So I've got a Ranger with Bolas. I tried tripping a guy with them. First I rolled to see if I hit. Then I rolled a CMB attack. Wait! What? Do I really have to make two attacks for a ranged trip or did we do it wrong and it is just the CMB?
Thanks in advance.
Just d20 + CMB vs CMD
Add any bonuses you currently have on attack rolls due to spells, feats, and other effects.
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So I've got a Ranger with Bolas. I tried tripping a guy with them. First I rolled to see if I hit. Then I rolled a CMB attack. Wait! What? Do I really have to make two attacks for a ranged trip or did we do it wrong and it is just the CMB?
Thanks in advance.
It's just CMB, as the trip attempt replaces the attack.
Though you may want to talk your DM into allowing you to use DEX instead of STR to calculate CMB, as if using agile maneuvers.
Since it's a ranged attack... sort of makes sense.
Thanks everyone. I thought we did that wrong. I'll know better next week.
Though you may want to talk your DM into allowing you to use DEX instead of STR to calculate CMB, as if using agile maneuvers.
Since it's a ranged attack... sort of makes sense.
So that would be counting the dex bonus twice (once in the CMB and once again as an attack bonus for a thrown weapon, which is added to the maneuver attempt with that weapon)?
I still can't figure why dex isn't already included in CMB as well as CMD.
It's just CMB, as the trip attempt replaces the attack.
Hmm, does that mean it provokes an Attack of Opportunity? <g>
It's just CMB, as the trip attempt replaces the attack.Hmm, does that mean it provokes an Attack of Opportunity? <g>
Ranged attacks do anyways.
Though you may want to talk your DM into allowing you to use DEX instead of STR to calculate CMB, as if using agile maneuvers.
Since it's a ranged attack... sort of makes sense.So that would be counting the dex bonus twice (once in the CMB and once again as an attack bonus for a thrown weapon, which is added to the maneuver attempt with that weapon)?
I still can't figure why dex isn't already included in CMB as well as CMD.
O_o Dex bonus twice? As you say CMB does not take DEX into account.
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So that would be counting the dex bonus twice (once in the CMB and once again as an attack bonus for a thrown weapon, which is added to the maneuver attempt with that weapon)?
The CMB when making a ranged trip with a bolas should be base attack + Dex mod + special size modifier (the CMB size modifier). The special attack (trip) is replacing the normal attack, meaning that instead of rolling and adding your attack bonus, you roll and add your CMB (and then damage is replaced by the prone condition). The reason DEX replaces STR in the equation is because this is a ranged trip attempt, and ranged attacks use Dex as the ability modifier.
Hmm, does that mean it provokes an Attack of Opportunity? <g>
As loopy notes, ranged attacks provoke AoOs anyway, so yeah it would. But that would be a hard question (that I don't have the answer to) if you had a feat or something that lets you make ranged attacks without provoking AoOs (I'd lean toward no AoO in that case, but I'm no sage).
I think the AoO mentioned is the one attempting a trip maneuver usually triggers. In which case, no.
Though you may want to talk your DM into allowing you to use DEX instead of STR to calculate CMB, as if using agile maneuvers.
Since it's a ranged attack... sort of makes sense.So that would be counting the dex bonus twice (once in the CMB and once again as an attack bonus for a thrown weapon, which is added to the maneuver attempt with that weapon)?
I still can't figure why dex isn't already included in CMB as well as CMD.
O_o Dex bonus twice? As you say CMB does not take DEX into account.
Right, but you were suggesting that the DM allow you to use Dex instead of Str in the CMB (which would be different from the normal calculation which doesn't include it). I was clarifying that by doing so you intended to include the Dex bonus twice; once in the CMB (under the DM's special allowance) and once as a thrown weapon attack bonus.
Ranged attacks do anyways.It's just CMB, as the trip attempt replaces the attack.Hmm, does that mean it provokes an Attack of Opportunity? <g>
From the target (if they are beyond missile range)? I know the normal rules for attacks of opportunity by ranged attacks but the trip attempt normally triggers an AoO from the target. I assumed that it would not be the case if they were not within reach, so I was kind of joking about it.
The CMB when making a ranged trip with a bolas should be base attack + Dex mod + special size modifier (the CMB size modifier). The special attack (trip) is replacing the normal attack, meaning that instead of rolling and adding your attack bonus, you roll and add your CMB (and then damage is replaced by the prone condition). The reason DEX replaces STR in the equation is because this is a ranged trip attempt, and ranged attacks use Dex as the ability modifier.
But CMB is calculated separately and does not include Dex. The dex bonus would apply as a bonus to the attack of the underlying weapon used to make the Maneuver attempt, but it still would not (under RAW) be a part of the CMB. Your adjustment makes perfect sense, but I just wanted to clarify whether you meant it as a house rule or if you were suggesting that was the way it worked under RAW.
Hmm, does that mean it provokes an Attack of Opportunity? <g>As loopy notes, ranged attacks provoke AoOs anyway, so yeah it would. But that would be a hard question (that I don't have the answer to) if you had a feat or something that lets you make ranged attacks without provoking AoOs (I'd lean toward no AoO in that case, but I'm no sage).
Like I said above, I was talking about provoking an AoO as a trip attempt against the target. I assume however that throwing bolas at a guy holding a longsword 50 feet away would not give him an Attack of Opportunity against the thrower.
Like I said above, I was talking about provoking an AoO as a trip attempt against the target. I assume however that throwing bolas at a guy holding a longsword 50 feet away would not give him an Attack of Opportunity against the thrower.
I would say that's a pretty good assumption unless the target has 50' reach. You can't make AoO with ranged weapons by the base rules, so this rule wouldn't trump that one.
Right, but you were suggesting that the DM allow you to use Dex instead of Str in the CMB (which would be different from the normal calculation which doesn't include it). I was clarifying that by doing so you intended to include the Dex bonus twice; once in the CMB (under the DM's special allowance) and once as a thrown weapon attack bonus.Though you may want to talk your DM into allowing you to use DEX instead of STR to calculate CMB, as if using agile maneuvers.
Since it's a ranged attack... sort of makes sense.So that would be counting the dex bonus twice (once in the CMB and once again as an attack bonus for a thrown weapon, which is added to the maneuver attempt with that weapon)?
I still can't figure why dex isn't already included in CMB as well as CMD.
O_o Dex bonus twice? As you say CMB does not take DEX into account.
I'm sorry, I did not mean that.
I assumed the ranged trip maneuver to use standard CMB by RAW.As in 1d20 + BAB + STR mod + Special Size mod. Like I said on my first post. Additional bonuses being for example weapon focus or heroism spell. I never included the DEX mod into the calculation.
My suggestion was to use DEX instead of STR in this ^ calculation.
But in the light of Baumbach's post I'm now more inclined to think that what I suggested as a houserule maybe is what is implied by RAW.
I'm sorry, I did not mean that.
My suggestion was to use DEX instead of STR in this ^ calculation.But in the light of Baumbach's post I'm now more inclined to think that what I suggested as a houserule maybe is what is implied by RAW.
Gotcha. All copacetic.<G>
Other than the prone condition, does the target need to removie the bolas too, or are they just assumed off once they're knocked prone?