Staff Magus and using Staff for Spell Combat

[LoreKeeper]

At level 10 a staff magus can use a staff as if it were a magical quarterstaff with an enhancement bonus based on the staffs casterlevel. So far so good. What I want to know is if the spells cast using the staff's charges can be done as part of spell combat, or whether only the magus' innate prepared spells can be used for that.

Thanks :)

[Belafon]

LoreKeeper wrote:

At level 10 a staff magus can use a staff as if it were a magical quarterstaff with an enhancement bonus based on the staffs casterlevel. So far so good. What I want to know is if the spells cast using the staff's charges can be done as part of spell combat, or whether only the magus' innate prepared spells can be used for that.

Thanks :)

There is an arcana that lets you do that.

[LoreKeeper]

Oh thanks, I see. I stopped thinking when I read "wand" in Wand Wielder.

[Bobson]

Oddly, that's not listed as a suggested arcana for that archetype. I also question how that arcana is supposed to work, since if you're using spell combat, you're going to want a weapon in one hand, and the other has to be free (which keeps you from holding a staff or wand in it).

[LoreKeeper]

Oh, that isn't a problem: at level 1 the Staff Magus gains Quarterstaff Mastery as a bonus feat. This allows him to wield a quarterstaff one-handed. Thus spell-combat works fine, and when not spell-combating you can 2Hander it or double-weapon it.

[LazarX]

Bobson wrote:

Oddly, that's not listed as a suggested arcana for that archetype. I also question how that arcana is supposed to work, since if you're using spell combat, you're going to want a weapon in one hand, and the other has to be free (which keeps you from holding a staff or wand in it).

Just because it's not suggested doesn't mean anything more than the designers like most of us had their moments when they didn't read past the "wand" description.

Also remember that the Staff Magus gets the feat that allows the staff to be wielded in combat with one hand. The Wand wielder feat is being read from the general use perspective as anyone other than a Staff Magus would be using another weapon for the combat portion of the Wand Wielding arcana.

Also note that the Staff Magus WOULD still have the option of using a wand for the purposes of Wand Wielder as well. He'd be using the wand in his off hand.

[JRutterbush]

The problem isn't with the staff magus and the ability, the problem is the staff magus is the ONLY type that can actually use the ability at all. You can't use a staff with spell combat unless you have Quarterstaff Mastery, since spell combat requires a free hand, and you'd need your other hand to be holding a weapon to attack with, unless you're a Monk/Magus. You can't do it at all with a wand, since there's no feat that allows you to use the wand as a weapon.

What this needs is an errata'd sentence at the end:
"When wielding a staff or wand in your off-hand, that hand counts as if it were empty for the purpose of Spell Combat."

[Patrick Gurdgiel]

JRutterbush wrote:

The problem isn't with the staff magus and the ability, the problem is the staff magus is the ONLY type that can actually use the ability at all. You can't use a staff with spell combat unless you have Quarterstaff Mastery, since spell combat requires a free hand, and you'd need your other hand to be holding a weapon to attack with, unless you're a Monk/Magus. You can't do it at all with a wand, since there's no feat that allows you to use the wand as a weapon.

What this needs is an errata'd sentence at the end:
"When wielding a staff or wand in your off-hand, that hand counts as if it were empty for the purpose of Spell Combat."

While a clarification would be good, I think I'd go with the "specific trumps general rule" and say it's allowed as is:

Quote:

Spell Combat (Ex): At 1st level, a magus learns to cast spells and wield his weapons at the same time. This functions much like two-weapon fighting, but the off-hand weapon is a spell that is being cast. To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand.

Quote:

Wand Wielder (Su): The magus can activate a wand or staff
in place of casting a spell when using spell combat.

Again, while it would be nice if it was clearer, I would contend that the Wand Wielder Arcana modifies the 2nd bolded sentence to effectively become:

"This functions much like two-weapon fighting, but the off-hand weapon is a wand/staff being activated.

As soon as the wand/staff becomes your off-hand weapon it seems obvious that you also have to replace

"To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand."

with

"To use this ability, the magus must have a wand or staff in one hand, while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand."

The arcana modifies spell combat and we can reasonably assume that it is intended to modify it in a functional fashion. Would have been nice if it was clearer, but its not surprising that they didn't explain it all out (just like the "Close Range" ability didn't call out multiple rays until someone pointed out Scorching Ray).

[Bobson]

JRutterbush wrote:

The problem isn't with the staff magus and the ability, the problem is the staff magus is the ONLY type that can actually use the ability at all. You can't use a staff with spell combat unless you have Quarterstaff Mastery, since spell combat requires a free hand, and you'd need your other hand to be holding a weapon to attack with, unless you're a Monk/Magus. You can't do it at all with a wand, since there's no feat that allows you to use the wand as a weapon.

What this needs is an errata'd sentence at the end:
"When wielding a staff or wand in your off-hand, that hand counts as if it were empty for the purpose of Spell Combat."

Yeah, that's what I was getting at. I like your fix - it's nice and clear, short, and allows for holding the staff or wand even if you aren't casting from it that turn.

[Belafon]

The more I look at it the trickier this becomes to correct. I think we all believe you should be able to activate a staff even if you are wielding it as a double (two-hand weapon). Maybe something like:

Wand Wielder (Su): The magus can activate a wand or staff in place of casting a spell when using spell combat. The magus is not required to have a free hand in order to activate a wand or staff as part of spell combat but must use a light weapon, one-handed weapon, or the staff being activated for all melee attacks this round.

I threw that last bit in there to prevent "I activate my wand, then drop it, quick draw my elven curve blade, and lay into my enemies."

Edit: Your solution works fine as written, I would just be concerned about future material that relied on an "empty hand in spell combat" being published that could then be exploited. There's probably some changes that should be made to mine as well.