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I want to include this in my campaign to encourage combat maneuver use
Martial Arts (Combat)
You are trained in hand-to-hand combat.
Prerequisite: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can attempt any combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity. In addition, this feat increases the benefit of any of the following feats that you have by +1: Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Grapple, Improved Overrun, Improved Sunder, and Improved Trip.
PEACH please. Any pit falls or suggestions?
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I want to include this in my campaign to encourage combat maneuver use
Martial Arts (Combat)
You are trained in hand-to-hand combat.
Prerequisite: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can attempt any combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity. In addition, this feat increases the benefit of the following feats that you have by +1: Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Grapple, Improved Overrun, Improved Sunder, and Improved Trip.PEACH please. Any pit falls or suggestions?
Yeah it kinda makes the improved feats a waste of space.
Yeah it kinda makes the improved feats a waste of space.I want to include this in my campaign to encourage combat maneuver use
Martial Arts (Combat)
You are trained in hand-to-hand combat.
Prerequisite: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can attempt any combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity. In addition, this feat increases the benefit of the following feats that you have by +1: Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Grapple, Improved Overrun, Improved Sunder, and Improved Trip.PEACH please. Any pit falls or suggestions?
Not exactly; I can easily imagine a fighter who would rather take Power Attack + Improved Sunder over Improved Unarmed Strike + Martial Arts, for instance.
One solution that I found somewhat interesting was Frank Trollman's idea of "The Edge". The idea is that you compare your BAB to your enemy's (presumably counting a monk as having full BAB for this calculation), and if your BAB is higher, then you don't provoke attacks of opportunity when making combat maneuvers. Therefore you can easily fight "mooks" in a flashy way with lots of tripping, sundering, bull rushing, etc.
As much as it pains me to say this .... does anyone know where his version tweaks write up is located? Just being nosy.
Should the bonus granted by Martial Arts only apply to maneuvers done unarmed? If so, then they don't get to stack this potent feat with weapons that grant bonuses or advantages to those maneuvers. EX: no greatsword to overcome hardness during a sunder or no whip to give a +2 to disarm.
This seems like an interesting option for a monk or even a specific fighter build. It would encourage interesting combats.
I'd cut the +1 bonus it grants. Leave that to the focused feats.
I like it. It's powerful, but makes combat more fun. Less punishment for a character seizing the moment in-game.
@ lastknightleft: How so?
The premise is to give an option where these maneuvers get more use. I'm open to other ideas. Hogarth that idea is interesting.
Well keep in mind everyone that it only grants the +1 bonus to thoses feats if you have them.
In other words, If you have Martial Arts, you can perform any combat maneuver without provoking an AoO. However, if you have Martial Arts and Improved Trip, you can perform any combat maneuver without provoking an AoO AND if you attempt a trip maneuver, you do so at a +3 bonus instead of +2. Think of it as a synergy effect for those feats.
Sorry if the initial writeup didn't make this clear.
Just so that I'm not being too naive, what are you considering explicitly as 'Combat Manuevers'? Or are you implying it in the generic sense?
Just so that I'm not being too naive, what are you considering explicitly as 'Combat Manuevers'? Or are you implying it in the generic sense?
Mmm… good point. Explicitly, this feat would apply to: Bull Rush, Disarm, Grapple, Overrun, Sunder, and Trip attempts.
Perhaps you want to re-write that to offer a little more clarification, then? I see the potential. =)
EDIT: and perhaps give the monk a little love with some synergy with his unique 'combat manuevers'?
As much as it pains me to say this .... does anyone know where his version tweaks write up is located? Just being nosy.
You can read about it here:
http://dungeons.wikia.com/wiki/Races_of_War_(3.5e_Sourcebook)/Advanced_Comb at#Base_Attack_Bonus_and_Combat_Maneuvers
As much as it pains me to say this .... does anyone know where his version tweaks write up is located? Just being nosy.You can read about it here:
http://dungeons.wikia.com/wiki/Races_of_War_(3.5e_Sourcebook)/Advanced_Comb at#Base_Attack_Bonus_and_Combat_Maneuvers
Thanks! Is that wiki explicitly his?
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@ lastknightleft: How so?
The premise is to give an option where these maneuvers get more use. I'm open to other ideas. Hogarth that idea is interesting.
Because it takes away 70% of the bonus from the improved feats. First it eliminates the AoO, then it provides a +1 bonus to all of them. Also you didn't specify if it stacks with the imp feats. Basically this makes taking the improved just a crappy speedbump that need to be taken to get the greaters. I would be pissed if I had this feat that I'd have to waste a feat to get a +1 to trip just because I wanted greater trip. but that's my opinion.
EDIT: and then I read the post after the question lol. Okay so it stacks which cuts half my argument. I guess my players use CMBs enough that I don't think it's necessary, but while it's powerful because it gives a player lots of options it's not overpowered. I would limit it specifically to when performing those manuevers unarmed.
Thanks! Is that wiki explicitly his?
No; it's just a wiki for D&D stuff.
Revised:
Martial Arts (Combat)
You are trained in hand-to-hand combat.
Prerequisite: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can attempt a bull rush, disarm, grapple, overrun, sunder, or trip combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity. In addition, if you have any of the following feats, this feat increases its benefit by +1: Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Grapple, Improved Overrun, Improved Sunder, and Improved Trip.
Special: Add this feat to the monk's list of bonus feats.
I wouldn't want to automatically grant it to the monk for dipping purposes.
Alternatively, the feat could also grant the bonus to these as well: Greater Bull Rush, Greater Disarm, Greater Grapple, Greater Overrun, Greater Sunder, and Greater Trip. A total of +6 if you specialize all the way in a particular combat maneuver.
Thanks for the link Hogarth, I'll have to read it up :)
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Revised:
Martial Arts (Combat)
You are trained in hand-to-hand combat.
Prerequisite: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can attempt a bull rush, disarm, grapple, overrun, sunder, or trip combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity. In addition, if you have any of the following feats, this feat increases its benefit by +1: Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Grapple, Improved Overrun, Improved Sunder, and Improved Trip.
Special: Add this feat to the monk's list of bonus feats.I wouldn't want to automatically grant it to the monk for dipping purposes.
Alternatively, the feat could also grant the bonus to these as well: Greater Bull Rush, Greater Disarm, Greater Grapple, Greater Overrun, Greater Sunder, and Greater Trip. A total of +6 if you specialize all the way in a particular combat maneuver.
I would add the caveat that the manuevers have to be performed unarmed to get the bonus.
Good point.
I would add the caveat that the manuevers have to be performed unarmed to get the bonus.
It did cross my mind, but I'd have to work it so that it makes sense if I add it: For instance, if you have martial arts only, and you attempt to disarm or trip without a weapon, you don't provoke, but if you attempt to disarm or trip with a weapon, you do? I can see my players give me raised eyebrows on that one :), especially a monk with a sai for instance.
I also think it should only apply to unarmed combat maneuvers. Weapons grant other bonuses that an unarmed fighter can't match. Giving them a bonus on the CMB roll is fair, but allowing it to stack with weapon is a little cheesy and not in the spirit of "hand-to-hand" combat.
It makes sense that someone trained in martial arts (hand-to-hand) might not be very good at using a trident to disarm someone.
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I would add the caveat that the manuevers have to be performed unarmed to get the bonus.It did cross my mind, but I'd have to work it so that it makes sense if I add it: For instance, if you have martial arts only, and you attempt to disarm or trip without a weapon, you don't provoke, but if you attempt to disarm or trip with a weapon, you do? I can see my players give me raised eyebrows on that one :), especially a monk with a sai for instance.
not the no AoO, just the +1 bonus
Or I could just drop the synergy language entirely and just have the feat give you the benefit of no AoOs. Then, players have two options: They can spend 2 feats to open up all the said combat maneuvers and be ok at them, or they can spend 2 feats (Improved + Greater relevant feats) to become really good at a specific combat maneuver. Initially, I wanted a benefit if a player decided he wanted both, hence the synergy with the Improved feats. But maybe that's not best.
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Or I could just drop the synergy language entirely and just have the feat give you the benefit of no AoOs. Then, players have two options: They can spend 2 feats to open up all the said combat maneuvers and be ok at them, or they can spend 2 feats (Improved + Greater relevant feats) to become really good at a specific combat maneuver. Initially, I wanted a benefit if a player decided he wanted both, hence the synergy with the Improved feats. But maybe that's not best.
What you could do to provide synergy is allow this feat to subsume the pre-req feat to get the improved version.
I.E If you have martial arts, you don't need to take power attack to get imp. bullrush, if you have martial arts you don't need combat expertise to get Imp. disarm etc.
That's a good idea. I'll have to figure out on how to word it properly.
That's a good idea. I'll have to figure out on how to word it properly.
I agree; I think it's dumb that a monk can take Improved Trip without knowing Combat Expertise, but not Greater Trip.
Alright, I think this should sound clear and achieve what I'm going for:
You are trained in hand-to-hand combat.
Prerequisite: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can attempt a bull rush, disarm, grapple, overrun, sunder, or trip combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity.
Special: If you have this feat, you do not need Power Attack to qualify for Greater Bull Rush, Greater Overrun, Greater Sunder, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Overrun, or Improved Sunder. You also don’t need the Combat Expertise feat to qualify for Greater Disarm, Greater Trip, Improved Disarm, or Improved Trip.
Any thoughts?
Lets get this back into circulation!
Alright, I think this should sound clear and achieve what I'm going for:
You are trained in hand-to-hand combat.
Prerequisite: Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can attempt a bull rush, disarm, grapple, overrun, sunder, or trip combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity.
Special: If you have this feat, you do not need Power Attack to qualify for Greater Bull Rush, Greater Overrun, Greater Sunder, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Overrun, or Improved Sunder. You also don’t need the Combat Expertise feat to qualify for Greater Disarm, Greater Trip, Improved Disarm, or Improved Trip.Any thoughts?
I like this version.
Maybe create an Improved Martial Arts feat that doubles the bonus you get from the Improved and Greater combat maneuver feats.
Also, this feat isn't necessary to encourage special maneuvers in combat. I played a Barbarian 2/Fighter 2 once who got railroaded into fighting a Balor Tanar'ri (really long story). Anyways, after one of my allies provoked an AoO from it, I attempted to disarm the Balor and succeeded!!! This was 3.0, so the Balor didn't have Combat Reflexes. So I got me a big giant magic sword, which WASN'T destroyed when the Balor Bomb went off at its death.
My point being, there are ways to act smart and avoid AoOs....like waiting for someone else to provoke them (hopefully summoned monsters and the like). Or wear some Fire Shield and hurt them back when theu AoO you.
So this feats all good then?
I think you should include "when unarmed, you can attempt any combat maneuver...", that's just my opinion. Overall, I like this option.
I think it is too good.
We've been using a house rule where you only incur the AoO if the maneuver roll fails. It works really well, but I think that effect (and only that effect) would be fair as a feat for the pre-requisites you list.
I like this feat, I'm just going to do the modification myself and use it in my home campaign.
I don't think it's too good, it fills a purpose of making a martial artist do martial arts with out needing to take 17 plus feats. I'm going to make available as a 2nd level Monk bonus feat
@Rainzax: I like your maneuver training, keep me posted on the progress you make on that one.
So I did some playtesting with the Martial Arts feat and it works very well, my players were tripping opponents, there were a few sunder attempts, disarms out the wazoo. It made combat more cinematic, my players had fun with it and so did I. I'm going to recommend this option to all my GM buddies. The rogue in the party got his short sword sundered, so he kept feinting for 2 rounds then got the sucker punch sneak attack he was looking for. It was great.
This feat is in my games from now on. Good work on this.