Last night my adventuring party was attacked by and elder earth elemental. It has reach and our Cleric moved forward to deliver a harm spell. He provoked an AoO for not casting defensively. (stupid, I know)And the Elemental hit him with two slam attacks. This caused a bit of an uproar about how it gets to attack twice with an AoO and my DM said that since the Bestiary entry only gives her the one MELEE line to go off of that's why it got both slams off. I tried looking for rules to clarify but didn't find any.
Was she right?
(the Cleric by the way was turned into red paste smeared on the cavern floor, which we then had to get raised. frickin hilarious)
Last night my adventuring party was attacked by and elder earth elemental. It has reach and our Cleric moved forward to deliver a harm spell. He provoked an AoO for not casting defensively. (stupid, I know)And the Elemental hit him with two slam attacks. This caused a bit of an uproar about how it gets to attack twice with an AoO and my DM said that since the Bestiary entry only gives her the one MELEE line to go off of that's why it got both slams off. I tried looking for rules to clarify but didn't find any.
Was she right?
(the Cleric by the way was turned into red paste smeared on the cavern floor, which we then had to get raised. frickin hilarious)
Unless a monster is possessed of a special ability or exception to the rules that allows otherwise, they can only take ONE attack per action that would allow them an Attack of Opportunity. Typically a creature/player/whatever only gets one Attack of Opportunity a round if nothing else is mentioned about it in their stat block.
For your GM's future reference, when a monster has attacks listed as "2 Slams (#Dx+y)" that would be relevant for when it takes a full attack action. The damage of #Dx+y is per hit. Unless I am mistaken earth elementals would only get one slam as an attack of opportunity each round...but I don't have my beastiary in front of me and Pathfinder has changed other things that haven't crept up on me as a GM yet.
Rules flubs happen to the best of us. It sucks when a character gets pasted, but if everyone is still having fun playing the game there's no use enacting trade embargos or military blockades of your GM's abode.
Making an Attack of Opportunity: An attack of opportunity is a single melee attack, and most characters can only make one per round. You don't have to make an attack of opportunity if you don't want to. You make your attack of opportunity at your normal attack bonus, even if you've already attacked in the round.
Italics mine. So first off, if your DM rolled twice, once for each slam, they're already doing it wrong. So now I hear him say "Oh, so I roll just once and they both hit or miss then!" This is a little harder to refute because there's nothing that specifically says he's wrong. However there is this:
Natural Attacks: Most creatures possess one or more natural attacks (attacks made without a weapon). These attacks fall into one of two categories, primary and secondary attacks. Primary attacks are made using the creature's full base attack bonus and add the creature's full Strength bonus on damage rolls. Secondary attacks are made using the creature's base attack bonus –5 and add only 1/2 the creature's Strength bonus on damage rolls. If a creature has only one natural attack, it is always made using the creature's full base attack bonus and adds 1-1/2 the creature's Strength bonus on damage rolls. This increase does not apply if the creature has multiple attacks but only takes one. If a creature has only one type of attack, but has multiple attacks per round, that attack is treated as a primary attack, regardless of its type.
Italics mine, again. This line implies that there are creatures with multiple attacks per round of a single type of natural weapon. Multiple attacks implies multiple rolls. However I don't think you'll find a single example of "Claw +2, Claw +2" listed in a stat block. Further, this makes creatures like Giant Squids with masses of tentacles incredibly deadly.
Last night my adventuring party was attacked by and elder earth elemental. It has reach and our Cleric moved forward to deliver a harm spell. He provoked an AoO for not casting defensively. (stupid, I know)And the Elemental hit him with two slam attacks. This caused a bit of an uproar about how it gets to attack twice with an AoO and my DM said that since the Bestiary entry only gives her the one MELEE line to go off of that's why it got both slams off. I tried looking for rules to clarify but didn't find any.
Was she right?
(the Cleric by the way was turned into red paste smeared on the cavern floor, which we then had to get raised. frickin hilarious)
In 3.5 they used to have 2 lines, but in Pathfinder they only have one. James is correct though, one attack per opportunity.
Unless I am mistaken earth elementals would only get one slam as an attack of opportunity each round...but I don't have my beastiary in front of me and Pathfinder has changed other things that haven't crept up on me as a GM yet.
Small and Medium Earth Elementals get a single slam, Large or bigger get two.
Does your GM allow such beasties to get multiple attacks after they move or when otherwise limited to a standard action as well?
Whether she does or doesn't, she is wrong, wrong, WRONG,
Unless I am mistaken earth elementals would only get one slam as an attack of opportunity each round...but I don't have my beastiary in front of me and Pathfinder has changed other things that haven't crept up on me as a GM yet.Small and Medium Earth Elementals get a single slam, Large or bigger get two.Not for attacks of opportunity.
Also not for single attack action attacks.
For a full attack action, however, you are correct.
-James
Yeah, that's what I meant. :)
Does your GM allow such beasties to get multiple attacks after they move or when otherwise limited to a standard action as well?
Whether she does or doesn't, she is wrong, wrong, WRONG,
I am thinking this is a new DM who just jumped over from 3.5. Like many of us he will probably get a lot of things wrong before he gets them right. I know I flubbed a few rules in my day.
I am thinking this is a new DM who just jumped over from 3.5. Like many of us he will probably get a lot of things wrong before he gets them right. I know I flubbed a few rules in my day.Does your GM allow such beasties to get multiple attacks after they move or when otherwise limited to a standard action as well?
Whether she does or doesn't, she is wrong, wrong, WRONG,
Eh, nobody's perfect. I can understand someone making a simple mistake. Happens to the best of us. The GM's interpretation wasn't true in any previous edition that I'm aware of though.
She's new, but then again so is the whole group. We all originally played 3.5 but we've been playing 4ed for close to a year before I picked up the PF core book and bestiary. Played a one shot PF game and kicked 4ed to the curb. So were still trying to figure out what all was changed between the 3.5 to PF conversion and we do run into these little issues.
After discussing it with her. (Consequently she's my wife) I found out that she was only rolling one attack roll for the AoO. She was only rolling one attack roll period. She thought that the 2 slams bit was just for theatrics and so in all reality that things should have TPK'd us.
Well now we know...
She's new, but then again so is the whole group. We all originally played 3.5 but we've been playing 4ed for close to a year before I picked up the PF core book and bestiary. Played a one shot PF game and kicked 4ed to the curb. So were still trying to figure out what all was changed between the 3.5 to PF conversion and we do run into these little issues.
After discussing it with her. (Consequently she's my wife) I found out that she was only rolling one attack roll for the AoO. She was only rolling one attack roll period. She thought that the 2 slams bit was just for theatrics and so in all reality that things should have TPK'd us.
Well now we know...
Nothing wrong with theatrics, provided the players know what's really going on. I reflavor things as both a GM and a player all the time without changing any mechanics.
Also, welcome to the "Pathfinder is better than 4E club!" We're happy to have you onboard!