Outsiders as player characters questions

[Limeaid]

I was wondering, in the Bestiary it said that all outsiders native or not got BAB based on TOTAL HD, and gained all simple and martial weapon proficiency. Does this apply to player characters?

Under Humanoid it says it gets replaced by class level in the book. This is why i bring this question up.

[bigkilla]

No.

Unless you or the Gm decide that's what works in you're game.

[Mikaze]

Bigkilla is correct.

Outsider BAB and proficiencies only apply to outsiders with racial HD. Tieflings, aasimar, and other such native outsiders that are defined by their class levels don't get that stuff.

[wraithstrike]

No it doesn't. It is not worded well though. There was a thread on the issue where the devs said that certain things are gained through racial HD only, and the weapon proficiency was one of them.

It went into more detail than that, but basically you only get what is in the an aasimar or teifling's entry in the bestiairy. IIRC you do get immunity to charm person, and dominate person spells though.

[Limeaid]

So does this mean that the monstrous races in the bestiaries that are playable (along with outsiders) follow the rules of the humanoids or do they follow the rules of the monsters they are.

[bigkilla]

Limeaid wrote:

So does this mean that the monstrous races in the bestiaries that are playable (along with outsiders) follow the rules of the humanoids or do they follow the rules of the monsters they are.

They follow the rules presented in each individual entry for playing them.

[Limeaid]

Thanks for clearing this up. After looking at it, it gave me a major headache.

[Limeaid]

Now my next question is if you make an npc do they follow the rules in the back of the bestiary.

[Fredrik]

Here is my answer: if you're using the rules for monstrous characters and picking a Challenge Rating for everyone to start at, then player characters could have racial hit dice that would follow the rules for their race. (And of course NPCs can always be monstrous.) But if you're making something like an aasimar or whatever that doesn't have racial HD, then they're defined by class levels, and you only get what it says you get under the XYZ Characters part of the XYZ entry. (Notice how the sample aasimar cleric 1 NPC has a base atk of +0.)

[stringburka]

Its easier of you specify the question a bit. :)

[wraithstrike]

All creatures whether PC's or NPC's follow the same rules. The teifling is not denied access to those weapons because it might be used as a PC. It is denied access because it has no racial HD.

[Limeaid]

Could you then take a "level" in outsider as an aasimar and tiefling to get those bonuses like you could with monstrous races in 3.5?

[wraithstrike]

Nope. There is no way to get abilities a race does not have access to. Even in 3.5 you could not get get features a monster did not possess.

What 3.5 did was take high ECL monsters and treat them like classes so the benefits were gained over time in some cases, but you never got anything the base monster could not get anyway.

[stringburka]

However, allowing a pc to take a racial hd in outsider instead of the level shouldn't be gamebreaking. Pretty good, but not broken. It would be up to the ember though.