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So we are often in situations that we want to bring the kitchen sink and the entire broom closet, it would be nice to be able to bring along pack animals to some of the scenarios.
In open country, you would bring your horse, or a horse drawn wagon and place your stuff that doesn't need immediate access into bags and chests that are located on these trusty steeds and wagons.
But what about an animal that we can bring along with us into buildings or dungeons. My eyes wondered over to the handy dandy riding dog! Here is your Husky/German Shepard/Irish Wolf hound/Rottweiler with bags and packs strapped to carry all those pesky extra torches, sleeping bag, Iron Rations, Extra vials, writing instruments, books, etc. Keeping our itinerant adventurer into the light or medium encumbrance category.
Is this legal?
Would it work, or at the first sound of a fight would our trusty friendly hound high tail it out of there with all our gear, leaving us flatfooted without a spare arrow or food?
Thanks
dragonlady
I don't see why not... just be sure to have ranks in "Handle Animal" and use a war-trained animal to minimize the chances of fleeing with your goods.
It certainly is legal, but your trusty dog is going to need training (via the Handle Animal skill). The Riding Dog presented in the Equipment section states that it is trained for combat riding. An adventuring pack animal would likely have slightly different training, but probably about the same number of tricks, so I imagine the cost would be about the same.
I was also going to suggest a donkey or mule, since according to the equipment section they're "stolid in the face of danger...willing to enter dungeons and other strange and threatening places." Alas, there doesn't seem to be any stats for them in the PRD (and I don't have my PDF handy). I imagine they can probably carry more than your average riding dog though.
Keep in mind that certain obstacles that require acrobatics, climbing or swimming may prove to be awkward. That would likely apply to the usual party pack mule (Dwarven Fighter in full plate) as well though. ;)
My friend is running a campaign and we've got an enclosed wagon and horses. We also have hirelings to drive and guard the thing. Best idea EVAR! Not that we don't expect it to get roxxorzed from time to time, but he's pretty fair. I'll certainly let my players do the same. No reason why not.
I was also going to suggest a donkey or mule, since according to the equipment section they're "stolid in the face of danger...willing to enter dungeons and other strange and threatening places." Alas, there doesn't seem to be any stats for them in the PRD (and I don't have my PDF handy). I imagine they can probably carry more than your average riding dog though.
No stats or suggestions for donkeys or mules, but there are stats for ponies, and it seems a straightforward enough substitution. On the other hand, riding dogs are actually stronger than ponies are.
I bet you could research stats for donkeys in Tijuana.
In my party we have an excellent pack animal who follows us into dungeons and always seems to get between me (the handsome and brilliant conjurer) and those dirty big brutes trying to kill me.
At which point he helpfully sticks them with some big pointy metal thing he carries. It's a dirty and bloody affair, I'm quite glad I don't have to be part of that.
I think our pack animal has a name, but seems to respond to "Gronk" or "Hey, you, big stupid fighter!"
Sometimes, when I look into his eyes, I almost see a glimmer of intelligence, perhaps even there is some measure of sentience.
Whether sentient or not, I really can't recommend them enough. A very handy pet indeed!
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So given a typical Irish Wolfhound breed is 120 pounds in weight. Modern studies show that a trained dog can carry 1/3 of their weight, so that means that you should be able to load a trained 120 pound Wolf hound with 40 pounds without encumbering them.
This is the difference between my fighter being loaded lightly and having a medium load, sounds like good deal to me.
Of course this also means that there might be situations that reguire me to have to haul my heavy lifter across chasms, up the sides of buildings/cliffs, etc.
And Treantmonk, careful about those comments, or us fighters just might duck next time a tree that an ogre calls a spear is heading "our" way! :)
For what its worth, I'm thinking the "work" trick is probably the best option for a riding dog that's going to carry a load. If its trained to have a cart hitched to it, its probably going to be good to have saddlebags thrown over it as well.
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I hate pack rats. Like regular run of the mill towns are going to have the gold to buy 5 suits of armors.. and blacksmiths sure as hell aren't going to buy someone else's work.
Well I don't think that rats will be large enough to carry what I want <grin>
But all I was looking for was something to carry about 20 to 40 pounds, and lighten my character from Medium encumbrance to light.
If I wanted a pet Ogre to carry 200 pounds, then maybe I would be considered a pack rat!
Would it work, or at the first sound of a fight would our trusty friendly hound high tail it out of there with all our gear, leaving us flatfooted without a spare arrow or food?
It might be quite the opposite.
Pack horses run the first time they see a griffon winging its way over the horizon or sniff a wolf on the morning breeze.
Dogs like to attack stuff, especially stuff they consider attackable. Your pack dog might not attack an ogre, but the first time a big rat or a small cat wanders past, your dog may be running off down the dungeon corridor, into the darkness, carrying your belongings with it.
Remember Sam (the dog) in the recent movie I am Legend running off into that building chasing the deer? Nearly got herself killed, and Dr. Neville (Will Smith) right along with her.
Not saying you can't do it. Just saying it seems your horses are more likely to run away than your dogs, but your dogs are definitely more likely to run forward.
I hate pack rats.
Ooooh, forget pack horses or pack dogs.
Get yourself a few handy giant pack rats to carry your stuff. Feed them enough cheese, and I doubt they'll run away or run into battle at all...
I can't believe no one mentioned this, riding dogs have all of 13 HP. They aren't going to last long in any area effect spells, or for that matter a couple arrows or a lot of creatures can take them out fairly easily with their low AC. You could but barding on them but that cuts into their carrying capacity and doesn't help with area effect stuff.
So assuming you can do the handle animal thing at low levels (remember it takes an action for non-druids) it can be useful. But fairly early in the game you are going to get smashed by a fireball and it's toast. Out party is 3rd level and gets blasted by AoE spells far too often.
You could leave the dog/ pony a bit behind but then your stuff is vulnerable to theft.
Overall... it's a good idea but has a few issues.
Not trying to be all negative here, but I've seen a lot of animal companions wiped out this way, in particular rangers riding dogs.
I think pack rats have evasion so they would be better with the area effect stuff.
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I can't believe no one mentioned this, riding dogs have all of 13 HP. They aren't going to last long in any area effect spells, or for that matter a couple arrows or a lot of creatures can take them out fairly easily with their low AC. You could but barding on them but that cuts into their carrying capacity and doesn't help with area effect stuff.
Mules, horses, dire rats and cave lizards also have relativley low hit points, but it doesn't negate the idea of using them as pack animals and mounts. Imagine a knight saying, "I didn't bother to buy a horse because I didn't want it to blow up when I am inevitably attacked by a wizard." That's way too metagamey. If you want to use a pack animal or mount, you should just pony up (ha ha) and hope your DM is an animal lover. Who's to say that fireball-casting wizard doesn't decide he's going to need your pack dog to help him carry all the loot from your corpse after he's done enervating you into negative levels?
Mules, horses, dire rats and cave lizards also have relativley low hit points, but it doesn't negate the idea of using them as pack animals and mounts. Imagine a knight saying, "I didn't bother to buy a horse because I didn't want it to blow up when I am inevitably attacked by a wizard." That's way too metagamey. If you want to use a pack animal or mount, you should just pony up (ha ha) and hope your DM is an animal lover. Who's to say that fireball-casting wizard doesn't decide he's going to need your pack dog to help him carry all the loot from your corpse after he's done enervating you into negative levels?
I have to disagree that it's metagamey. Your character knows fireballs happen and he knows that there are hungry monsters in the dungeon that would love a little horsemeat or dogmeat, that's why he personally takes precautions against these things. He's not going to take a relatively helpless animal into the dungeon expecting it to be immune to the things he is armoring up against.
I don't think the fireball casting wizard is very worried about the dog/ pony at the time he blasts you, he's more worried about killing this group of intruders who broke into his home and is trying to kill him. He's not too worried about carting off your gear because generally he's home. The GM will probably not target your dog but the dog still stands a significant chance of getting killed incidentally unless the GM handwaves it away entirely (which I think a lot of GMs probably do).
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just use the big stupid fighter. he must comply should you threaten to stop making his shiny magic swords. the fighter almost always dumps int and cha, he deserves to be a pack mule. it's the highest position he can get in society. with an int and cha of 7, the casters should be making mr. fighter carry thier stuff and abuse the privelege.
Why not an animated object? Like a chest or something.
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I have to disagree that it's metagamey. Your character knows fireballs happen and he knows that there are hungry monsters in the dungeon that would love a little horsemeat or dogmeat, that's why he personally takes precautions against these things. He's not going to take a relatively helpless animal into the dungeon expecting it to be immune to the things he is armoring up against.
I don't think the fireball casting wizard is very worried about the dog/ pony at the time he blasts you, he's more worried about killing this group of intruders who broke into his home and is trying to kill him. He's not too worried about carting off your gear because generally he's home. The GM will probably not target your dog but the dog still stands a significant chance of getting killed incidentally unless the GM handwaves it away entirely (which I think a lot of GMs probably do).
I don't disagree that the PC knows fireballs happen. I'm just saying that taking the HP of an animal into consideration when deciding whether or not to purchase one is metagamey. In a world where a seasoned adventurer can survive falling off the back of a dragon into a live volcano while fighting a wizard I suppose it's a little hard not to sometimes think, "There's no way that alpaca is going to survive my rough-and-tumble lifestyle," but, at lower levels, I think a more likely concern would be, "Am I going to be able to bring my horse into that cave?" or "How likely is it I'll be held responsible when the entire village comes down with filth fever because I thought a chariot pulled by Dire Rats would be awesome?"
What the wizard does to/with pack animals, pets and mounts is as varied as the GM running the game so that's when it comes down to the player to decide what to do with their animal friend once they reach the wizard's home. If you are fighting in a wizard's tower, it probably isn't likely you'll be able to bring a horse in with you anyway but dogs can go all sorts of places. From personal experience, I've never had a GM tell me the horse or dog I left outside was stolen, blown up or carried off by goblins unless it was meant to somehow move the plot along. Individual results may vary.
So, your point about the HP of a dog isn't without some validity. I just don't think it was mentioned because it may not be the first thing people think about when selecting a pet.
Why not an animated object? Like a chest or something.
Indeed. Why not? With hardness and a natural AC, you'd think an animated object would make a great pack beast. However, I think it generally comes down to price and availability. It isn't likely a 1st level adventurer is going to be able to afford an animated steamer trunk, let alone an animated pillow case, even if they can find one. Still, something to save up for. Now that you mention it, howabout an Animated Secret Chest? Think of it. If your secret chest is ever found by some nefarious denizen of the Ethereal Plane, it can defend itself or simply wait for a good moment to sneak away.
Indeed. Why not? With hardness and a natural AC, you'd think an animated object would make a great pack beast. However, I think it generally comes down to price and availability. It isn't likely a 1st level adventurer is going to be able to afford an animated steamer trunk, let alone an animated pillow case, even if they can find one. Still, something to save up for. Now that you mention it, howabout an Animated Secret Chest? Think of it. If your secret chest is ever found by some nefarious denizen of the Ethereal Plane, it can defend itself or simply wait for a good moment to sneak away.
If there was a 1st level character running around with an animated trunk, I'd HAVE to metagame by checking his hat and then running away.