Alter Self question.


Rules Questions

Grand Lodge

If I cast Alter Self to become a Strix, do I gain a fly speed?


You get exactly what alter self lists, pretty sure it has no fly speed listed


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No. Alter Self specifies what you can gain. A fly speed is not one of them (but a swim speed is). Compare Alter Self to Beast Shape - the latter specifically says you can get a fly speed.

Quote:
When you cast this spell, you can assume the form of any Small or Medium creature of the humanoid type. If the form you assume has any of the following abilities, you gain the listed ability: darkvision 60 feet, low-light vision, scent, and swim 30 feet.


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But you could go around complaining how you were an air adventurer until you took an arrow to the wing, probably adding "filthy human" to make your cover more believable.

Grand Lodge

So, if you are a Strix, and you use alter self, to turn into a Strix, you lose the ability to fly?

Grand Lodge

I was under the impression you got the movement types of the creatures you transformed into. I thought the Polymorph subschool cover this.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
I was under the impression you got the movement types of the creatures you transformed into. I thought the Polymorph subschool cover this.

Then why would nearly every polymorph spell list the modes of movement you can have, and their maximum speeds?

You don't automatically gain the forms movement modes - it all depends on the spell.

Quote:
In addition, each polymorph spell can grant you a number of other benefits, including movement types, resistances, and senses. If the form you choose grants these benefits, or a greater ability of the same type, you gain the listed benefit. If the form grants a lesser ability of the same type, you gain the lesser ability instead. Your base speed changes to match that of the form you assume.

That does not mean you automatically gain the movement modes. I believe that the bolded part actually refers only to your base land speed, not all the movement modes.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
I was under the impression you got the movement types of the creatures you transformed into. I thought the Polymorph subschool cover this.

Here is what polymorph says:

Quote:
In addition, each polymorph spell can grant you a number of other benefits, including movement types, resistances, and senses. If the form you choose grants these benefits, or a greater ability of the same type, you gain the listed benefit. If the form grants a lesser ability of the same type, you gain the lesser ability instead.

While a polymorph spell can grant many things, not all of them do. The first sentence is slightly unclear, but the reference to "listed benefit" makes it crystal clear: you only get what the spell says you get. In this case, this means that Strix who turned into a Strix would indeed lose the ability to fly.

Grand Lodge

Well, the spell does not go on to say you gain the natural attacks of the creature you change into. This does not mean that you do not gain the claws and bite when you change into a lizardfolk.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
Well, the spell does not go on to say you gain the natural attacks of the creature you change into. This does not mean that you do not gain the claws and bite when you change into a lizardfolk.

It doesn't have to, as the polymorph subschool says you get them.

Quote:
In addition to these benefits, you gain any of the natural attacks of the base creature, including proficiency in those attacks. These attacks are based on your base attack bonus, modified by your Strength or Dexterity as appropriate, and use your Strength modifier for determining damage bonuses.

Its in a separate paragraph. Its something you'll always get. The movement modes, however, are called out as something you can get, not something you will get.

Grand Lodge

Seems odd though.


I think alter self should not take away fly speed if both your base form and the assumed form can fly in a similar fashion though, it is not really something you gain if you already had it to start with.. is it.. ?

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