Pre-identified Magic Items on purchase?

[Monele]

I am currently generating magic items available for purchase in my campaign's starting town (well, village) and suddenly wonder if purchaseable items should be considered pre-identified or not. I don't see anything in the rules saying they should be... but it also seems strange for a merchant to sell something if he doesn't know what it is (especially when it comes to pricing).
The only case I can see working is a merchant knowing he's selling a Wand of Fireball, but not knowing how it works (Command Word). Well, is that even possible?
Another example is scrolls: the user is supposed to decipher them before use, right? So that would mean even if they know it's a Scroll of False Life, they have to use Read Magic or the Spellcraft skill to actually use them? Does that mean they could be sold a scroll that is not what they expect, unless they Read Magic while shopping?

[BigNorseWolf]

A shopkeeper is going to have to identify it anyway so he doesn't pay 20,000 gp for a wand of cure light wounds.

Its also not a good business model to rip off your customers.

Its REALLY not a good business model to rip off customers who kill dragons.

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The only case I can see working is a merchant knowing he's selling a Wand of Fireball, but not knowing how it works (Command Word). Well, is that even possible?

-only if he's being a real cheapskate and using detect magic instead of identify. Even then selling a wand without a command word is like selling a car without keys.. you need to wait for a buyer who CAN and is willing to hotwire the car every day. In otherwords, identify the damn thing and sell the command word with it.

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Another example is scrolls: the user is supposed to decipher them before use, right? So that would mean even if they know it's a Scroll of False Life, they have to use Read Magic or the Spellcraft skill to actually use them?

They have to decipher the entire page, not just the title.

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Does that mean they could be sold a scroll that is not what they expect, unless they Read Magic while shopping?

If thats the case, the seller had best be selling off the back of a mule cart, because if he has a permanant base it will be burned down faster than you can say marshmellow.

[Monele]

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Its REALLY not a good business model to rip off customers who kill dragons.

Very VERY good point there.

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Quote:

Another example is scrolls: the user is supposed to decipher them before use, right? So that would mean even if they know it's a Scroll of False Life, they have to use Read Magic or the Spellcraft skill to actually use them?

They have to decipher the entire page, not just the title.

It's what I understood, yes. So it's very akin to buying a book in a foreign language... Just knowing what it is doesn't mean you can read through it if you don't know the language.

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Quote:

Does that mean they could be sold a scroll that is not what they expect, unless they Read Magic while shopping?

If thats the case, the seller had best be selling off the back of a mule cart, because if he has a permanant base it will be burned down faster than you can say marshmellow.

Agreed, but I was thinking of the possible shady back alley deal in that case ;) I take it there could be some skullduggery going on in such a case then, whether it's a good idea or not for the seller.

Thanks for the reply, it's making things clearer!

[Roaming Shadow]

Well, if we're talking black market/buyer beware scenario and the heroes know there's the potential of getting ripped off by a disreputable dealer, you could make the whole process similar to gambling.

The was a diablo-esque game I used to play that had a gambling merchant. All you knew when buying was the type of item and the price, but had no idea what the properties were. Granted, that game had more variable factors on the weapons than Pathfinder does, but the prinicpal can still apply. The dealer prices the weapon on looks, and maybe even on making up what the weapon is.

Of course, given the identification abilities heroes have, such a shady dealer will really have to know his stuff to sell to adventurers, but it's possible. Then it's possible that the guy is trying to peddle wares he honestly has no idea of the worth, as he either is too cheap to have someone identify it, or some other reason for not letting it be known he has it (such as strict trade guild regulations regarding the selling of such items. In such a case, the players may get something on the cheap, or end up overpaying.

Of course, a savy wizard can turn it to his advantage, identyfying something and bluffing its true level of power to haggle the price down. You've got a lot of potential options as to what can go down here.