I've got a published module that has a particularly nasty beastie in it, but I don't think that by the rules it can operate as described.
Said beastie has, among other abilities, the SLA dimension door at will (CL4). It also has, as an extraordinarly ability, Improved Grab.
The module states that said beastie will attack and use improved grab to grapple. It then says that if successful, it activates dimension door as a free action and moves to a particular location.
By my reading of the rules, this fails for a number of reasons;
1) If I'm reading it correctly, according to page 221, activating a SLA is a standard action, unless noted otherwise in the ability or spell description. The beastie's description has no notation. This is possibly an oversight. But if it is not, the beastie has to use a standard action to maintain the grapple and cannot use another to activate dimension door.
2) If I'm reading it correctly, according to the spell description of page 229, dimension door cannot be used on unwilling creatures.
Am I reading correctly and the author of the module is in error, or am I mistaken and I didn't use this monster to its full ability on the party ?
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Am I reading correctly and the author of the module is in error, or am I mistaken and I didn't use this monster to its full ability on the party ?
You're correct on both points. SLA's are std actions unless otherwise described, and non-willing creatures are not valid targets of the spell.
Whether the error for the SLA DimDoor is in the author's tactics or in the creature's description is unclear.
Edit: Is it possible that the DimDoor on the PC doesn't also include language about DimDoor if the PC is unconscious? Unconscious creatures are generally considered willing when it comes to saves
Would you provide the product name in a spoiler, pls?
Howie is correct that it can't do both unless the creator of the mosnter said it can as an exception to the rule.
I found an e-mail address for the author/publisher. I've asked for clarification and permission to name the module. We'll see how long it takes to get an answer.
I found an e-mail address for the author/publisher. I've asked for clarification and permission to name the module. We'll see how long it takes to get an answer.
You don't permission to name a module. If you were trying to post the monster's stat and what not that would be a different case, unless this is a special case for some reason that I don't know about, in which I case I stand corrected.
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I found an e-mail address for the author/publisher. I've asked for clarification and permission to name the module. We'll see how long it takes to get an answer.You don't permission to name a module. If you were trying to post the monster's stat and what not that would be a different case, unless this is a special case for some reason that I don't know about, in which I case I stand corrected.
No, Wraithstrike, you are correct. There is nothing against the law for naming a module. You just can't post anything "ruleswise" from said module. You could talk about it, review it and mention parts of it, but the stats and item or monster descriptions are all intellectual property and require permission to post anywhere.
It looks like dimensional shambler-like tactics. Unless it is monster from other source probably author forgot to add ability to use dimension door as a quickened action or maintain grapple as free action. Or just forgot to add it to stat block if used monster from another source.
You do not need permission to name module or even speak about the contents as long as you do not cite them, and even citation is allowed to certain degree (different in different countries).
Also, if it is d20 product monster stats could be probably published if they are Open Content, which is not always the case when it comes to monsters specifically designed for modules.
I will say that's it's not a dimensional shambler. It is a beastie unique to the module, an aquatic large monstrous humanoid with at least the "Divine Guardian" template.
No, Wraithstrike, you are correct. There is nothing against the law for naming a module. You just can't post anything "ruleswise" from said module. You could talk about it, review it and mention parts of it, but the stats and item or monster descriptions are all intellectual property and require permission to post anywhere.I found an e-mail address for the author/publisher. I've asked for clarification and permission to name the module. We'll see how long it takes to get an answer.You don't permission to name a module. If you were trying to post the monster's stat and what not that would be a different case, unless this is a special case for some reason that I don't know about, in which I case I stand corrected.
Unless the rules are unique to a specific game they are ok. The dimension door and grappling rules are open content so you are free to post the module name. That is all we have been given so far.
... probably author forgot to add ability to use dimension door as a quickened action or maintain grapple as free action.
If this is the case (the author forgot to call out DimDoor as a free action), doesn't this tactic of grabbing someone and DimDooring away still fail as DimDoor doesn't work on unwilling (grabbed) subjects ?
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... probably author forgot to add ability to use dimension door as a quickened action or maintain grapple as free action.If this is the case (the author forgot to call out DimDoor as a free action), doesn't this tactic of grabbing someone and DimDooring away still fail as DimDoor doesn't work on unwilling (grabbed) subjects ?
Yes. The part of it is outside the scope of the spell regardless of action budget problem.
The module title is
I've gotten a reply from the author. There is indeed an error.
The tactics should be:
The beastie ATTACKS the nearest PC, grappling as a free action (due to the improved grab) if it hits with a tentacle. On its next turn, it attempts to maintain the grapple and, if successful, moves to a particular place. On the turn after that, it uses dimension door to get back to the remainder of the party.
The author goes on to say that he'll be revising the module here at Paizo.
That explains it. The erroneous tactic would be usable with quickened dimension door if it managed to drop the PC to unconsciousness as unconscious targets are considered willing PF, IIRC.
I wanted to thank SlimGauge for picking this error up for me. Even though there is no issue with naming the module in which the error was printed, I appreciated the discretion in any case.
For the curious, Horror at Dagger Rock may be found here, and the error is under the tactics section of the....
During Combat: The Bride of Dagon attacks the nearest PC with its tentacles and if it hits, attempts a grapple check as a free action. If it is successful, the Bride of Dagon drags its captive to the bottom of the pool at Part 3, Location 23A, where the unfortunate PC possibly contracts Abyssal Ascariasis and runs the risk of drowning. The Bride of Dagon then uses dimension door to ambush remaining PCs by appearing behind them.
If SlimGauge could email me again, there is something I'd like to discuss.
Andrew Gale
SAGAWORK STUDIOS
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I wanted to thank SlimGauge for picking this error up for me. Even though there is no issue with naming the module in which the error was printed, I appreciated the discretion in any case.
For the curious, Horror at Dagger Rock may be found here, and the error is under the tactics section of the.... ** spoiler omitted **
If SlimGauge could email me again, there is something I'd like to discuss.Andrew Gale
SAGAWORK STUDIOS
Author willing to discuss with customers, acknowledge errors, and make corrections. This is all positive press for you, as I see it, Andrew.
Apologies for the necromancy, but I have a related question.
If Character A grapples Character B, and then Character B uses Dimension Door, what happens?
1) B disappears and leaves A behind.
2) B disappears and takes A with them (since A is grappling, they are "willing" since they don't want to let go).
3) Something else (please specify).
Probably 1. Second option should not happen because the fact that being willing is required to be targeted by dimension door does not force character B in any way to pick A as the target.
Apologies for the necromancy, but I have a related question.
If Character A grapples Character B, and then Character B uses Dimension Door, what happens?
1) B disappears and leaves A behind.
2) B disappears and takes A with them (since A is grappling, they are "willing" since they don't want to let go).
3) Something else (please specify).
1. That is the main reason I get the spell, but they still have to make the concentration check.