PRD: At the start of a battle, before you have had a chance to act (specifically, before your first regular turn in the initiative order), you are flat-footed
Question: it applies even if I am not surprised? why?
because rogues need some love
because if your reflexes are slow, you can't get your defense up in time for that first hit.
Surprised is not a condition, if you are really surprised there is a surprise round, but if your initiative is just really low you are still taken a little bit by surprise.
To remedy this problem you could tell your GM when you want combat to start, if you see the ennemy for afar and the GM is still out of combat and tells you how things happen, you can ask him to please start combat order, thus you will meet the ennemies only when you're already in combat. (GM approval of course)
What I mean is this: We see a group of goblins 100 feet away from us. All of us see the goblins but the goblin dont see us. None of use are taken by surprise. So I think that we are all prepared so I dont thing that any of use should be flat-footed!
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What I mean is this: We see a group of goblins 100 feet away from us. All of us see the goblins but the goblin dont see us. None of use are taken by surprise. So I think that we are all prepared so I dont thing that any of use should be flat-footed!
If this is the case, and the goblins still don't see you when you begin to attack, then you actually get a surprise round against them. As such, everyone in your party will get to act before any of the goblins, and therefore by the time any of the goblins act, none of you are flat-footed anymore.
So the solution to the problem you describe is already built into the rules.
scenario 2: two characters will have a duel. Both are prepared waiting for the 1,2,3,go...
Why the second one to act should be considered flat-footed?
Because he was slower.
aaaaaahhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!
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Flat footed is not just about not being ready to fight. You can become flat footed for several reasons. Not least of which is a feint. You become flat footed from a feint because you don't know what you opponent is going to do.
I would imagine the same thing for a dual. When it starts both people are aware of the battle but one person is on the offense first while the other is on defense and reacting rather than acting. Since, for that brief moment where he is just slightly off guard, he is flat footed. but once he begins his counter attack then the flow of battle picks up and he is tracking his enemies movements better.
However if I was GMing such an event I would simply say that the battle began a round earlier and that both people where waiting out of etiquette. No flatfooted.
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scenario 2: two characters will have a duel. Both are prepared waiting for the 1,2,3,go...
Why the second one to act should be considered flat-footed?
Because he was slower.
I have to disagree with Jiggy's interpretation on this one. I would say that each character would have already rolled their initiative before the countdown had begun. They would both be holding their actions from the original initiative, so no surprise round (unless one jumps the gun and attacks early).
Sometimes I think that players assume that their characters are always ready for anything, so they do not like when they are flat-footed. Remember that if you win initiative against the opponent in the first round, most likely they will be flat-footed. Unfortunately, as characters go up in levels, monsters do get faster and faster...so it's not so easy.
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Speaking of quick duelists:
Two rapier-wielders with high DEX square off in a duel. They both have Combat Reflexes. Neither has Improved Disarm. The first one attempts a disarm, and both use all AoO's to disarm.
*ting-clang-clatter-pang-clink-WHIFFCLATTER*
"Winner!"
All in less than 6 seconds. ;)
Initiative is your reflex to act in a combat. Even though you aren't surprised in the combat, you're still slow to start moving. You're going from a standing-there-doing-nothing to a moving-and-ducking-and-swinging combat stance.
Remember that during combat, your character requires 5x5 foot square because they are moving around within that area and that contributes to your Dex bonus to AC.