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Maybe it is time to consider the mini AP. As something above and beyond. I know things are stretched but if new hires go out, then a possible option would be the 3 book mini AP. Perhaps done every other month like adventures. A bonus with them is they could be set at different levels sorta a cross between a adventure series and a AP.Except I believe they tried something like that with the modules line (series of three linked adventures) and I don't think it did all that well. Not poorly, just not well enough for them to want to do it again.
Yeah but I think part of the reason AP's do well is not the adventure part. Which is twice the size in a AP anyways. But also the supporting stuff to make the adventure even better. That's why I think a mini AP would work better and likely be a success. I don't know it will but I think it very well could. Plus it would be a chance to do things like a follow up to Rise of the Rune Lords and do a high level mini AP that picks up a couple of years or more after the last one ended. Not saying they should do mini AP's for all the AP's or even all that often. Just saying doing a high level follow up mini AP now and again would be a option.
I like the idea of mini-APs — campaigns of only three installments, rather than six. My preference would be to situate them in-between the normal APs; like Morse Code — long, short, long, short, etc.
If that isn't feasible, design the occasional AP in such a way that said AP can be run only partially, but still have a sense of closure. The best example of this would be something similar to The Second Darkness. The first three installments of Second Darkness work just fine as a campaign in their own right. However, if the group wishes to continue, there are three more installments to do so with. Otherwise, "The Armageddon Echo" serves as a great finale without feeling abruptly abbreviated.
Just some thoughts...
If storytelling is your where you find enjoyment, burnout certainly isn't a problem!From my own experience I'd say you can enjoy storytelling too much, and that can lead to GM burnout as well. Did in my case as I tried to run too many APs simultaneously (most of them as PBP) which resulted in me going into hiatus for over a year.This.
Also, sometimes you just want to start telling a different story. RPGs take up a significantly larger chunk of time than any other gaming medium. So the level of commitment is quite huge. Sometimes you get bored of the massive novel and just want to go and tell a fun short story without the baggage and having to remember loads and loads of details
I'll stand by what I said. I currently run three campaigns: a 2E Forgotten Realms campaign that's been going for 1.5 years, Rise of the Runelords (ongoing 14 months now), and Serpent's Skull (ongoing 11 months now). I'm also in the plotting stage for another campaign in 2E Forgotten Realms (which will be my last in that world), and am looking into doing work for Carrion Crown, which I'll be running with the slow XP progression chart because of all the extracurricular stuff I wish to incorporate into it.
Amidst that, I'm working on a possible novel idea (aspiring writer) and have completed a novella and seek to begin my second shortly.
I love storytelling, and I truly enjoy when my players have fun with the stories I tell. It's not a baggage for me to do all this because (unlike writing for publishing) there's instant gratification here, which actually makes it easier to tackle! I seriously appreciate the mentality that you will push through something because you started it, as that's an incredibly respectable way to live in everything you do, but if you enjoy the very elements of storytelling, telling the story can be a driving force in and of itself.
And believe me, I understand the desire to tell different stories! I have plenty of them germinating in my head at any given time! Usually, to help keep these at bay while running multiple campaigns, I will run quick side games with certain players who show an interest that are only 1-5 sessions long. Sometimes, we'll do these instead of the campaign for a couple weeks, or other times we'll get together on open nights when nothing else is going on. Also, I plan special themed games, such as our annual Halloween game, which are typically one-shot deals.
One thing about running APs: they make being a GM so much easier! I used to have to write all my own campaigns, which I loved, but with the APs Paizo does a great job giving you the roots of a story to which you need only customize it for your individual group of players. This helps to save on time during the busy months, which is why I've really been backing them. I really do appreciate the work they do with their AP line and have very little issue with any of them. I'd not desire for them to change anything about them specifically. If I wanted to tell a shorter story, I'll either create one myself or run a module (they've had a few great ones).
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Our Adventure Paths are currently one of the most successful aspects of the entire Paizo operation. They're what they are after nearly 10 years of adjustments and learning from previous mistakes. It's very very very very unlikely we'll ever make significantly drastic changes to the format. Any adjustments to the AP line we do make will be in the form of "baby steps," such as how we adjusted the first page of the adventure or added magic item and NPC appendices to Jade Regent.
Changing the length of an AP or starting one at anything other than 1st level, I fear, would damage the AP's success in the long run. Might even damage it in the short run.
I like the AP's as they are and don't want them changed, with that said though...
Maybe it is time to consider the mini AP. As something above and beyond. I know things are stretched but if new hires go out, then a possible option would be the 3 book mini AP. Perhaps done every other month like adventures. A bonus with them is they could be set at different levels sorta a cross between a adventure series and a AP.
I would definitely buy into a "mini AP"; once every other month or every three months sounds about right! you can even make them part of the Pathfinder Modules series for all I care, as long as there's a clear way to tell which modules are linked to the other modules, I'm in! :)
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Yeah but I think part of the reason AP's do well is not the adventure part. Which is twice the size in a AP anyways. But also the supporting stuff to make the adventure even better. That's why I think a mini AP would work better and likely be a success. I don't know it will but I think it very well could.Maybe it is time to consider the mini AP. As something above and beyond. I know things are stretched but if new hires go out, then a possible option would be the 3 book mini AP. Perhaps done every other month like adventures. A bonus with them is they could be set at different levels sorta a cross between a adventure series and a AP.Except I believe they tried something like that with the modules line (series of three linked adventures) and I don't think it did all that well. Not poorly, just not well enough for them to want to do it again.
YESSSSSSSSSSSS! that is awesome!
it would bring something akin to a comic book experience quality to the AP plotlines! to pick up after APs with mini APs is GENIUS! it not only provides additional high level options for the Pathfinder line but it also ADDS VALUE to the existing APs, in the long run, as some people will want to buy old APs again before they get into the mini APs... you deserve a big pickle DARK MISTRESS!!! HUZZAH!
Now the next step: convert all old APs from 3.5 to PRPG rules! :)
I would definitely buy into a "mini AP"; once every other month or every three months sounds about right! you can even make them part of the Pathfinder Modules series for all I care, as long as there's a clear way to tell which modules are linked to the other modules, I'm in! :)
Did you buy the 3 modules that already did this? (Crypt of the Everflame, Masks of the Living God, and City of Golden Death.) Because my impression was that sales of linked modules indicate that it isn't worth doing. While I love the modules line, I believe it is Paizo's lowest selling line.
Plus it would be a chance to do things like a follow up to Rise of the Rune Lords and do a high level mini AP that picks up a couple of years or more after the last one ended.
YESSSSSSSSSSSS! that is awesome!
it would bring something akin to a comic book experience quality to the AP plotlines! to pick up after APs with mini APs is GENIUS! it not only provides additional high level options for the Pathfinder line but it also ADDS VALUE to the existing APs, in the long run, as some people will want to buy old APs again before they get into the mini APs... you deserve a big pickle DARK MISTRESS!!! HUZZAH!
Now the next step: convert all old APs from 3.5 to PRPG rules! :)
Sadly, sales tell Paizo that this would be a money sink. In each AP, Issue #1 sells more than issue #2 which sells more than #3, etc down to issue #6 which has the lowest sales. So if they do a mini AP that is very high level and picks up after #6, they know sales for #7, #8, and #9 will be even lower than #6.
This is because far more games start a campaign than finish them.
If people really want Paizo to produce more high level modules and high level support, you need to buy all of the level 15+ modules available. Preferably within the first month of release where the sales numbers really matter.
I know I want more high level material, but historically high level adventures sell poorly.
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Plus it would be a chance to do things like a follow up to Rise of the Rune Lords and do a high level mini AP that picks up a couple of years or more after the last one ended.YESSSSSSSSSSSS! that is awesome!
it would bring something akin to a comic book experience quality to the AP plotlines! to pick up after APs with mini APs is GENIUS! it not only provides additional high level options for the Pathfinder line but it also ADDS VALUE to the existing APs, in the long run, as some people will want to buy old APs again before they get into the mini APs... you deserve a big pickle DARK MISTRESS!!! HUZZAH!
Now the next step: convert all old APs from 3.5 to PRPG rules! :)
Sadly, sales tell Paizo that this would be a money sink. In each AP, Issue #1 sells more than issue #2 which sells more than #3, etc down to issue #6 which has the lowest sales. So if they do a mini AP that is very high level and picks up after #6, they know sales for #7, #8, and #9 will be even lower than #6.
This is because far more games start a campaign than finish them.
If people really want Paizo to produce more high level modules and high level support, you need to buy all of the level 15+ modules available. Preferably within the first month of release where the sales numbers really matter.
I know I want more high level material, but historically high level adventures sell poorly.
Yeah my point was that was something they could do now and again. Mostly I see the mini AP line as more of a way they could do bigger adventures with more support and a short series. They could start some at level 1, others at level 5 or 8 or 10 etc. I mentioned the follow up as something they could do every now and again. I am aware they don't sell as well and not advocating they do it a lot. But the two big ones I think so far that would make interesting follow up's too is RotL and Kingmaker. Maybe do one high level one out of ever 6-10 of them are so. Either way having a second short mini AP's line gives them some extra options, with out screwing up their main AP line.
I know, it's just frustrating when you make a character, invest a lot of time into writing his background, creating his intrests and the likes, building him from scratch, playing him... And then all that goes to garbage because DM gets bored with DMing at lvl 7.
To prevent GM burnout, we switch campaigns every 2 Chapters, it also helps that this is our first Pathfinder experience so our characters are leveled at the same rate. Currently, we have played Kingmaker, and Carrion Crown. We start Curse of the Crimson Throne next week, and then after I will be GMing Serpent's Skull.
The AP's are fantastic because the variation on flavour is so drastic that the campaigns do not blend together and they really standout as a truly unique playing experience.
I wouldn't change them at all.
I know, it's just frustrating when you make a character, invest a lot of time into writing his background, creating his intrests and the likes, building him from scratch, playing him... And then all that goes to garbage because DM gets bored with DMing at lvl 7.To prevent GM burnout, we switch campaigns every 2 Chapters, it also helps that this is our first Pathfinder experience so our characters are leveled at the same rate. Currently, we have played Kingmaker, and Carrion Crown. We start Curse of the Crimson Throne next week, and then after I will be GMing Serpent's Skull.
The AP's are fantastic because the variation on flavour is so drastic that the campaigns do not blend together and they really standout as a truly unique playing experience.
I wouldn't change them at all.
I don't understand how it works. You play 2 chapters of one AP, then hit pause and play 2 chapters of some other AP?
If that's the case, I wouldn't like that type of play. Even in the best case scenario of 2 chapters for 2 months (but that would never happen) that would mean a too big gap between playing the same character. You forget what was happening in AP, where were you, what are you supposed to do, get out of touch with character, etc.
I don't understand how it works. You play 2 chapters of one AP, then hit pause and play 2 chapters of some other AP?
If that's the case, I wouldn't like that type of play. Even in the best case scenario of 2 chapters for 2 months (but that would never happen) that would mean a too big gap between playing the same character. You forget what was happening in AP, where were you, what are you supposed to do, get out of touch with character, etc.
Maybe we are just used to it, because we have played that way for approx. 15 years.
We have 8 hour sessions once a week and we get through a chapter in 2-3 months. When we switch over we usually take some time to recap. The only adversity we faced was remembering rule changes when we were switching between star wars saga, 4th ed, d20 modern, and dnd 3.5
Thank God we are all on board with playing only Pathfinder games now.