Spoilers, omg. Players, beat it.
I'm interested in discussing what I see as a paradox surrounding the charge left to the PCs, to protect Kendra for 30 days, with that of raiding the spooky prison.
Here's my thoughts on this:
- If the players turtle up and try and protect Kendra, the hauntings grow more dangerous. This is clearly spelled out in the module. However, this growing danger merely causes the players to realize all the more that they cannot leave Kendra alone.
- There is no one in town that could defend Kendra, so the PCs aren't left with the option of leaving her in someone's care. Probably the best choice for this would be the temple . . . and it's not a bad choice, definitely a route out of this.
- You can't just try and solve this by having Kendra get killed because, excusing the "we must avenge her death!" bit, the PCs are likely to just pack up and leave town. You've got a suspicious and superstitious town that is anything but welcoming. The only thing keeping the PCs from leaving these farmers to their doom is Kendra. So that's pretty much out of the question.
- The PCs could bring Kendra along, but I really don't want to encourage that. Having a goodly NPC to care for is a resource drain on the party and the DM. And it'd also be a (albeit low-level) pocket diviner which could possibly imbalance some things.... maybe?
I had previously posted in the threads looking for advice on how to endear the party to the town, make them feel like their job here was to do more than ask Kendra if she needed any painting done around the house. It was suggested that I amp up the horror by having some of the events occur - such as the hauntings called out in the module or the zombie attack (including old dead pappy) but all that has done is turned my PCs into babysitters. They are taking shifts staying by her side, day and night, to protect her. Hell, they thought the HOUSE was haunted for a while until I was able to add in some elements that lead them to believe it was more of a town-thing.
Sure, they get it now, they get that Harrowstone is where they need to go, but they are really unsettled about what to do about Kendra.
Given no brilliant suggestions from my colleagues here I suspect my PCs will try and stick Kendra with the priesthood and go off adventuring. That's not a bad approach. Do you have any ideas of how that itself might be made more interesting?
I guess I just see this as a fundamental issue with the module that PCs who are really role-playing have a hard time getting around.
Interesting. As written, I don't think it is a big issue. As I recall, the module does not have Kendra being specifically targeted (unless you run the optional event of having Petros return as a zombie, which I think is laying it on too thick or otherwise an off note), so there isn't much reason to think that Kendra wouldn't be safe if she lays low or gets a minimum of help from a hired guard or the like.
If the GMs have had TSM or other undead targeting Kendra (or making Ravengro a living hell for absolutely everyone), then it is an issue of their own creation (I don't know whether I will end up in this category or not), and I think it makes sense to make sanctuary at the Temple a suitable option. This will probably require that the PCs have maintained good relations with Father Grimburrow. And perhaps the Father can impose some conditions on the PCs as a condition for taking Kendra in, such as the performance of a specific rite at the prison, or retrieving and returning something from one of the upper levels, or general limits on how the PCs conduct themselves in dealing with the undead. Also, if the temple is providing shelter to Kendra so the PCs can enter Harrowstone, the temple effectively becomes more involved in the mission, and it may provide an opportunity for them to give the PCs some additional material assistance (potions, holy water, etc.).
Interesting. As written, I don't think it is a big issue. As I recall, the module does not have Kendra being specifically targeted (unless you run the optional event of having Petros return as a zombie, which I think is laying it on too thick or otherwise an off note), so there isn't much reason to think that Kendra wouldn't be safe if she lays low or gets a minimum of help from a hired guard or the like.
If the GMs have had TSM or other undead targeting Kendra (or making Ravengro a living hell for absolutely everyone), then it is an issue of their own creation (I don't know whether I will end up in this category or not), and I think it makes sense to make sanctuary at the Temple a suitable option. This will probably require that the PCs have maintained good relations with Father Grimburrow. And perhaps the Father can impose some conditions on the PCs as a condition for taking Kendra in, such as the performance of a specific rite at the prison, or retrieving and returning something from one of the upper levels, or general limits on how the PCs conduct themselves in dealing with the undead. Also, if the temple is providing shelter to Kendra so the PCs can enter Harrowstone, the temple effectively becomes more involved in the mission, and it may provide an opportunity for them to give the PCs some additional material assistance (potions, holy water, etc.).
Yeah but that's just it Voomer, why do the PCs want to go investigate this spooky prison if they are charged with protecting Kendra? Maybe it's because they are goodly and want to save the poor townsfolk (which, again, aren't inviting in the least). But my PCs completely turtled up and spent the first few days literally escorting Kendra around town.
My first several DM sessions were like this:
My PCs: "I ask Kendra what I can do to help her today."
me: "Umm... she says she's got some cleaning around the house to do. She's going to go through her father's things."
My PCs (all 6 of them): Cool, I hang out and help her do that today. Oohh! I cook dinner. Oo, I help her fix the squeaking doors that have been bothering her.
etc/etc/etc.
I mean, that's good and all, but they needed to get involved in the story. We did the Event 1, they saw the "V" and they went - meh, vandals. Which, again, I think is the point early on. They heard some rumors in the bar but really had no motivation to deal with it. Literally my PCs were very carefully keeping track of the days, trying to wile away their 30 days so they can get out of here to Lepistadt and get their coinage and get to a town with some real CULTURE! Literally they kept trying to make me fast forward daytime. Let's keep this thing going! Let's get to nighttime to we can survive the night.
I am, as you put it, in a creation of my own making in that I sent things to target Kendra. The problem is, while I want/hoped they would go "we must stop this, onward to Harrowstone!" they went "omg this place is haunted. Redouble our efforts, reinforce the doors, I want people stationed at every window, patrols, working in shifts, we will sleep during the day." Now our daytime is spent sleeping as they wait for the spooks at night.
Once again, this is pretty cool. I enjoy it, but it's sort of off the rails.
Thanks for replying with what you did James, it is encouraging to hear that it was intentional.
Yeah but that's just it Voomer, why do the PCs want to go investigate this spooky prison if they are charged with protecting Kendra? Maybe it's because they are goodly and want to save the poor townsfolk (which, again, aren't inviting in the least). But my PCs completely turtled up and spent the first few days literally escorting Kendra around town.
This seems like the product of a pretty unusual PC thinking process. Lorrimor was obviously very concerned with the goings on at Harrowstone, as reflected in his journal, so I think most PCs would view taking on the evil in Harrowstone as part of their mission. Also, if the evil is coming from Harrowstone, and Kendra still intends to stay in Ravengro, the PCs aren't protecting her unless they clean out Harrowstone. I would think the journal entries would have been enough to point your PCs to Harrowstone as the ultimate source of the problems.
In my game I bequeathed the players special magic items (basically, legendary weapons which will grow in power with the players), contingent on them adopting Lorrimor's aim of combating the growing evil in Ustalav (Lorrimor told the PCs to turn the weapons over to his friend in Lepidstadt if they aren't interested). Plus, one of our PCs is a Calistra vengeance cleric from blighted Nex, so motivating her to take on the undead evil in the prison isn't a problem.
I think if you make it clear they need to wipe out Harrowstone to truly protect Kendra, and subtly offer the Temple as a sanctuary for her, the game will get back on track. Since you've customized the module to make TSM attack Kendra and the PCs in the Lorrimor home (as I recall from other threads), maybe make the hauntings stop there and strike at other sympathetic characters in Ravengro. That should make the PCs less worried about Kendra and more motivated to attack the evil at its source.
I do think that not many GMs will face the problem you're facing, at least to the degree that you've described. For most, I think keeping them from charging into Harrowstone will be more of a problem. In another thread, a GM said his players charged right into Harrowstone, down the pit, and are now facing TSM. Whoops!
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Heh. You haven't met some of the player's I've played with. Taking Kendra along is SOP. I've had games where they went out of their way to arm NPCs, offer protective training (basically, how to go defensive in the party formation) and dedicated evac techniques.
My players tend to be Magical Engineer Commandos mind you and developing tactics where they, the NPCs, and everything else they do is part of the fun.
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My first several DM sessions were like this:
My PCs: "I ask Kendra what I can do to help her today."
me: "Umm... she says she's got some cleaning around the house to do. She's going to go through her father's things."
My PCs (all 6 of them): Cool, I hang out and help...
I think you should have used some other tasks. The PC's found the diary. its spells out that the Prof was investigating Harrowstone. Kindra would propelry like to know WHAT really happend....so there is a motivation. also if the charaters are sitting on the buts....and letter by letter passes them by....have [whats his name again] a go at Kendras lovly cator if you want to force it...Kendras blood for the next letter. THAT should get them going and ralize that if they dont do anything the town is done for and with that Kendra.
In regards of Protection....take out the Prison and all is good.
Said that my group IGNORED the Momument. Even after I put in a heated discussion between some NPS's over the scandal that someone vandalized it. The didnt even WENT there yet....instead they are ploting to have the leader of the Thugs [again forgot his name] murdered.....OJ Gewalt