I do have to say that the party Rogue takes unique risks more than other characters, one way of explaining why the Rogue gains XP over the other characters for the trap is because 'they learned how the trap works and thusly how to disarm it and others like it in the future', plus they alone run the risks of a failed check whereas the party stands by and watches from a safe distance.
Apply the dynamics to say a combat, the wizard is out of spells and stands back watching his companions fight say a Dire Bat that invaded their camp, if the wizard stands there and doesnt even so much as try to throw a dart or sling a stone at the bat, does he get awarded XP?, in my books he really shouldnt, his inaction put his companions in prolonged danger even if they win out in the fight, those other characters may lose more HP or resources - should be still be awarded for that?, fairness dictates he should, but in reality he didnt learn anything from watching his companions taking the risk.
But then again when I tried to allocate XP to the players, there was uproar when the Rogue gained a measly little extra than them, from that day on, the Barbarians/Monks decided to 'rush' through trapped areas and set them off, relying on their HP, saves and Evasion to avoid ill effects (some of the time they werent hurt at all) and they argue they are eligable alone to gain the XP since they took the risk on their own. But I tend to allocate XP in terms of learning, what did the character learn by rushing down a corridor like a mad fool and setting off a trap?, my answer is - he or she got lucky they didnt die, but they certainly didnt really 'learn' from the trap in my opinion but it is a situation that does arise.
So my compramise was this - instead of allocating an individual CR to the Rogue alone for XP, allocate him a percentage depending how risky the trap is hes disarming by comparing his Level to the trap CR, if hes capable of "Taking 10" then I award 5-10% of the XP for the trap, and if hes not, then I award him 20% upwards to 50% if the trap is a complex and dangerous one that he alone had to contend with (aside from buffs if he recieves any from the party).
I wonder, what do other players/dungeon masters think of this situation? It does have pro's and cons. I'd love to hear everyones input and how they would award players for this situation.
Ciao.
Uh, the Rogue doesn't get exclusive rights to the XP for the traps he disarms, any more than the Paladin gets exclusive rights to the XP for the demons he one-shots with critical hits from his Smite Evil'd horseback lance charge.
I divide all XP evenly between party members regardless of who did what, because I don't want level disparities within the party. It may not be realistic, but I feel that it serves game balance and playability better, and it is alot simpler than trying to figure out what % of the XP should go to each PC based on how much they contributed.
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As a DM I personally am against awarding any XP exclusively. One it causes the party to start to compete with each other for more XP and second it really makes the XP and levels uneven in the long run. Also RAW does state that the XP from the Trap should be divided up evenly just like everything else, unless he scouted out on his own an no one else was present.
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I am also in the "even party split" for XP ... if a PC was present, they get a cut. Now, if the rogue is off doing some "side work" solo, then yeah, the rogue would get all the XP for the trap .
If one were to split XP based off of how much of a role a PC played (while present) in an encounter, the wizard would get pretty hosed during a fair number of encounters.
And how would one relegate XP for a "walking band aid" type of cleric ... not good at combat, but able to heal up everyone in the party?
Doing divisions along these lines tend to be more trouble than they are worth.
Now Role Playing XP can vary from player to player, though I tend to keep the awards pretty low (max of about 200 XP per session).
Just my 2cp.
I do have to say that the party Rogue takes unique risks more than other characters, one way of explaining why the Rogue gains XP over the other characters for the trap is because 'they learned how the trap works and thusly how to disarm it and others like it in the future', plus they alone run the risks of a failed check whereas the party stands by and watches from a safe distance.Apply the dynamics to say a combat, the wizard is out of spells and stands back watching his companions fight say a Dire Bat that invaded their camp, if the wizard stands there and doesnt even so much as try to throw a dart or sling a stone at the bat, does he get awarded XP?, in my books he really shouldnt, his inaction put his companions in prolonged danger even if they win out in the fight, those other characters may lose more HP or resources - should be still be awarded for that?, fairness dictates he should, but in reality he didnt learn anything from watching his companions taking the risk.
But then again when I tried to allocate XP to the players, there was uproar when the Rogue gained a measly little extra than them, from that day on, the Barbarians/Monks decided to 'rush' through trapped areas and set them off, relying on their HP, saves and Evasion to avoid ill effects (some of the time they werent hurt at all) and they argue they are eligable alone to gain the XP since they took the risk on their own. But I tend to allocate XP in terms of learning, what did the character learn by rushing down a corridor like a mad fool and setting off a trap?, my answer is - he or she got lucky they didnt die, but they certainly didnt really 'learn' from the trap in my opinion but it is a situation that does arise.
So my compramise was this - instead of allocating an individual CR to the Rogue alone for XP, allocate him a percentage depending how risky the trap is hes disarming by comparing his Level to the trap CR, if hes capable of "Taking 10" then I award 5-10% of the XP for the trap, and if hes not, then I award...
Think of it this way.
Who heals the rogue when he screws up? I doubt it is the rogue.If the wizard gets it when the rogue triggers a fireball trap does the wizard get more XP wince they are probably the one most at risk? The rogue has evasion and a strong reflex save, the wizard doesn't.
Is anyone in the party giving the rogue buffs to help them find and disarm spells? those people are using their resourses to help the rogue do his job.
If you fight a crit immune enemy, and the rogue can't pull their weight in the fight, does that mean they get less XP for that fight?
Split everything evenly.
If the rogue does a good job RPing their trap disarming skills, and makes things fun for everyone, then maybe an RP reward is in order, but the actual trap experience should be split.
While it is true that the Rogue couldnt have likely reached the said trap without aid from his comrades, I do agree with your points for the most part - if people assist the Rogue with buffs and so on or by giving him healing, etc then I regard those people equally and award them all experience points, it was purely an idea I had come across myself and mentioned in another thread.
But there has been incidents where I did refuse to award equal experience, such as an incident in the old 3.0 adventure "The Return To The Temple Of Elemental Evil", for those who know of it, the first encounter, a Young Blue Dragon fought against a fully rested party with all their spells and such fresh for the day. The party Wizard stood back and watched the others fight the dragon, he didnt want to "waste his resources", since when is a Dragon not a significant threat?
He could have at least used a Crossbow against the Dragon (which he had) and the other players tried to fight the dragon off, but after three rounds of inaction the Dragon killed one of the PC's and the others were badly wounded (besides the wizard who was untouched). I calculated the wizard needed 16's (which is within the realms of possibility, plus he actually memoirised one "True Strike" for the day which he hadnt even thought to use) to hit the Dragon and could have fired once/round, even if he only did 1d8 damage with a light crossbow it could have made the difference, on the 3rd round the Young Dragon was down to 3 HP before its turn came around and it killed the party Cleric.
Once the fight was over I awarded only half as much XP to the Wizard because they did nothing and could have prevented the death of their companion by helping in the fight. The other players were VERY annoyed the Wizard did nothing, and they agreed with the decision.
A seperate incident involving this Wizard character arose, the player was a power-gamer, read all the books and especially wanted to use Book Of Vile Darkness material - a situation arose where he and the party fought a Dread Linnorm at higher levels, the fight was fierce and the Wizards only contribution? one "Magic Missile" spell which failed to beat the Linnorms SR, the Wizard then walked off and left the others to fight the battle themselves AGAIN, and he demanded all XP is split equally by those present. Now I am all for splitting it equally if everyone puts in some effort but firing one weak spell and walking off isnt a contribution in my books.
But onto the topic at hand, I feel its fair that everyone is awarded XP equally for traps and thats been the main method of awarding XP I use (I only ever used the other exclusive method when the party rogue wants to scout ahead on their own which my groups rogue often did away from the others trying to line his greedy little pockets much to the annoyance of the other players but that was his motivation).
I thank everyone for their input so far, it was purely an inquiry...lol, I just wanted to know what people thought of it, because this after all is a forum and just wanted to bounce some ideas around and see what people thought.
Ciao.
I understand the sentiment here, but it puts an unbalancing precedent in place. As has been said, what about the other unique abilities that other characters can do that the rogue can't? Should other characters get the whole XP/bonus XP for an encounter just because they're more active?
What if a necromancer animates a zombie and has it set off the trap, thereby disarming it? Should that character get all the XP, or a bonus?
I had this come up from a player perspective once, when the rogue said he was going to start asking for a greater share of the treasure for putting his neck on the line with all the traps while the rest of the party waited around the corner in case he screwed up.
At which point the player running the cleric chimed in, saying "So does that mean I can start charging you for every healing spell I cast?"
I do understand what you mean Shadowborn, if a character puts in some effort I do reward them accordingly, the topic was purely a theoretical situation but the last post I made referring to the Wizard in a combat situation was not.
As for the party Rogue asking for a greater share of the treasure, I have heard that squabble brought up at the table, and the sneaky thieving little Whisper Gnome Rogue got turned upside down all the time by the party and had his pockets emptied because they caught him stealing more than enough times.
If someone puts in some effort, such as a character trying to shoot a dragon with a crossbow and needing 16's to do it for example, then I award them respectively, but standing by and doing little to nothing in a fight only upsets the other players.
In the case of traps, I do award experience between everyone unless the Rogue is taking some kind of uneccisary personal risk on his own part, the party rogue seldom asked for help as he tended to use his own Wand of Cure Light with a Use Magic Device roll, to disguse the fact he might have got hurt on one of his greedy little escapades away from the party.
Evil Clerics charging for healing is nothing new in the group I deal with, they call it "donations", and claim the money goes toward making new potions for the group whilst making a little for themselves on the side.
Thanks for the input, and I appreciate everyones comments.
Ciao.