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So, I'm to play in a game that will use 3.5 rules, but I've never played 3.5 before - I went from modified AD&D straight to Pathfinder (Alpha, then Beta and so on). So, I need an advice what is best possible build for a gish character. My stats are: 17,18,16,14,9,9. Starting level is 6. Thanks in advance.
Broad area. Let's narrow it down some, eh? Which books are allowed? Do you have a character concept in mind? Do you prefer melee or ranged combat? What level will you be starting at? Ending at? Do you have any details of the campaign? Campaign world?
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Broad area. Let's narrow it down some, eh? Which books are allowed? Do you have a character concept in mind? Do you prefer melee or ranged combat? What level will you be starting at? Ending at? Do you have any details of the campaign? Campaign world?
Starting level is 6. Campaign world is home brew, but is something like Greyhawk, at least I think so. I'm waiting for DM to decide is Book of Nine Swords allowed, but barring that, I think anything else is OK, and perhaps even that. I'd like to play melee oriented character, perhaps something like PFRPG magus, and I'd love a build that would allow me to be a party face if needed. Perhaps going with Charisma heavy character and Leadership feat somewhere.
sounds like an arcane duelist bard to me...
==Aelryinth
Starting level is 6. Campaign world is something like Greyhawk, at least I think so. I'm waiting for DM to decide is Book of Nine Swords allowed, but barring that, I think anything else is OK, and perhaps even that. I'd like to play melee oriented character, perhaps something like PFRPG magus, and I'd love a build that would allow me to be a party face if needed. Perhaps going with Charisma heavy character and Leadership feat somewhere.
A couple more questions to help round things out:
Do you know how much wealth you will have?What books do you own that you can draw from?
When you look for the best possible build are you looking for pure DPR or are you looking for a bit of flexibility?
The magus (Ultimate magic playtest) is a good way to go. Arcane duelist (Bard archtype), and I have fun playing warlocks.
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Well the gish I liked to use in 3.5 was a fi 1/wizard 6/spellsword 5/abjurant champion 5/EK 3. No 9th level spells...but you have spell channel which is just fun. Spell channeling anti-magic field = no magic for you de-buff...no save. Spell channeled solid fog line of spells were also a really good screw you with no save. Abjurant champion is a no brainer tho if your allowed 3.5 materials for any gish build.
However from a more power orient PoV, fi 1/wizard 5/EK 2/abjurant champion 5/EK 7 would be better. Don't worry about the EK capstone...the abjrant champion will be eating up your swifts even if arcane stike/arcane armor training isn't.
Well the gish I liked to use in 3.5 was a fi 1/wizard 6/spellsword 5/abjurant champion 5/EK 3. No 9th level spells...but you have spell channel which is just fun. Spell channeling anti-magic field = no magic for you de-buff...no save. Spell channeled solid fog line of spells were also a really good screw you with no save. Abjurant champion is a no brainer tho if your allowed 3.5 materials for any gish build.
However from a more power orient PoV, fi 1/wizard 5/EK 2/abjurant champion 5/EK 7 would be better. Don't worry about the EK capstone...the abjrant champion will be eating up your swifts even if arcane stike/arcane armor training isn't.
It'd be a good idea to replace a single level of EK in the second build with a single level dip of Spellsword from Comp. Warrior. You'll gain a BAB, a level of casting, Fort and Will Saves, and ignore a bit of Spell Failure Chance.
Also, as most of your spells should be buffs and battlefield control don't worry about having your casting attribute too high. The minimum to cast each spell level you want should be fine, and there are plenty of offensive spells that don't rely on a saving throw if that is your wont.
Complete Mage has the Abjurant Savant PrC. It's 5 levels, and gives you full BAB, full casting, and some neat class features.
Or try the Duskblade from PH2. It's pretty gishy.
EDIT:
If you want to be melee with occasional bursts of magic, duskblade seems like a no brainer. Good BAB, Good Fort and Will, 1d8 HD (meh), decent selection of skills, and eventually gets something like 9 spells per spell level (and 5 levels of spells). A lot of its spells are swift cast 1 round buffs, so you can fight AND cast in the same round. It's an Int-based caster, not Cha, but it might be fun to play a Cha 9 wannabe face?
18 Str, 16 Dex, 17 Con (boost at 8), 14 Int (boost at 12), 9 Wis, 9 Cha.
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Starting level is 6. Campaign world is something like Greyhawk, at least I think so. I'm waiting for DM to decide is Book of Nine Swords allowed, but barring that, I think anything else is OK, and perhaps even that. I'd like to play melee oriented character, perhaps something like PFRPG magus, and I'd love a build that would allow me to be a party face if needed. Perhaps going with Charisma heavy character and Leadership feat somewhere.A couple more questions to help round things out:
Do you know how much wealth you will have?
What books do you own that you can draw from?
When you look for the best possible build are you looking for pure DPR or are you looking for a bit of flexibility?
I presume that I'll have maximum wealth per level. And I have everything published for 3.5. I would like to create a flexible character.
If you are looking to be a melee-capable, face gish that emphasizes the face aspect you could always go paladin -> battle sorcerer (UA) -> eldritch knight. You're saving throws and HP will remain relatively high, though a lack of Int might make your skill selection suffer a little bit. You've got good enough rolls to pull it off well. Pulling law devotion from Comp. Champion will help keep your AC relevent for longer, and divine might (I think it was called) from either PHB 2 or Comp. Warrior (I forget which) will help round out your damage along with buff spells.
As noted by others above, abjurant champion is an amazing class with easy to meet prerequisites. And if you qualify for eldritch knight, you likely qualify for spellsword, so you should always take a one level dip into it first.
I'm personally not a big fan of duskblade; I've always found wizard / fighter to be more versitile, but it is a solid class that might be right up your alley.
If you end up mixing martial and arcane classes like wizard / fighter instead of taking a class with casting progression like bard or duskblade, remember to look into practiced spellcaster if you have any open feats, it will keep your CL up which can affect the power and duration of you buff spells.
Gestalt, huh? I love Gestalt! Fighter/Sorcerer I would say, put the 18 on charisma, sink Int and Wis and spread the three other numbers for your phisical atributes depending on what kind of fighting you want to do. See if you can get some levels on a PrC or a feat that will allow you to diminish the spell failure chance, like Spellsword.
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Opps, ringtail is right, 1 level of spellsword is good. 10% ASF reduction means you can wear mithiral chain shirt and mithril small shield without using swift actions.
I don't agree with having a low casting stat...especially with what was rolled. Yes SC has a lot of no save blasty spells...but any BC spells or debuff you may want will have saves...and unless your the fifth wheel, you should still be chucking these spells out as a gish. That is why the duskblade is so weak. If you are the fifth wheel and you wanna do blasting and melee, the duskblade is better fit.
As far as the magus goes...well if it had full bab and d10 hp, it would kick the living snot out of the duskblade since it does so NOW. I don't think people realize how weak the duskblade class is. It's better then the 3.5 monk and fighter...but that doesn't say much. The magus is a good option for when you start off at level 1-3 since you can be a gish from the start. Level 4-8 and it's a matter of how much can you wait. By level 9-12 it becomes kinda even. 13-20 and the fi/caster/prestige classes wins out. So can you wait and what is the level range becomes important issues.