Synthesist-wild shape questions


Rules Questions


So I am trying to figure out how Sythesist would stack with Druid in wild shape.

To use an example. Lets say we have a Druid 8/Synthesist4 who wants to either transform into a Dire Tiger or a Large Earth elemental.

-Would the AC Bonuses/STR/DEX bonuses stack?
-To use the dire tigers attacks would I need to have a bite and arms evolution?
-Could I not add extra arms to make weapon attacks on top of my natural attacks? (POUNCE!)
-Do I have to have a large evelution to wild shape into a large creature or is it okay as long as I wildshape after I summon my Eidolon? (Large would mean have 8 levels of Synthesist)
-Would my BAB be 9/4 or 3?


lostpike wrote:

So I am trying to figure out how Sythesist would stack with Druid in wild shape.

To use an example. Lets say we have a Druid 8/Synthesist4 who wants to either transform into a Dire Tiger or a Large Earth elemental.

-Would the AC Bonuses/STR/DEX bonuses stack?

The AC Bonus would not stack. The Synthesist does nt get a STR/DEX/CON bonus, it uses the eidolon's base STR/DEX/CON as its own. Also, when you summon the eidolon it says you use its natural armor bonus.

So if you wildshaped and THEN performed the ritual to merge with the eidolon, you'd simply have all the eidolon stats. Of course, doing this as a large creature would be impossible, as you'd now be larger than your eidolon.

Doing things the other way around, though, since you and the eidolon are now one creature, you'd essentially both be wildshaping. If you wildshaped into a dire tiger, you'd get +4 size bonus to STR and -2 DEX, and no additional natural armor (significantly worse than the large evolution you'd be able to Evolution Surge if you'd gone Synthesist 8).

Quote:
-To use the dire tigers attacks would I need to have a bite and arms evolution?

No, regardless of which order you wildshaped/merged with eidolon. But you'd still be limited in number of natural attacks by the eidolon's table. Even though the dire tiger possesses 5 natural attacks, you'd only be able to use 4 of them thanks to the max attacks table for Synthesists. A generous GM might let you use all of them, since the eidolon's own rake evolution only counts as one natural attack.

Quote:
-Could I not add extra arms to make weapon attacks on top of my natural attacks? (POUNCE!)

Polymorph does not preserve your limbs, so it would not work if you merged with the eidolon before using wildshape. If you did it the other way around, then you'd probably gain your evolutions on top of the wildshaped form, but unfortunately you wouldn't be able to do this with a large wildshape form, since your level 4 eidolon isn't large or larger.

A much simpler way to accomplish this would be to make a straight synthesist with a quadruped, take pounce, and also take some extra arms if you desire.

Quote:
-Do I have to have a large evelution to wild shape into a large creature or is it okay as long as I wildshape after I summon my Eidolon? (Large would mean have 8 levels of Synthesist)

As long as you wildshape after already summoning, you won't need a large eidolon, since the merged form is wildshaping and not just the person inside, making you both large.

Quote:
-Would my BAB be 9/4 or 3?

Your BAB would be 3 from your summoner levels and 6 from your druid levels. You'd have 9 BAB.

The Synthesist 12 would be a lot more powerful than a Druid 8/Synthesist 4. Not as much on-the-fly flexibility, though, as its only flexibility is through evolution surge.

Note that you'd lose a lot of your evolutions while wildshaped "While under the effects of a polymorph spell, you lose all extraordinary and supernatural abilities that depend on your original form (such as keen senses, scent, and darkvision), as well as any natural attacks and movement types possessed by your original form."

All in all, I'd say that this combination is at least unoptimal.

Dark Archive

Something to note Omelite, the AC bonuses could stack if the eidolon was built correctly:

From the PRD:

Quote:
Armor Bonus: The number noted here is the eidolon's base total armor bonus. This bonus may be split between an armor bonus and a natural armor bonus, as decided by the summoner. This number is modified by the eidolon's base form and some options available through its evolution pool. An eidolon cannot wear armor of any kind, as the armor interferes with the summoner's connection to the eidolon.

You could create the eidolon with the AC as armor bonus and thus the wildshape would be natural AC (which would stack as a different type).

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