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Gonna try not to do the cliched grumpy 3am rant here guys.
But what's with all this talk of Pathfinder 2nd Ed and Dnd 5e?
Didn't we go through all this hype and drama with 4e not that long ago? Weren't we all annoyed that 3.5ed got scrapped in favor of something new and ultimately unworthy as a successor. If your like our group, til late 2009 we'd pretty much despaired over tabletop rpg's new content. We spent years and the one after playing 3.0/3.5/d20modern/true20/OGL/homebrew alternatives, because we thought that what was the point of investing in a new system where odds are that the Market pressure would force us to invest in yet another system every 3-5 years. Then Paizo came along and after watching it mature for a year I finally convinced my players to invest in it. I told them this system was for us, the discarded fans, that it was the true future of the game.
>3.75 Ed I heard a games store owner call it, and it convinced me.
Now what? We got 5e on the horizon and I'm getting the vibe that some people thing Pathfinder 2.0 is in order. Why? Didn't one of the most successful playtests in history finish less than 3 years ago? Is the current system so broken that power creep renders it unplayable? Are we not getting the best diversity of products? The best designers writing them? Has Paizo's offerings grown stale? Does this system need overhauling?
No.
Can we please stop speculating on a future edition war? We don't need a new edition every 3-5 years. We don't even need to be talking about one for another 3-5 years. You really thing the games going to get less fun? Or dated so quickly? The handful of AP's and modules we can afford to own are enough to last our various groups for years. Let WoTc get scared and try and woo us back with their 'new' edition. Maybe it's revolutionary, maybe it's regressive. Doesn't mean the rpg community wants it. There's pfrpg fans enjoying their game, and theres (one would assume) 4e fans enjoying their game. Who wants to fork out another few hundred bucks getting down with a new edition when they have a system in it's creative renaissance that they enjoy right now.
For those that look forward to 5e, enjoy the suspense. Meantime I'm gonna be enjoying the present. Maybe in a few years time I'll be reading a review and shaking my head at the flame war taking place in the comments page. Then I'll close the tab, and buy Pathfinder AP#73 and wonder then whether it's too soon to be talking about Pathfinder 2.0 .
Yeah I guess it came out as a rant afterall. Sorry Paizo Community. Feel free to ignore.
I like the current edition and I am not done with it, as such I see no need in clicking on a discussion about future editions that I have no interest in.
I'm still playing 3.5. ;)
Here here. I'm never getting rid of my old 3.5 players handbook or monster manuals.
Frostburn FTW. A friends hoping to start Jade Regent in a month or so, and guess where we'll going for inspiration. Gotta love that 3.5 compatability.
THE PRESENT IS FOR SUCKERS!! I WANT TO COMPLAIN ABOUT THINGS THAT HAVEN'T HAPPENED YET!!
Honestly though, I'm like TOZ; Well, house-ruled to hell and back, but y'know...
As for PF2E, I can't imagine Paizo doing anything just cause some people on the message boards have heard about 5E and started to worry about an edition gap.
In short: rant away, rants are fun :)
I'm still playing 3.5. ;)
Aren't you a rebel?
In short: rant away, rants are fun :)
You know... I do feel better now :)
But will it be long at all before this thread gets swept away by a tide of pointless speculation? I doubt it. Perhaps my rant should have been more evocative? And used words like 'darn' and 'blast' to really rile people up?Perhaps the 3.5/3.75 rebels of this threat would care to add lend their voices and pour on the Gasoline?
If WotC does release an older edition like it looks like they will, then maybe we can all enjoy the past as well.
If WotC does release an older edition like it looks like they will, then maybe we can all enjoy the past as well.
Yessiree. Go grab some root beer and crumbling old Ravenloft and go roll us some Die out on the veranda. Yep. Them were the days...
Gonna try not to do the cliched grumpy 3am rant here guys.
But what's with all this talk of Pathfinder 2nd Ed and Dnd 5e?
Didn't we go through all this hype and drama with 4e not that long ago? Weren't we all annoyed that 3.5ed got scrapped in favor of something new and ultimately unworthy as a successor. If your like our group, til late 2009 we'd pretty much despaired over tabletop rpg's new content. We spent years and the one after playing 3.0/3.5/d20modern/true20/OGL/homebrew alternatives, because we thought that what was the point of investing in a new system where odds are that the Market pressure would force us to invest in yet another system every 3-5 years. Then Paizo came along and after watching it mature for a year I finally convinced my players to invest in it. I told them this system was for us, the discarded fans, that it was the true future of the game.
>3.75 Ed I heard a games store owner call it, and it convinced me.Now what? We got 5e on the horizon and I'm getting the vibe that some people thing Pathfinder 2.0 is in order. Why? Didn't one of the most successful playtests in history finish less than 3 years ago? Is the current system so broken that power creep renders it unplayable? Are we not getting the best diversity of products? The best designers writing them? Has Paizo's offerings grown stale? Does this system need overhauling?
No.
Can we please stop speculating on a future edition war? We don't need a new edition every 3-5 years. We don't even need to be talking about one for another 3-5 years. You really thing the games going to get less fun? Or dated so quickly? The handful of AP's and modules we can afford to own are enough to last our various groups for years. Let WoTc get scared and try and woo us back with their 'new' edition. Maybe it's revolutionary, maybe it's regressive. Doesn't mean the rpg community wants it. There's pfrpg fans enjoying their game, and theres (one would assume) 4e fans enjoying their game. Who wants to fork out another few hundred bucks getting down with a new edition when they have a system in it's creative renaissance that they enjoy right now.
For those that look forward to 5e, enjoy the suspense. Meantime I'm gonna be enjoying the present. Maybe in a few years time I'll be reading a review and shaking my head at the flame war taking place in the comments page. Then I'll close the tab, and buy Pathfinder AP#73 and wonder then whether it's too soon to be talking about Pathfinder 2.0 .
I think the main problem is that we dont all want the same thing. Granted nobody needs another edition - but then again we probably dont really need another Adventure Path, either. That's not a good reason to stop writing them though.
I think it's too early for PF2 (if it ever proves desirable) and I think the next version of D&D will be too early if it launches anytime within the next eighteen months or so. Nonetheless - I have around a dozen RPGs on my shelf I've not actually played. Some of us like to browse through new rulesets and the inevitable new flavor material which accompanies it.
Anyone trying to plug a 'new edition' on the grounds that some other edition is broken is probably destined to find themselves enjoying similar threads to those we've seen in the last few years. When it's time for PF2, I hope it's not because some people think there's something wrong with PF1 - I hope it's because the designers have some cool, new ideas which will work better if they can be incorporated in the system from the ground up.
Because new RPGs take gamers away from old ones. Every group that plays 3rd Edition isn't playing 1st Edition, making it harder for the 1st Edition players to find a regular game.
Or to even get to play at a Con.
Go to PF 2e now and they'll likely lose me. I'm GMing PF by request and just barely getting comfortable with it. Making it my own so to speak. Change to 2e, and I'll refuse to touch PF again.
Okay, maybe that's a bit extreme. But I'm really not looking forward to edition changes until 2017 at the earliest. They are still coming out with too much cool PF stuff to stop now and try a restart.
PF is already outselling all other RPGs, WoTC & 5e is not a threat. Don't change a winning game plan.
--just my my 2 pence
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On the play-by-post site I use, there is about a 50/50 split between Pathfinder and Ad&D 2nd Edition, with a few games using other systems. Most of the old editions have their fun elements. The older ones have always intrigued me. I really like Stormbringer(all skill % based) and MERP(best critical/damage system I think, leading to epic battles).
Go to PF 2e now and they'll likely lose me. I'm GMing PF by request and just barely getting comfortable with it. Making it my own so to speak. Change to 2e, and I'll refuse to touch PF again.
Okay, maybe that's a bit extreme. But I'm really not looking forward to edition changes until 2017 at the earliest. They are still coming out with too much cool PF stuff to stop now and try a restart.
PF is already outselling all other RPGs, WoTC & 5e is not a threat. Don't change a winning game plan.
--just my my 2 pence
+1
Paizo doesn't need to feel threatened, it's earning the loyalty the fanbase just by delivering new material. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
In short: rant away, rants are fun :)
You know... I do feel better now :)
But will it be long at all before this thread gets swept away by a tide of pointless speculation? I doubt it. Perhaps my rant should have been more evocative? And used words like 'darn' and 'blast' to really rile people up?
Perhaps the 3.5/3.75 rebels of this threat would care to add lend their voices and pour on the Gasoline?
OK I'm just going to slip on my troll mask...
You want EVOCATIVE, you want GASOLINE? Everyone knows that Paizo straight up ripped off D&D 3.5, so now that 4e has been abandoned the next logical step is for Paizo to straight ripp 4e off too.
Takes off troll mask ...
Just kidding of course Paizo didn't really ripp anything off ;P.
They're reprinting AD&D 1st edition. I don't know if I still have my rulebooks in storage somewhere. If not, I might have bought them if they hadn't said they were changing the covers. Where's the nostalgia value in that?
Weren't we all annoyed that 3.5ed got scrapped in favor of something new and ultimately unworthy as a successor.
Nope.
When you start a thread calling for an end to edition warring, this is not a good way to start it.
The short answer, dont worry about it. Seriously. All those threads are populated by one or two people saying 'we want 2.0' and about a billion people saying 'dear god no'. Paizo isnt dumb enough to not notice that dispersion.
Not to mention the fact that they have said themselves they havent even started thinking about thinking about a new edition. Pathfinder 2.0 is still years away. James Jacobs (the creative director at paizo) said he wanted Pathfinder to have a 10 year shelf life before work was done on a new edition. They still have things like epic/high level rules to tackle, and psionics, and maybe (god willing) magic levels in the game before they will start worrying about a new edition to the game.
That and you have to remember that pathfinder rpg was made to support their flagship adventure paths and campaign setting, not the other way around. RPG books are not their primary source of income, new stories are. And those can continue to be told with the existing system.
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I'm still playing 3.5. ;)
That is no longer allowed.
<looks over at 3.5 books in my house>Nevermind. Continue as you were.
Where is all this info on 5th ed coming from?
From its announcement, last week.
As you say, "If I had time, ..." that is the issue. There is a limited amount of time people can play. You say you play PF and 4e. When 5e comes out, are you still going to be playing those and 5e or not play 5e. Also comparing something like Shadowrun to D&D is a different issue as these are not the exact same genre. Someone that might want to play SW:SAGA might not interest in playing any fantasy roleplaying game, whether D&D, PF, Conan, or whatever. (they might, but it is not a direct competition)
Money is also a factor. Many people don't have money to support two systems, and would rather get as many books for one system, than get lesser books for two systems. Eventually the system that gets played more gets the more money.
Money is an important issue. I've dabbled in plenty of different systems, but the majority of our groups resources went to 3.5 in it's day. Only for one day, WoTc to decide they want to bring in something that renders most of the old books moot. 5e is probably going to work on the same business plan. New customers are better than old customers in their model, get tomorrows generation into the game. But like with Magic the Gathering, that kind of turnover makes it hard to keep up to date with.
But if Paizo sticks to this '10 year game plan' (how many years are we into that btw?) then I know where my money's going. As you say, the cash goes into what you play most. As Paizo is providing for 90% of the material to scratch my groups gaming itch, and looks that its in the Market for the mid term. Why bother with an unproven system by an increasingly desperate looking WoTc?
I've seen no credible indication of a PF 2e being imminent - save from sour-grapesy 4vengers trying to suggest the advent of 5e is in no sense a sign of 4e being a failure.
I wouldn't worry about PF 2e being announced any time soon.
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Pathfinder 2e?? Good lord! I'm still just looking forward to the Advanced Race Guide and getting my hands on the Inner Sea book at this point!
Sure, when 5e comes out, and I mean actually COMES OUT where I can flip through it on a store shelf (and it is still only in the playtest stage at this point, so that's probably over a year away), I will take a look at it... maybe even shell out $40 for a PHB just so I can flip through it with time and the comforts of home, but will any of that stop PF from being awesome and suiting my group's needs with utter satisfaction? Nope...... Nope.