this Glasswork's encounter. That means taking on Tsuto and a remaining 3 Goblins, however he should ensure both of their survival, so it'll be ok I think.
Nobody in the group likes playing a Cleric annoyingly, so I've been going out of my way to ensure they survive, but still played the enemies to kill them, so they've really felt the danger at times. Still, it'd be better for the group if someone made a Cleric, but they won't. I know it, lol.
When the Glasswork's finished, Tristan will venture off to Magnimar with Brik for Jeffrey's trial and hopefully there, when the players who died bother to give me their new characters, I can bring them back in somehow.
I don't allow them to play as evil characters, by the way. Nobody started out evil, but feud's anger people and two Barbarian's arguing...well, the results won't ever be good will they? :p
Everyone's coming in with full exp and levels, but I'm tempted to not allow them to enter with their WBL. Still, I think their lesson is learned.
One of the players tried to moan slightly about their deaths and I just said that it was their actions that caused it and I'm not controlling anyone's character. Just play more carefully and don't do things to provoke other characters if you want to survive and actually play through the adventure. It's my responsibility to run the game, not to ensure their characters survive. :p
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If nobody like playing a cleric then just let them make that choice and play with it.
They still have options of bard, oracle, witch, paladin, inquisitor, ranger... to cast healing spells. They can also takes ranks in Use Magic Device.
At low levels a wand of CLW is more potent than a cleric anyway, the witch is the healer now (and incidentally, if your players are worried about becoming mere healbots, there are a lot of people who think that in-combat healing is a complete waste of time: win the fight and then heal is more effective).
A drunken cleric who shows up just in time to get them out of trouble takes the drama out of the game. Your players might well be creating inter-party drama to make up for the loss of drama your super-healing-friend is creating.
Haha, well he wasn't around when they most needed him and he's only been in for one session and a half out of about 5 so far!
That's why he's a temp. I wanted to introduce him, then have him leave again, but yea, the Witch is dead. The Barb is dead. Jeffrey is about to be "killed".
A multi-classed Mague Rogue is all that's left, but yea it's not Brik who's the problem (I made sure of that when creating him). It's more the players don't really get on, or try to get one up on each other and unfortunately that reflects their characters in game at times (not all of the time thankfully).
I was feeling generous so had him turn up in time to try and save someone's life last week, but he has Narcolepsy, so it's not likely he'll be there. I've said to the players he a temporary aid who's not to be relied upon as simply put, he might just forget about the party if he sees booze, but was healing more simply this time because the Sheriff made him sober up a bit first.
I used to hate Clerics, but find them pretty awesome now. You can do a lot with them. Charm Clerics of their own ideals are awesome. Demon Hunting Clerics are awesome. Battle Clerics can also be awesome.
At the table, whilst playing a Cleric, players expect you to heal them whenever they ask, but I play my Clerics as people with goals in mind and if they're doing something else, or busy pursuing their own ideals, they're not gonna drop everything to heal someone. They're a person, not a bot who's only good at healing and that's what the group doesn't seem to see and is probably why they don't like them.
Edit: @Aeshuura - Thanks!
I've just this minute found this as well:
When you open your eyes again, you find yourselves standing suspended weightless in the air overlooking Sandpoint and what appears to be the old church that got burnt down in place of the new cathedral.
The door to the church furtively opens as a beautiful little girl with silver hair and violet eyes pokes her head furtively outside before timidly walking outside. As she daintily walks down the steps, a stone flies out of nowhere and hits her head. Boyish giggling can be heard in the distance as someone yells: “Freak! Go back inside!” Clutching the bloody welt on her forehead, she runs back inside crying.
You are transported to what looks to be a quaint, old-fashioned schoolhouse. The same sad, quiet girl sits alone in the corner, reading a book. Cruel whispering and giggling can be heard all around her, before she gets up and excuses herself to go use the restroom. Three other giggling girls follow behind her and wait for her to walk into the outhouse before piling tables and chairs outside her door. Several hours later, a little girl’s frightened screams of anguish pierce the dusk.
A teenage girl walks back home to the church from the school house. Immediately, the air is filled with lewd catcalls and hooting from the adolescent boys in the area. Extremely uncomfortable with the inappropriate attention placed upon her, she quickly runs back to the church, with her head hung low.
A young woman holding a basket is browsing through vegetables at the market, when suddenly, she feels someone yank at her hair followed closely by a loud “snip” sound. Whirling around, she sees an old woman gleefully hobble off with a handful of hair the color of the stars.
A mob of petitioners approach her. Many of them have rashes and boils, others have warts. Some others claim to hear spirits in their head. They ask her to bless them. They ask her if she could cure their maladies with her touch. One of them calls her “the Blessed of Desna.” Another asks her to drive the evil spirits out of his head by singing to him. Too much for her, she runs back to the church. They give chase.
A stern voice of an older man can be heard: “On your seventeenth birthday, I am taking you to the highly prestigious Windsong Abbey to become a nun. The Abbess expects all young applicants to be perfectly versed in their catechisms. You may not leave this room until you have memorized all of your scriptures.” Hours later, a young woman looks out the window gloomily as the sun sets and another warm summer day spent cloistered in her chambers.
A handsome Varisian boy, who recently arrived at Sandpoint from Magnimar, takes her on a picnic for a date. It is her first picninc. They sit on a grassy knoll and watch the sun set. She falls in love.
Weeks pass. The boy throws a stone at the church window. The window opens and the girl looks outside. She smiles happily at him before clambering over and climbing down on a cloth rope. He takes her hand and takes her to the moonlit beach. They walk for awhile in the sand until they come upon a strange cave nestled within the cliffs underneath the newly built Glassworks. Giggling softly, they both go inside.
Months pass. The two young lovers sit shoulder to shoulder at the mouth of the cave overlooking the waves at night. The girl turns to the boy and says that she has something important to tell him. “What’s the matter?” the boy asks tenderly.
“I’m pregnant.” The girl says.
“You’re lying!”
“No, I swear it’s true.”
“How could this happen! I thought your kind was infertile.”
“But…what are we going to do now?”
“What do you mean we? I will be going to Magnimar with my caravan next week.”
“I thought you said you were going to stay here with me.”
“I lied. I knew I should never have gone out with a sad little fool like you.” With that, he turns on his heel and walks away with barely a glance backwards. Mouth agape, too stunned to speak, and hurt beyond measure, the girl quietly watches her so-called “lover” disappear into the darkness.
Kneeling before the altar, she prays for repentance that she does not feel. Her foster father yelled at her harshly and had called her a “harlot” when he found out about her condition. He forbids her from leaving the church in fear public ridicule. Bitterness and rage clouds her heart like a thick poison and festers…
Eight months later, she undergoes a painful miscarriage. Through the haze of pain suffusing her entire body, she catches a glimpse of her baby – a horrific and deformed monstrosity, which the blanching midwife immediately swaddles up and takes away. In one awful moment of clarity, she realized that she had been carrying a fiend in her belly all this time. She falls into a deep coma.
Her coma-induced sleep is filled with fevered dreams. In them, a pregnant woman with three jackal heads and a serpentine tail beckons to her. She approaches slowly and falls into the demon goddess’ embrace. In her other dreams, she dreams of burning the old Desnan church – her home and prison – down, with her foster father in it. She dreams of masked men who revel in the act of hunting and killing other men. She dreams of hunting down and murdering the boy who brought her so much pain. She dreams of a hidden shrine underground shrine, where she meets her tiny new mentor. She dreams of a monstrous goblin wolf – a chosen of Lamashtu – that paces restlessly in ravenous hunger in a small chamber. She dreams of Sandpoint being overwhelmed and razed by a ravening horde of monsters, and she vividly sees herself standing amidst the ruins, reveling in the act of offering the souls of the dying to higher, more terrible beings beyond the understanding of mere mortals.
The collective vision ends here and you find that you are once again inside the heart of Thistletop.
“Through that memory sphere, you have seen the entirety of my cursed and wretched life. All, but the final two dreams have come to pass exactly as I dreamt it. Soon, I shall be a true demon and no one will be able to stop me! I have come too far to be stopped by the likes of you. Prepare to die!”
All of a sudden, her black-hilted sword bursts into angry orange flames. Wings outspread and sword trailing fire, she lunges at you with fury in her eyes.
Roll initiative!
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I do the same with clerics as well. He may heal you, but if you do not pay proper respects to his god, he has to reason to expect that he should heal you. Clerics are living and breathing, they should be played that way. (In that respect, I also are stricter on players that play any of the divine caster classes.)
I kind of like that you have spoilered up there, but I feel that, unless there is an ulterior motive there, it doesn't make sense that it would happen, especially if you statted her up as an anti-paladin. It seems to show weakness, on her part, something that it seems she would try to hide away. That is why I prefer my previous option. Something that she did not intend for the PCs to get a hold of...
EDIT: Unless of course she is trying to get them to hesitate finishing her, giving her the edge...
Ah ok. I thought it sounded like a cool idea, but I'm not 100% on my choice yet, so I better have a dig for those lost pages, before deeming them really lost. :p
For some reason, I really really like Nualia and want her to still have her sensitive side, just hidden under her cold, concrete covered soul.
I was thinking of making the players see who she really was, in hope that they would dig deep enough for her to be somewhat redeemed, because although many things have influence over her, she's conditioned herself to hate herself because others have hated her out of jealousy, which she obviously didn't understand.
I kind of want to give her a chance, because I'd like to give someone like that a chance in real life, if I heard of a terrible story similar to that where everyone would let her down.
She might be classed as so far gone that it's beyond hope, but she would still have some of her memories and certain said things would still effect her.
To trigger this, I was thinking of having a little investigation around town to show the players who she really was and depending on how the encounter with Tsuto goes, they could find information out that way, but it seems so sad and like such a waste of character if she's in the story for like 5 rounds, with maybe a few paragraphs written about her in a book.
I dunno, I'll be sad to see her go. :p
20 point buy
AC: 18, touch 11, flat-footed 17
HP: 41 (4d8+2d10+6)
Alignment: CE
Speed: 20 feet (30 base)
Str 14
Dex 13
Con 13
Int 10
Wis 16
Cha 16
BAB: 5
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 5
Will: 12
Note: +3 to all saves due to Unholy Resilience.
Unholy Resilience (Su): At 2nd level, an antipaladin gains a bonus equal to his Charisma bonus (if any) on all saving throws.
Celestial Resistance: Aasimars have acid resistance 5, cold resistance 5, and electricity resistance 5.
Masterwork Composite Longbow
+1 Bastard Sword with Weapon Focus
+1 Breastplate (+6 Armour, +1)
Melee Attack: 2 from Str, 5 from BAB, 1 from Weapon Focus, 1 from +1 weapon = 9 (7 when Power Attacking)
Melee Damage: 2 from Str, 1 from +1 weapon = 1d10+3 (an extra 4 damage when Power Attacking)
Smite good adds: 3 atk bonus, 2 damage
Fury of the Abyss adds: 2 atk, 2 damage
Ferocious Strike adds: 2 damage (if it hits)
Question: I'm not sure if these stack with power attack, but if they do, does attacking two handed with the above two attacks actually increase the two handed bonus as well, or do you add the above damage after the two handed bonus?)
Note: She will always attack two-handed.
Ranged Attack: 8
Ranged Damage: 1d8/x3
Tactics:
Before Combat: If Nualia suspects combat is imminent, she casts Bull’s
Strength and shield of faith on herself.
During Combat: Nualia activates her Sihedron medallion as a free
action at the start of combat to gain false life and casts divine favor.
She prefers to fight her fights with her bastard sword, her face an
impassive mask save for her eyes, which blaze with anger. She saves
shatter to use on any weapon that seems to be particularly dangerous
in an enemy’s hands.
When casting spells: Nualia takes one hand off of her Bastard Sword, takes a step back (5 foot step), holds her fiendish hand up and casts through it.
Upon losing a third of her life: Nualia casts Smite Good against the character which poses the biggest threat.
Upon losing half of her life: Nualia performs a Fury of the Abyss, Ferocious Striking Power Attack and will perfom this action until her Domain Powers have depleted for the day (you may do this 6 times with this build).
Morale: Nualia fights to the death.
Domains:
Evil - Demon Subdomain
Fury of the Abyss (Su): As a swift action, you can give yourself an enhancement bonus equal to 1/2 your cleric level (minimum +1) on melee attacks, melee damage rolls, and combat maneuver checks. This bonus lasts for 1 round. During this round, you take a –2 penalty to AC. You can use this ability for a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.
Replacement Domain Spells: 1st—doom, 3rd—rage, 6th—planar binding (demons only).
Strength - Ferocity Subdomain
Ferocious Strike (Su): Whenever you make a melee attack, you can designate that attack as a ferocious strike. If the attack hits, it deals additional damage equal to 1/2 your cleric level (minimum +1). You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.
Replacement Domain Spells: 3rd—rage, 6th—bull's strength (mass).
Spells:
From Cleric:
Spells Prepared (CL 4th)
0—Detect magic, mending, read magic, bleed
1st—Inflict light wounds, divine favor, protection from good, Doom (Domain)
2nd—bull’s strength, death knell (DC???), shatter (DC???), Align Weapon-Evil (Domain)
From Anti-Paladin:
Evil Aura: Strong
Detect Good (Sp): At will, an antipaladin can use detect good, as the spell. An antipaladin can, as a move action, concentrate on a single item or individual within 60 feet and determine if it is good, learning the strength of its aura as if having studied it for 3 rounds. While focusing on one individual or object, the antipaladin does not detect good in any other object or individual within range.
Smite Good (Su): Once per day, an antipaladin can call out to the dark powers to crush the forces of good. As a swift action, the antipaladin chooses one target within sight to smite. If this target is good, the antipaladin adds his Charisma bonus (if any) on his attack rolls and adds his antipaladin level on all damage rolls made against the target of his smite. If the target of smite good is an outsider with the good subtype, a good-aligned dragon, or a good creature with levels of cleric or paladin, the bonus to damage on the first successful attack increases to 2 points of damage per level the antipaladin possesses. Regardless of the target, smite good attacks automatically bypass any DR the creature might possess.
In addition, while smite good is in effect, the antipaladin gains a deflection bonus equal to his Charisma modifier (if any) to his AC against attacks made by the target of the smite. If the antipaladin targets a creature that is not good, the smite is wasted with no effect.
The smite good effect remains until the target of the smite is dead or the next time the antipaladin rests and regains his uses of this ability. At 4th level, and at every three levels thereafter, the antipaladin may smite good one additional time per day, as indicated on Table 2–13, to a maximum of seven times per day at 19th level.
Touch of Corruption (Su): Beginning at 2nd level, an antipaladin surrounds his hand with a fiendish flame, causing terrible wounds to open on those he touches. Each day he can use this ability a number of times equal to 1/2 his antipaladin level + his Charisma modifier. As a touch attack, an antipaladin can cause 1d6 points of damage for every two antipaladin levels he possesses. Using this ability is a standard action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
Alternatively, an antipaladin can use this power to heal undead creatures, restoring 1d6 hit points for every two levels the antipaladin possesses. This ability is modified by any feat, spell, or effect that specifically works with the lay on hands paladin class feature. For example, the Extra Lay On Hands feat grants an antipaladin 2 additional uses of the touch of corruption class feature.
Spell-Like Abilities (CL 4th)
1/day—daylight
Lamashtu's Mark - Benefit: Your abdomen bears several ugly scars, as if your belly had been torn open by a clawed hand. Lamashtu’s Mark identifies you as favored of the Mother of Monsters, and if it is visible, you gain a +2 bonus on Intimidate checks but a –2 penalty on Diplomacy checks.
Once per day as a free action, you may invoke Lamashtu’s name as you strike a non-evil foe with any melee attack. As you do, you cause the creature struck to become deformed in some hideous manner
(cloven hoof, horns, forked tongues, and vestigal limbs like wings and tails are common deformities). The deformity imparts a penalty of 1d4 points to the target’s Charisma score for 1 hour; the target can resist this effect by making a Fortitude save (DC 10 + your character level + your Charisma modifier). The physical deformity vanishes as soon as the Charisma penalty fades.
Channel Negative Energy: You can use this 6 times a day at 2d6 damage. Creatures that take damage from channeled energy receive a Will save to halve the damage. The DC of this save is equal to 10 + 1/2 the cleric's level + the cleric's Charisma modifier (DC 15).
Special: When channelling negative energy, Nualia raises up her Demonic Arm and channels through her hand (which has Lamashtu's Mark seared into it).
Statistics:
Feats: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bastard sword), Lamashtu’s Mark
(p 56), Power Attack, Weapon Focus (bastard sword)
Skills (2 per level): Intimidate +11, Knowledge (religion) +9, Ride +4, Perception +8
Languages: Common, Celestial, Goblin
SQ: spontaneous casting (inflict spells)
Gear: +1 breastplate, +1 bastard sword, Sihedron medallion
(p 55), masterwork composite longbow with 20 arrows, gold
holy symbol (100 gp), 7 pp, 5 gp
It seems all of her abilities stack. OUCH!
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In my campaign, they redeemed her.
Anyway, they managed to keep her alive to answer for her crimes. I think they stabilized her, slapped her in irons and took her back to Sandpoint to await transfer to Magnimar for trial. While in there, the two elves in the party had discovered the diary pages, and while awaiting a small contingent of Hellknights for prisoner transport, tried to convince her that there was still good in her. She took a few swipes at them but they stepped back in time to avoid demon hand to the face!
They tried to get to her by giving her a holy symbol of Desna, but that infuriated her and almost undid everything that they worked for... I had decided that she felt that Desna abandoned her when she needed Desna the most.
They had a full day, and tried everything that they could think of... finally, they decided that they were going to break her out and give her a chance to redeem herself. They were too late, the Hellknights arrived, early in the morning and took her back to Magnimar.
So the consulted their Varisian friend, a cleric of Cayden, the patriarch of a family passing through Sandpoint (entertainers at the Swallowtail festival.) The cleric, viewing Nualia as being bound by an exploitative contract, decided that he and the family would help stage a breakout.
Long story short, they broke her free as she was being transported from the dungeon to the site of her trial, and fled North along the Lost Coast road. A couple of days travel North, and the cleric performed a ritual of freedom, claiming that it will only work if she truly wished to redeem herself. (Behind the scenes, and angel of Cayden asked an angel of Sarenrae for help with the redemption bit.)
In a cleansing fire, the taint of Lammashtu was burnt away, leaving the scars on her belly as a reminder, and a Mark of Justice on her naked body. From then, she became a cleric of Cayden, keeping the Strength domain.
Of course, there was an encounter with a Hellknight tracker and his Hellhound companion. It would have been painful, but the party Sorcerer had a silver-tongue. The player played it out very well, so I gave him a bonus to Diplomacy to talk the Hellknight into making them responsible for her...
All in all, I was very happy with it. She ended up marrying one of my npcs and a player actually made an Aasimar PC that was her son, 15 years down the road... :)
Ah, sounds pretty cool. :D
Must have taken a lot of convincing though and I'm not sure how I could get that to work in my campaign. I don't really know the triggers that would allow for redemption.
I mean, she's practically given up on everything and sees herself as an ugly, vile beast, when in fact, at the minute she's a beautiful, vile Aasimar. :p
Should I set things up before the fight, so the players can get a bit of info on her, include optional things about her in Mr.T's journal, or just search out for those two Journal entries she has?
She'll be tormented by the past, so even if it's just a glimmer of hope, she'll be reminded of her once innocent and pure side, so I think she can be redeemed.
A lot of people on here have done it, at least.
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I think if you want to have that scene that you are shooting for, have the party able to stumble across her watching it while she steels herself for what needs to be done. It seems like something she would want to be private, but perhaps she doesn't have the means to go over it "privately" so they could witness it without her knowledge, or worse, she discovers that they have witnessed it and then she goes wild with anger! ;p
Have her watching what? I'm confused. :/
Stabbing herself?
That way, the PC's can read her journal entries before they find their way to Thistletop and hopefully they'll be a little more careful sbout just running in to kill her and may actually want to redeem her.
I'll have Tsuto's notebook fall out of his back pocket as he's running away from the Glassworks. :)
Ah, got you.
I just acquired that off of someone on here. I think he was called Cesare. :p
I didn't create any of that and if I intend to use it, I'd probably work with it, but still make it mine.
I found those two journal pages though and am writing them up into my own words. :)
I think the memory thing is a cool idea, but it'd make more sense if they found the pages and discovered her troubled past that way. Still, being shown through forced imagery (if they fail a Will save) is a good enough idea to keep me undecided on what to do! :p
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I used to hate Clerics, but find them pretty awesome now. You can do a lot with them. Charm Clerics of their own ideals are awesome. Demon Hunting Clerics are awesome. Battle Clerics can also be awesome.At the table, whilst playing a Cleric, players expect you to heal them whenever they ask, but I play my Clerics as people with goals in mind and if they're doing something else, or busy pursuing their own ideals, they're not gonna drop everything to heal someone. They're a person, not a bot who's only good at healing and that's what the group doesn't seem to see and is probably why they don't like them.
I hate that expectation, it completely limits clerics and actually weakens the whole team.
If you want to use your cleric in an interesting way, you could have him demand they pool resources for a wand of CLW or he isn't showing up again, then have him show up and do buffs+battlefield-control+ass-wupping.
After he's done that a couple of times he can disappear, leaving them with a wand of CLW and the message that clerics are not healbots.