Summoner Starting Character Questions

[Thakell]

Okay, guys, girls and everything in between, I have read pretty much every relevant post and text but I need some questions answered; if anyone can help thanks in advance
1. If an Eidolon has two primary attacks, can it use both in a single round and if so under what circumstance can it?
2. Summoners can wear light armor, if I cast mage armor on myself would the resulting AC bonus's stack (I think not but the brain is in neutral at the moment) or how should it work if I cast it on my eidolon?
3. I am having difficulties picking his known spell list for the level 1 slots any suggestions or personal favourites??
4. I believe that the summoner can communicate with the eidolon through the life link telepathically, but I read it speaks as well, can an eidolon verbally speak or is all the telepathic communications in the spoken language chosen, and if the summoner knows more than one language can he choose?

As a side point I may be using this character in a pfs setting, if this changes any of the answers, please enlighten me

[Umbral Reaver]

1. With a standard action action the eidolon can attack with one of its natural weapons. With a full attack action it can attack with each of its natural weapons once.

2. Armour grants an armour bonus. Mage Armour grants an armour bonus. You take the best of the two.

3. Grease and Protection From Evil are handy and last well into the late levels. Enlarge Person can be fun since you can stick it on your eidolon.

4. An eidolon can speak any languages known by the summoner.

[Thakell]

Umbral Reaver wrote:

1. With a standard action action the eidolon can attack with one of its natural weapons. With a full attack action it can attack with each of its natural weapons once.

2. Armour grants an armour bonus. Mage Armour grants an armour bonus. You take the best of the two.

3. Grease and Protection From Evil are handy and last well into the late levels. Enlarge Person can be fun since you can stick it on your eidolon.

4. An eidolon can speak any languages known by the summoner.

Thanks for that, just to clarify the eidolon can speak verbally, if so sweet

[Kolokotroni]

Thakell wrote:

Okay, guys, girls and everything in between, I have read pretty much every relevant post and text but I need some questions answered; if anyone can help thanks in advance

1. If an Eidolon has two primary attacks, can it use both in a single round and if so under what circumstance can it?
2. Summoners can wear light armor, if I cast mage armor on myself would the resulting AC bonus's stack (I think not but the brain is in neutral at the moment) or how should it work if I cast it on my eidolon?
3. I am having difficulties picking his known spell list for the level 1 slots any suggestions or personal favourites??
4. I believe that the summoner can communicate with the eidolon through the life link telepathically, but I read it speaks as well, can an eidolon verbally speak or is all the telepathic communications in the spoken language chosen, and if the summoner knows more than one language can he choose?

As a side point I may be using this character in a pfs setting, if this changes any of the answers, please enlighten me

1,2 and 4 were answered as well as they can be by reaver.

3. I also like grease, but I think you should also start off with a more offensive buff for your eidolon like enlarge person. Remember because of share spells you can cast spells on the eidolon you normally couldn't because of it's type.

[Thakell]

okay my brain is going to throttle me, but it seems to think this combination of traits could be a problem, armor expert and warrior of old, the summoner is going to be used for a pfs game, help needed

[Kolokotroni]

Thakell wrote:

okay my brain is going to throttle me, but it seems to think this combination of traits could be a problem, armor expert and warrior of old, the summoner is going to be used for a pfs game, help needed

i am unfamiliar with warrior of old, where does that trait come from?

[nexusphere]

I am a fan of enlarge person, Mage armor, and shield. The first two have long enough durations, and shield is a gear buff that puts the ac of the eidolon in range of the average fighter making up for the hp deficit.

[james maissen]

Thakell wrote:

3. I am having difficulties picking his known spell list for the level 1 slots any suggestions or personal favourites??

Excuse the order I lazily cut and pasted them:

Alarm Nice duration, good uses. Out of the box spell/camp spell
Magic Fang Scroll spell at best
Daze Monster If you take at all train out of it when you can
Magic Mouth Nice outside of PFS, but as spells don't carryover ditch
Endure Elements Trade in 2PA for a wand of it will last your career
Mount Very nice spell, good duration, coupled with handle animal
Enlarge Person Must have as it can go on Eidolon and party BDF
Protection from Chaos/Evil/Good/Law Useful but weakened in Pathfinder
Expeditious Retreat Poor man's haste with better duration
Feather Fall Swift action is nice and great when you need it
Reduce Person Have at the very least a wand of this for your eidolon
Grease Your only REF targeting spell. Very useful multipurpose spell.
Shield Can go on eidolon, get scrolls of it to start, then wand.
Identify Use detect magic/scrolls
Summon Monster I Worthless spell, use mount for 'trap springers'
Jump Scroll or staff side spell, likely never useful
Unseen Servant Very good out of the box thinking spell
Mage Armor Wand/scrolls by the time it lasts long enough get bracers
Ventriloquism Nice spell, again for out the box thinking

Anyway, there's my take on the entire 1st level spell list for what it's worth.

When picking spells for a spontaneous caster you want to consider consumables as well. Many nice spells will have a better use for you in a wand rather than using up one of your few spells known slots.

-James

[Gjorbjond]

Kolokotroni wrote:

i am unfamiliar with warrior of old, where does that trait come from?

It's from Elves of Golarion. It grants a +2 bonus to initiative.

I don't see a problem with either of them separately or in combination.

[Kolokotroni]

Gjorbjond wrote:

Kolokotroni wrote:

i am unfamiliar with warrior of old, where does that trait come from?

It's from Elves of Golarion. It grants a +2 bonus to initiative.

I don't see a problem with either of them separately or in combination.

Ah, dont have that one. If that is the case then its pretty inconcievable to me how a reduction in armor check penalty is incompatable with a +2 bonus to initiative.

[Thakell]

thanks once again to all and i was unsure if warrior of old counted as combat ot racial trait, had a nice long talk with the dm of the pfs moduloe this will run through and he checked and confirmed it was fine

[Thakell]

okay ran my summoner for the first time, went fairly well, but a couple of questions came up, any assitance provided greatly appreciated both by myself and my dm,

1. During combat my eidolon got bitten and gained a disease by my vastly inadequate rolls, now would this affect my eidolon, is it treated like it happended to a full fledged pc, so heal checks and possible remove disease spell required or would it disappear if sent back to its home plan and returned.

2. Before Combat in regards to initaive would my eidolon act on my turn, like a summoned creature or animal companion or would it fill a seperate slot on the iniative order

3. the summon creature spell ability if i use my standard action in turn one to cast it, does it appear in this round or at the begggining of my turn on the next round;

I ran this in pfs so if any pathfinder book references to the answers exist, pls supply them, thanks

[james maissen]

Thakell wrote:

1. During combat my eidolon got bitten and gained a disease by my vastly inadequate rolls, now would this affect my eidolon, is it treated like it happended to a full fledged pc, so heal checks and possible remove disease spell required or would it disappear if sent back to its home plan and returned.

2. Before Combat in regards to initaive would my eidolon act on my turn, like a summoned creature or animal companion or would it fill a seperate slot on the iniative order

3. the summon creature spell ability if i use my standard action in turn one to cast it, does it appear in this round or at the begggining of my turn on the next round;

1. I'm not sure as they've made the eidolon such an exception to the rules it might be a shorter list to say what does apply to them. I would imagine as wounds don't heal that disease wouldn't heal. I would hand wave it as a DM that it could purge all such conditions by being dismissed and coming back as if 'killed' by hp loss.

2. If you have animal companions acting on the druid's turn then the eidolon should be no different in this regard. If you have them roll separately then it should as well. I'm not aware of any hard fast rule that has companions (or cohorts for that matter) acting on the PC's init.

3. The only reason that, for others, summoned monsters appear the following round is that the spell has a casting time of 1 round. Once the spell is completed the critters appear and have full normal set of actions. In the summoner's case (or the case of a 'rapid' summon spell if such metamagic is included) the spell completes during the summoner's turn. It would not be unlike a druid moving then beginning a summon with their standard action then completing the standard action the following round (something that happens when druid-birds need to fly to remain aloft but wish to summon). The only weirdness to this would be something summoned in a surprise round would only get a standard action as the round simply isn't as long as a standard round.

-James

[Gjorbjond]

james maissen wrote:

Thakell wrote:

1. During combat my eidolon got bitten and gained a disease by my vastly inadequate rolls, now would this affect my eidolon, is it treated like it happended to a full fledged pc, so heal checks and possible remove disease spell required or would it disappear if sent back to its home plan and returned.

1. I'm not sure as they've made the eidolon such an exception to the rules it might be a shorter list to say what does apply to them. I would imagine as wounds don't heal that disease wouldn't heal. I would hand wave it as a DM that it could purge all such conditions by being dismissed and coming back as if 'killed' by hp loss.

We've been playing it as if the exceptions listed are the only ones. Normally you don't summon creatures that are poisoned, drained, etc. so when summoned, an eidolon also doesn't have any of those conditions. That's the easiest way of handling it.

[Kolokotroni]

Gjorbjond wrote:

james maissen wrote:

Thakell wrote:

1. During combat my eidolon got bitten and gained a disease by my vastly inadequate rolls, now would this affect my eidolon, is it treated like it happended to a full fledged pc, so heal checks and possible remove disease spell required or would it disappear if sent back to its home plan and returned.

1. I'm not sure as they've made the eidolon such an exception to the rules it might be a shorter list to say what does apply to them. I would imagine as wounds don't heal that disease wouldn't heal. I would hand wave it as a DM that it could purge all such conditions by being dismissed and coming back as if 'killed' by hp loss.

We've been playing it as if the exceptions listed are the only ones. Normally you don't summon creatures that are poisoned, drained, etc. so when summoned, an eidolon also doesn't have any of those conditions. That's the easiest way of handling it.

Since the eidolon's hit points remain the same when it is summoned i dont see why negative conditions such as disease or poison would go away either. But that is something that would be a useful clarification in the rules.

[Gjorbjond]

Kolokotroni wrote:

Since the eidolon's hit points remain the same when it is summoned i dont see why negative conditions such as disease or poison would go away either. But that is something that would be a useful clarification in the rules.

It is true that some official clarification is needed here. My view is that if you don't clear those conditions, it's possible to permanently kill an eidolon with energy drain or con drain. Drains are bad enough without the ability to kill off a class feature!

Compare it to the druid. If an animal companion gets really bad off with ability or energy drain he can just put it down and get a brand new one after a day long ritual. A summoner would have to bite the bullet and pay for restorations or a greater restoration.

[Kolokotroni]

Gjorbjond wrote:

Kolokotroni wrote:

Since the eidolon's hit points remain the same when it is summoned i dont see why negative conditions such as disease or poison would go away either. But that is something that would be a useful clarification in the rules.

It is true that some official clarification is needed here. My view is that if you don't clear those conditions, it's possible to permanently kill an eidolon with energy drain or con drain. Drains are bad enough without the ability to kill off a class feature!

Compare it to the druid. If an animal companion gets really bad off with ability or energy drain he can just put it down and get a brand new one after a day long ritual. A summoner would have to bite the bullet and pay for restorations or a greater restoration.

At my table it would follow the same rules as hp, if you get killed by drain, you are half healed when you are re-summoned. Then you have to use other methods (such as magic) to bring them back to full strength.

[Thakell]

Thanks to all, does anyone know if a official paizo edict on the disease/ ability loss question has been generated and if so can you post the link