We have cleaned up some of the grammar and fine-tuned some of the abilities. Some things to notice:
- More balancing of classes, including the psyker replacement of the soulknife, soulbow, and psychic warrior.
- Expanded slot-bases psionics abilities (use conversion to move slots around).
- Introducing Primal Campaigns suited for tribal or primitive roleplaying.
- Psionics are now primarily charisma and constitution based. We went through many different variations of this and came back to our original idea (thanks to input from the Paizo community).
- Updated lore leading up to the reveal of the elan race and their role in human history.
- Alternate races (Anjnari, Amchitka, Golthari, Elans, Helians, and Wee Folk) that are meant to replace core races in primal campaigns.
- Added a list of some of the creatures to expect when everything is completed including the non-magical nullifier dragon.
- Added a preview of the Ectoplasmic Death creature.
- New archetypes: the suppressor, blood witch, and runecaster.
Available here on Paizo.com
I have had a lot of interest in ki based spell systems over the last few months. I'll check this one out.
Moving the discussion here instead of thread jacking the other.
For damaging psionic spells, would you rather have them scale like arcane spells (1d6/level max xd6) or have a set base and spend Ki to augment them?
My original plan was to have a set base and require augmentation to help balance the class better, but want input. I have been on that fence about that for many years.
Or do you have a better/alternate idea?
I would love to hear it (and make sure you get proper credit in the book, like we did for Dapifer).
What about the Genesis spell? I thought it said you sacrifice two ki points. I might have mistook that for a permanent reduction due to the change in language. If that was so then I am sorry.
What about the Genesis spell? I thought it said you sacrifice two ki points. I might have mistook that for a permanent reduction due to the change in language. If that was so then I am sorry.
Gotcha. We put the Ki sacrifice part in to replace the XP cost from SRD and gp from core. You gain the Ki back with XP, but it is clumsy.
We've been debating a change to that for a long time. The general idea is that you're pulling a huge amount of power from your body for those spells. With arcane and divine you can consume materials, with psionics it's just your body,
We are leaning towards replacing with fatigue, exhaustion, ability drain, and other conditions instead.
We did think of sacrificing rare gems or crystals (same money drain) but are trying to keep the magic component-free.
What about the Genesis spell? I thought it said you sacrifice two ki points. I might have mistook that for a permanent reduction due to the change in language. If that was so then I am sorry.Gotcha. We put the Ki sacrifice part in to replace the XP cost from SRD and gp from core. You gain the Ki back with XP, but it is clumsy.
We've been debating a change to that for a long time. The general idea is that you're pulling a huge amount of power from your body for those spells. With arcane and divine you can consume materials, with psionics it's just your body,
We are leaning towards replacing with fatigue, exhaustion, ability drain, and other conditions instead.
You might consider using the rules for negative levels since they no longer become actual level loss and while yes at higher levels greater restoration can easily fix it it still has enough of a cost to keep this from being too breakable imho.
You might consider using the rules for negative levels since they no longer become actual level loss and while yes at higher levels greater restoration can easily fix it it still has enough of a cost to keep this from being too breakable imho.
That's a possibility too, especially for some of those higher spells.
And it's better than Jeff's idea to have to psion drink 25,000 gp of wine in preparatIon. I love a good wine, but that's too much.
Idea Time
We're working off the food idea in combination with some Con or Negative level drains. Based on your feedback.
Limited Wish requires 1,500 gp of materials where Bend Reality (psionic version of the spell) was 300 xp.
Wish requires 25,000 gp of materials and Reality Revision costs 5,000 xp.
All other spells have the same conversion 1/5 the gp cost paid in xp.
So here's the plan ...
Bend Reality will drain 3 con and Reality Revision will drain 5 levels.
Con drain can be restored by consuming Manna, each serving restored 1 Con and costs 500 gp. It takes 1 minute to consume each serving.
Negative level drain can be restored by consuming Ambrosia. each serving will restore one negative level. Ambrosia will cost 5,000 gp per serving. It takes 10 minutes to consume each serving.
This will keep the money drain the same and provide a food source that can be used for any traditional Con or Negative level drain. Not many of the spells have this requirement, but I think it adds some nice flavor (pun intended) to the game.
And, if you have other magic, the downtime can be reduced.
Any other ideas for this?
One more thing, Talonhawke and The NPC, if you want me to include you as a contributor in the book please let me know. You can send me mail at editor@outsidenormal.com.
I can list you as your forum name or by your real name, your choice.
Jeff's making a change to the damaging spells. As written, they just are too underpowered now or cost too much.
Mind Thrust
Before
You instantly deliver a massive assault on the thought pathways of any one creature, dealing 1d6 points of damage to it.
Augmentation, Ki cost, Multiple
Increase the damage dealt by 1d6, 2, Yes
Increase the damage dealt by 1d6 (Telepath), 1, Yes
After
You instantly deliver a massive assault on the thought pathways of any one creature, dealing 1d10 points of damage to it for every point in your Ki pool (max 1/2 caster level).
Augmentation, Ki cost, Multiple
Increase the damage dealt by 1d10 (Telepath), 1, Max 5
Thoughts? This helps it line up better with the Neothelid's Mind Thrust ability from the bestiary.
Jeff's making a change to the damaging spells. As written, they just are too underpowered now or cost too much.
Mind Thrust
Before
You instantly deliver a massive assault on the thought pathways of any one creature, dealing 1d6 points of damage to it.Augmentation, Ki cost, Multiple
Increase the damage dealt by 1d6, 2, Yes
Increase the damage dealt by 1d6 (Telepath), 1, YesAfter
You instantly deliver a massive assault on the thought pathways of any one creature, dealing 1d10 points of damage to it for every point in your Ki pool (max 1/2 caster level).Augmentation, Ki cost, Multiple
Increase the damage dealt by 1d10 (Telepath), 1, Max 5Thoughts? This helps it line up better with the Neothelid's Mind Thrust ability from the bestiary.
I love the Manna and Ambrosia Idea. A question though can the drain/neg level also be healed from restorartion?
Also having spells function better the more ki one has left plus being able to spend it seems great that way a player has to decide wether to hold on to his ki or use it for more slots as the day goes on.
Jeff's making a change to the damaging spells. As written, they just are too underpowered now or cost too much.
Mind Thrust
Before
You instantly deliver a massive assault on the thought pathways of any one creature, dealing 1d6 points of damage to it.Augmentation, Ki cost, Multiple
Increase the damage dealt by 1d6, 2, Yes
Increase the damage dealt by 1d6 (Telepath), 1, YesAfter
You instantly deliver a massive assault on the thought pathways of any one creature, dealing 1d10 points of damage to it for every point in your Ki pool (max 1/2 caster level).Augmentation, Ki cost, Multiple
Increase the damage dealt by 1d10 (Telepath), 1, Max 5Thoughts? This helps it line up better with the Neothelid's Mind Thrust ability from the bestiary.
I love the Manna and Ambrosia Idea. A question though can the drain/neg level also be healed from restorartion?
Absolutely. You can choose to burn a spell or money to heal up. Almost have all the spells converted for Saturdays upload. It's looking really nice. Making conversIon cost Ki now but still keeping the idea of fluid spell levels. i
Also having spells function better the more ki one has left plus being able to spend it seems great that way a player has to decide wether to hold on to his ki or use it for more slots as the day goes on.
If thats the case you might want to lower you cost.
Restoration cures all drained to one stat for 100g. And a single Negative level for 1000g.
So maybe run similar cost into your items or maybe provide some kind of buff to go along with the healing. Just looking at it though i am paying 5x for the level and depending on the con lost i could easily be 15x the cost.
Very nice i like this.
Also i asked this in another thread i believe but anyplans for a Soulknife type character? Possible as maybe a monk alternate class?
Very nice i like this.
Also i asked this in another thread i believe but anyplans for a Soulknife type character? Possible as maybe a monk alternate class?
We did put together a class that combines the soul knife and psychic warrior. It's called the Psyker and is an alternate class for the bard.
It still needs some tweaking and balancing. It's kind of rogue-like but since it's a caster, it almost had to be an alternate of the bard.
It's the one I most want to play right now.
We also merged the Wilder into the Psion class as a 7th discipline (undisciplined) choice.
Awesome I love what i am seeing thus far keep up the good work.
Awesome I love what i am seeing thus far keep up the good work.
Jeff had a massive brain storm/fart and is late in getting the update out. We completely revised how all the energy based spells work and how damage is calculated.
Power level will be either your caster level or the number of points in your Ki pool, whichever is lower. Psionic spell damage will be based on power level instead of caster level (with mins/maxes without spending Ki.
There will be a 0 level spell for either each energy type, or groups of energy types that you must cast to attune yourself to an energy. The energy based spells create damage based on that energy affinity.
Allows for some balancing that you need to spend a round to switch damage types, but can have utility spells that work for all energy. Added more energy types and effects as well.
Boosts to power level will also come from feats, abilities, and augmentation.
Added all the Ki food and added abilities to making it at 1/2 cost (for those that like crafting - I'm not one myself).
He's burning the midnight oil instead of playing Rift with me, so back to my raid.
Still working on the update. Spells are converted and abilities are getting a once-over.
Putting finishing touches on the Kinetic Archer (gunsmith archetype), Soul Singer (bard archetype), Peacemaker (paladin archetype), Spirit Shaman (druid archetype), and a few other things.
Started adding equipment and weapons.
Reduced the spells per day of the psion to more closely match SRD.
Got a draft of the lore for the Drakons. Looking very nice. Thanks Cookie.
Interviewed a few more artists.
Ate lots of hamburgers.
Is the psion keeping the medium armor proficiency?
Also, I wouldn't mind being mentioned as a contributor :) Should I give my named by post or send it to you?
Playtested the Psion(Seer) as presented in the latest update, (CON/CHA)
The player is feeling confident and is very much liking the Seer, up to level 4 now, she's liking it very much as a player and as a GM I haven't encountered problems with it thus far.
I really want to take the Psyker for a spin, my first 3.0 character was a Psychic Warrior so the Psyker is looking really sexy for me, sadly I only run a regular game as a GM so I won't have to opportunity to play one from level 1, but I am working on an NPC being a Psyker just to test the waters of what it can do at level 7 or so.
Regarding the Elan: I liked the word "Caste" better than "Clan", but I am enjoying more the Clans as presented than the older Castes, the extended background they offer is very much welcomed and I agree with the decision of making them lore options, and then creating the Racial Traits specifically to give mechanical advantages.
Overall it's looking very good, but a little edition nitpick, the Anjnari racial description regarding speed reads "Elans have base speed of 30 ft." instead of Anjnari, you probably spotted that already but I figured it couldn't hurt to mention it just in case.
Is the psion keeping the medium armor proficiency?
Also, I wouldn't mind being mentioned as a contributor :) Should I give my named by post or send it to you?
Send me an email please. editor@outsidenormal.com That way you don't have to reveal it in an open forum. This is when I wish we had a PM feature here. :)
And yes, they will keep medium. I see the psion as being a cleric/sorcerer hybrid in a way.
Playtested the Psion(Seer) as presented in the latest update, (CON/CHA)
The player is feeling confident and is very much liking the Seer, up to level 4 now, she's liking it very much as a player and as a GM I haven't encountered problems with it thus far.
I really want to take the Psyker for a spin, my first 3.0 character was a Psychic Warrior so the Psyker is looking really sexy for me, sadly I only run a regular game as a GM so I won't have to opportunity to play one from level 1, but I am working on an NPC being a Psyker just to test the waters of what it can do at level 7 or so.
Regarding the Elan: I liked the word "Caste" better than "Clan", but I am enjoying more the Clans as presented than the older Castes, the extended background they offer is very much welcomed and I agree with the decision of making them lore options, and then creating the Racial Traits specifically to give mechanical advantages.
Overall it's looking very good, but a little edition nitpick, the Anjnari racial description regarding speed reads "Elans have base speed of 30 ft." instead of Anjnari, you probably spotted that already but I figured it couldn't hurt to mention it just in case.
Thank you! I'm hoping the power level change will help the seer out some, she's definitely more of a roleplay/defensive choice than an offensive choice.
Thanks for catching the Elan thing, lots of cut and pasting from different sources as we pull stuff out of draft. We're going to push out an update today finally. Take a look and let us know what you think.
Playtested the Psion(Seer) as presented in the latest update, (CON/CHA)
The player is feeling confident and is very much liking the Seer, up to level 4 now, she's liking it very much as a player and as a GM I haven't encountered problems with it thus far.
If she has any ideas to make it "feel" right let me know. I will be working on lore for each discipline next week, detailing how they fit into a Primal campaign and tribal society. I am always open to suggestions.
I want to say thank you for the encouraging and critical emails I have received. You are helping bring focus to this project and make the game better for everyone involved. Whether you post here, send email, or comment on the other forums, we review all your suggestions.
You are a great community. Thank you.
If she has any ideas to make it "feel" right let me know. I will be working on lore for each discipline next week, detailing how they fit into a Primal campaign and tribal society. I am always open to suggestions.Playtested the Psion(Seer) as presented in the latest update, (CON/CHA)
The player is feeling confident and is very much liking the Seer, up to level 4 now, she's liking it very much as a player and as a GM I haven't encountered problems with it thus far.
Well, she's playing a varisian Psion, she wanted to be a wandering fortune teller, that's why she picked Seer, she feels it helps with her concept, at first using more skill in Bluff and her charms to con folks into paying her gold for a card reading, but as her powers develop she will become more and more a true reader of the future.
So actually the discipline already feels right for her, in fact she was very happy when I presented the option of using the Psion instead of the Sorcerer she had in mind, because the Seer fits her concept a lot more than what the vanilla Sorcerer would, she was very glad and willing to help me test the waters with the class, so all was good with our table.
If she has any ideas to make it "feel" right let me know. I will be working on lore for each discipline next week, detailing how they fit into a Primal campaign and tribal society. I am always open to suggestions.Playtested the Psion(Seer) as presented in the latest update, (CON/CHA)
The player is feeling confident and is very much liking the Seer, up to level 4 now, she's liking it very much as a player and as a GM I haven't encountered problems with it thus far.
Well, she's playing a varisian Psion, she wanted to be a wandering fortune teller, that's why she picked Seer, she feels it helps with her concept, at first using more skill in Bluff and her charms to con folks into paying her gold for a card reading, but as her powers develop she will become more and more a true reader of the future.
So actually the discipline already feels right for her, in fact she was very happy when I presented the option of using the Psion instead of the Sorcerer she had in mind, because the Seer fits her concept a lot more than what the vanilla Sorcerer would, she was very glad and willing to help me test the waters with the class, so all was good with our table.
WOOHOO Awesome news!
There will be an update later today. We are finally breaking the two resources apart. Book 1 will be the core psionics rules for use with Pathfinder. No new races or creatures, just how to merge psionics into your campaign.
The secnod book will be The Guide to Fermia. All the new races, lore, deities, and creatures will be covered there. The resource will be useable stand alone, with our psionics rules, or with legacy rules (power points).
Book 1 is in a true platters-ready state.
There will be an update later today. We are finally breaking the two resources apart. Book 1 will be the core psionics rules for use with Pathfinder. No new races or creatures, just how to merge psionics into your campaign.
The secnod book will be The Guide to Fermia. All the new races, lore, deities, and creatures will be covered there. The resource will be useable stand alone, with our psionics rules, or with legacy rules (power points).
Book 1 is in a true platters-ready state.
I like that idead. Legacy Rules will be a optional variant I take it?
I like that idead. Legacy Rules will be a optional variant I take it?There will be an update later today. We are finally breaking the two resources apart. Book 1 will be the core psionics rules for use with Pathfinder. No new races or creatures, just how to merge psionics into your campaign.
The secnod book will be The Guide to Fermia. All the new races, lore, deities, and creatures will be covered there. The resource will be useable stand alone, with our psionics rules, or with legacy rules (power points).
Book 1 is in a true platters-ready state.
Yes. We have two optional rules were are putting in for testing. The first one is that psionic, arcane, and magic are all different. This is instead of psionic being the only different one. The second rule will be a power point system suitable for all classes that is backwards compatible with the SRD for psionics.
It looks like I won't get the release out today, had to make a trip to the ER. My son decided it would be fun to roll down the steps. He failed his acrobatics check.
We just pushed the update with the book split, cleaned up rules, and a bit more lore.
The first book, <i>The Power of Ki</i> is ready for full playtesting. We need to clean up the magic items section (making some overhauls), so ignore some of those random tables and some of the item creation rules.
Most of the focus is now shifting to <i>The Guide to Fermia</i> and fleshing out that world. I'm still waiting on artwork.