I'm putting together a VTT game with some friends, and my wife is thinking about joining up. The only problem (and it's sort of a big one) is that she doesn't want to go in without a firm understanding of the core rules. She hates feeling like she's out of her depth and she hates asking questions even more.
I've tried to show her how to play before, and I am horrible at it because so many things are second nature to me and I never know where to start. Is there something resembling a 'tutorial module' for PRPG? Something that goes about introducing all the major game concepts in a methodical sort of way? If there isn't...well, first I'd humbly suggest that someone put one together, because I think it would sell. My kids are very young, but when they're older I'm going to try to turn them on to tabletop RPGs and something like this would be very useful. But it'd be good for anyone who is just learning to play.
Second, how would you start a process like this? Previously, we've started with character creation and worked our way out from that, but I think that's a bad way to go. I think it'd be better to start off with a pre-made character or something so we aren't bogged down in source books at the outset. It needs to start off fun and simple, and slowly court all the nuances in the ruleset in a way that isn't overwhelming.
I'm rambling now, but any advice is much appreciated! Specifically, what concepts must be tackled and which ones can wait, what order to do them in, that sort of thing would be very helpful.
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Well I guess we all learned by reading the rule books in middle or high school, and we well kept on reading for well for me its probably been 30 years by now. And we all have played with our friends, in our basements, their basements, schoolrooms, dorm rooms, now our own basements and dining rooms. That’s how we learned. I have learned by playing making mistakes, and learning how to do things a little better next time.
I have over the past few years DMed at a local toy store / gaming store. We regularly have kids in who haven’t played Pathfinder. What I do instead of telling them they have 17 to 18 character classes to choose from, and drowning them in rules, is that I ask them what sort of character concept are they thinking of, or what movie / comic book/ animae/ novel characters do they like. We first work on character concept, and I make an initial character to try and express this character concept or movie character.
When they start, I do my best to encourage them to ask questions, and when they ask what can I do, I try to offer concrete examples, such as “ you can move behind the cactus and wait for the fire elemental to pass, would you then like to sneak up behind it and try to back stab the fire elemental? Or would you like to …… etc”
As they learn a little more, I encourage them to start piecing together a character.
Now if your wife only wants to enter a new situation if she understands all of the rules, and she doesn’t want to ask questions, I suppose at the moment the only viable solutions is the “phone book” of the Pathfinder rule book. She will have to read it. I apologize that isn't very helpful.
Perhaps anther possibility might be to both photocopy say 4 character classes, Lets say, fighter, Rogue, Oracle and Sorcerer, and have her pick from those.
And then maybe if you write up a couple of summaries, of how skills and combat works… and include the basic concept of what is it called where you have rules, and feats that allow you to make an exception.
IE: If you make an unarmed attack (punch kick etc) on an armed character (with a sword) he gets to make an attack of opportunity on you. If you have the feat Improved unarmed strike, you do not provoke an attack of opportunity when you make an unarmed strike on an armed opponent.
Perhaps running something like the module Crypt of the Ever Flame and the accompanying Flip map might also be a good place to start.
Oh maybe another possibility might be watching “The Gamers” and “Dorkness rising” or something like that.
I hope that my rambling response has been of help
I have been teaching my girlfriend about pathfinder recently and it is really tricky business. Because you can get derailed into the minutiae quite quickly. There are a lot of rules...
I suggest setting up something low-level and small (a really basic tutorial encounter or simple quest) with you, her and a few monsters to show her the ropes of interacting and combat using some pre-made characters.
If she has a character or archetype in mind, try to put that kind of general character in her hands (melee, spells etc).
I find the visual teaching (with minis) helps a lot. This way you can show her about AoOs instead of abstracting the ideas and waving your arms wildly. As does cutting right to the action.
As Starglim said, suggest ideas and let her experiment and tell her the ramifications of her actions. I guarantee she'll be better than you in no time.
Then you can work in things like, oh this guy has a Long Spear. This guy is going to grapple you.. he looks pretty beat up, he'll go into a defensive stance etc. Address things as they come along and do your best to explain things (even from the prospective of the attacking creatures/enemies). Just remember there are a lot of play options so keep her aware of what is available for her to do. Combat maneuvers, spells, different weapons, actully talking to the enemy etc.
After the idea of the game is explained, you can then get into character specifics because the combat and character creation/roleplay rules can really be defined as separate entities.
If its learning the Mechanics, You can set up some Simple scenarios. like..
Protect the children, She is escorting some children and a group of goblins has arived!.
Then let her maked the dicisions to defeat the Goblins.
Simple and Straight Forward and The scenario can be done more than once to understand what went wrong.
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It's been my experience that new players are most concerned about looking dumb during the actual game play. Once your wife chooses a class, you can help her put together a character sheet and have her highlight the sections she will use most often. I use Hero Lab which makes a fairly clean character sheet.
Then run her through sample battle with her character using minis. She doesn't need to know how to do everything--just the combat maneuvers and attacks her class would most likely use. If she starts at level 1, her own proficiency will grow with her character. She'll pick up techniques from the other players and add them to her arsenal.
Learning to play an RPG is a bit like learning a language or how to play an instrument. Break it into baby steps and go from there.
+1 to alll the suggestions so far. I'm playing with some new players, and I pre-made some characters for them, based on their concepts. We jumped right in, and I explained movement, actions, etc., as we played along. After a few hours, they had the hang of it, and were having a blast. They climbed ropes, cast spells, critted a monster or two, and just generally had a hoot.
Ok, there are three things that will help here (I'm a professional educator, if that makes you feel better)
1) You MUST get across the idea of actions.
Swift + Move + Standard vs. 5ft step and full-round
Make a handout with columns, and list the things you can get done in a turn.
Be sure to list 'special move' as one of the standard actions. If someone tries a trip attack - point out how it's working.
2) You must allow her to succeed, or she'll quit. There's nothing more demotivating than "Actually, because of a rule in a book you've never read, you've died".
3) Bring rules in one at a time. This may mean your experienced players are worrying about encumbrance and your wife isn't. THIS IS FINE. There was a time when those players got rules wrong too. If they start saying anything, you have to say something IMMEDIATELY.
So, (and talk about this), when your wife has mastered, say, combat maneuvers, you can bring in attacks of opportunity. Not before. Until then, she neither provokes nor takes AOs.
The best way I've found to teach AOs is to put a post-it note under each medium-sized mini. That way, you can see the threatened areas.
After that, it's MUCH easier.
What I'd probably do is make her a pre-gen character, maybe level 2-3 (or level 1 with "extra hit points")
then design a very very simple dungeon. maybe 1-3 hallways with twice that many rooms with "some thing" in every room. Each room designed to teach her something about the game.
Maybe something to show her about searching/perception another encounter to show her AoO's, something to run away so she can see how movement actually works in combat, and such.
With the first (or second) one being.. showing how combat actually works.
You can even start it off with some RP by the king/mayor/whatever sending her off to fetch some widget that's at the end or whatnot.
The point not being to kill her- but to show her how the game works. After that, you can sit down abit and work on helping her make her own character.
The hardest thing about making a character is that first timers do so without ever having actually played the game.. so they have *no clue* what skills are really good for or what feats do.
Make her a pre-gen and run a short for her, so she can see how the game plays out. I think you'll enjoy it and she will to.
And if she hates it.. well, thats something she can figure out before the VTT session(s).
-S
what rkraus2 said plus
make it clear that RPGs are not about knowing all the rules.
Many adults, that are introduced to the game, approach it like some sort of a boardgame, in which the rules are to be followed always and everything else is bad/cheating.
A good house rule that my old group used to use was that any person who has never played before starts as a first level human fighter. Presumabley the rest of the group is first level also.
Fighters more than any other class have the potential to be fairly easy to play and understand. Being human is also very easy to grasp for most of us. ;-)
It gives the new player the ability to have something to do (swing a sword) while learning the basics on the fly.
Once the player has a decent understanding of the game they can swap out whatever character they want at the appropriate level.
Its been a very effective teaching tool over the years.
A good house rule that my old group used to use was that any person who has never played before starts as a first level human fighter. Presumabley the rest of the group is first level also.
Fighters more than any other class have the potential to be fairly easy to play and understand. Being human is also very easy to grasp for most of us. ;-)
It gives the new player the ability to have something to do (swing a sword) while learning the basics on the fly.
Once the player has a decent understanding of the game they can swap out whatever character they want at the appropriate level.
Its been a very effective teaching tool over the years.
I'd just add sorcerer to that. If you want to use weapons, 1st level fighter. If you want to throw spells, 1st level sorcerer. They are more complicated than a fighter, but some people just want to do magic.
The best way that I've used to teach D&D is by having the person play. Don't boggle the newcommer with stats and rules, and just play. Of course, you'll have to use the PC more like an NPC at first; suggesting courses of action (simple choices), and telling him/her to roll certain dice. Then slowly, gradually, showing that player combat rules, making him/her understand what it is he/she is actually rolling.
If that new person can losely follow a story, I swear it'll all come naturally.
I've tought many players this way. Works great.
Ultradan
The best way that I've used to teach D&D is by having the person play. Don't boggle the newcommer with stats and rules, and just play. Of course, you'll have to use the PC more like an NPC at first; suggesting courses of action (simple choices), and telling him/her to roll certain dice. Then slowly, gradually, showing that player combat rules, making him/her understand what it is he/she is actually rolling.
If that new person can losely follow a story, I swear it'll all come naturally.
I've tought many players this way. Works great.
Ultradan
I actually agree. I've seen folks get way too condescending with newcomers...especially wives/girlfriends. Some folks are far too ready to overemphasize minutae to newcomers; no one needs to know grapple rules until they come up. Heck, let's be fair. Most folks don't remember grapple rules WHEN they come up.
My suggestion? Pick up hero lab/PCGen. Find out what kind of character they want to play--I tend to encourage fighter sorts, but don't force the issue. Make a character, or help them make one.
Then just walk them through a single mock combat round--pcgen or hero lab make it pretty straight forward--roll d20, add *this* number to it. If I say you hit, use *this* to get your damage. if I ask for AC, it's here. If I ask for Saves, they're here. If I ask for skills, they're here.
After that, you can point them at the rules online or loan a book, but I typically emphasize that even the DM doesn't typically know all the rules by heart, and many players remember little more than the stuff listed above ;-)
I'd just add sorcerer to that. If you want to use weapons, 1st level fighter. If you want to throw spells, 1st level sorcerer. They are more complicated than a fighter, but some people just want to do magic.A good house rule that my old group used to use was that any person who has never played before starts as a first level human fighter. Presumabley the rest of the group is first level also.
Fighters more than any other class have the potential to be fairly easy to play and understand. Being human is also very easy to grasp for most of us. ;-)
It gives the new player the ability to have something to do (swing a sword) while learning the basics on the fly.
Once the player has a decent understanding of the game they can swap out whatever character they want at the appropriate level.
Its been a very effective teaching tool over the years.
Sorcerer didnt exist back when I did this, but it's a good idea.
I have always started by explaining the basic mechanic of the d20 system.
If you want to do something, you roll a d20. If you roll high enough for the thing you want to do, you do it.
The things you want to do have difficulties, which is represented by the number you have to roll on the d20 -- a wall with a difficulty of 15 is harder to climb than a wall with a difficulty of 12.
Once they understand this, the rest follows very smoothly.
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"Orc and Pie" by Monte Cook, actually titled "The Shortest Adventure Ever" (or something) is a teach D&D "adventure" where the DM just has the new Player use a PC to kill an orc in a dungeon and steal the orc's pie.
It's a great way for a new Player to get a feel for the different dice, how combat works, that kinda schtick, without actually being in a game.
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I'd show her the d20 and explain the d20-system concept (if there's a chance of failure in the action you want to try, roll a d20, hope for a high number).
Then show a set of pre-gen Ability Scores and point out the modifiers.
Then some pre-gen HP, AC & Saves.
Then a pre-gen BAB and weapon.
. . . . Then, with just that, play some "Orc and Pie."
. . . . Then help her build her first PC.
Sorcerer didnt exist back when I did this, but it's a good idea.
This has always seemed like a good idea in principle, but I've had bad results trying to force the issue. Just because folks haven't played DnD before doesn't mean they don't have a character idea--DnD didn't invent the idea of a bard, for instance. In the end, they're most likely to keep playing if they feel attached to their character, whether or not they pick the rules up quickly.
I certainly point at certain classes and say "these are easier to learn" but if someone wants to be a rogue, telling them "no" is a fast way to scratch a potential player off the list.
To be honest, days before the game, my first questions for potential players are not "have you read the rules?" They're usually more along the lines of "Do you have a favorite fantasy novel? What's your favorite character?" Get them thinking about the character instead of the rules!
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"Orc and Pie" by Monte Cook, actually titled "The Shortest Adventure Ever" (or something) is a teach D&D "adventure" where the DM just has the new Player use a PC to kill an orc in a dungeon and steal the orc's pie.
It's a great way for a new Player to get a feel for the different dice, how combat works, that kinda schtick, without actually being in a game.
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I'd show her the d20 and explain the d20-system concept (if there's a chance of failure in the action you want to try, roll a d20, hope for a high number).
Then show a set of pre-gen Ability Scores and point out the modifiers.
Then some pre-gen HP, AC & Saves.
Then a pre-gen BAB and weapon.
. . . . Then, with just that, play some "Orc and Pie."
. . . . Then help her build her first PC.
+1000
"Orc and Pie" by Monte Cook, actually titled "The Shortest Adventure Ever" (or something) is a teach D&D "adventure" where the DM just has the new Player use a PC to kill an orc in a dungeon and steal the orc's pie.
Ahahahahaa. That is awesome. I'd never heard of it before but I'm totally using that in the (extremely unlikely) event I ever need to teach a new person how to play.
The best way I've found to teach AOs is to put a post-it note under each medium-sized mini. That way, you can see the threatened areas.
After that, it's MUCH easier.
+8 (one for each threatened space)
Also +X to W E Ray (Where X is the number of new players)
When I teach RPGS, the first thing I say is "Roll the D20- now you know how to play." It's a bit of a joke, but for a lot of people that takes the edge off.
Next, I bring out a pre-gen character and highlight the final numbers for attack and damage. A lot of new players get lost in all of the numbers on a character sheet. Pointing out "This one to hit, this one to damage, ignore the rest," helps a lot. Same goes for skills- highlight the final skill mod. column and throw out a few easy examples, like climb for climbing trees or diplomacy for talking your way out of a fight.
Once you know how to roll skills and combat, you know how to play the game. Better to save teaching character creation for after the player has tried actually playing and knows they want to delve deeper. Character creation is one of the hardest-to-master parts of the hobby, and I've known more than one player to get lost in that sea of potential combinations and never return.