Hunterofthedusk
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How does a familiar's advancement chart interact with PrC's that grant caster progression? I know classes that allow familiars (suck as the sorcerer and the wizard) stack for purposes of the chart, but does that include classes that increase your spellcasting capabilities, or is the familiar left in the dark while their master proceeds into a PrC?
Hunterofthedusk
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And while I'm at it, here's another one, although it should be second nature to me by now but it might be a bit too late for me to think:
Force damage. Is it considered a physical type of damage, such as a something that could be reduced by DR, or is it some kind of special energy damage, with the benefit of hitting incorporeal creatures?
| The Black Bard |
I am 99% certain of the fact that PRCs actually do NOT advance Familiar powers. Most of them state in their section on spellcasting that it only advances your spellcaster level for the purposes of spells known and spells per day, and any other class features from your origional classes do not benefit from that advancement.
Regarding Force, it should be considered a "special energy type". It is not physical damage, like a punch or a bullet. It is magic damage, and often allows Spell Resistance. As such, it is magic effect, and ignores DR. Spell resistance applies as normal based on the spell, and a very very few creatures actually do have resistance/immunity/vunerability to force damage. One trait of force damage is that it is duo-dimensional; that is, it exists on both the material plane and the ethereal plane, and as such ethereal creatures (such as incorporeal undead) are affected normally by it, as if they were physical. They can not pass through walls of force, and the psionic power which covers your weapon in a coat of force allows you to hit them normally with it, rather than 50/50 miss chance.
Take note that most spells which provide resistance or immunity to energy damage specifically list the energy they can protect against, and most of the common spells that provide this benefit do NOT have force on that list.
You could consider force to be a sort of "pure" energy, if you need some science behind your magic.
| The Black Bard |
You'll want to consider the following regarding explosive runes: the object the runes are on also takes the damage. A highly overlooked aspect of the spell, considering how often the spell is placed on spellbooks as a protective measure by PCs.
The section on breaking items doesn't explicitly mention force damage, and is overall poorly worded, but it implies that an object removes its hardness from any attack, and that only certain listed attack forms are less effective (cold, electricity, etc).
So the force would still have to get through the hardness of the item, but at 6d6, that is fairly feasible. While there are certainly other, less convoluted ways to do it, I have seen players use scrolls of explosive runes and summon monster to blow their way through walls.
| Bellona |
How does a familiar's advancement chart interact with PrC's that grant caster progression? I know classes that allow familiars (suck as the sorcerer and the wizard) stack for purposes of the chart, but does that include classes that increase your spellcasting capabilities, or is the familiar left in the dark while their master proceeds into a PrC?
Yes, familiars do get "left behind" (unless the Pr.Cl. specifically says that familiar advancement continues). However, if you have access to Complete Arcane, there is a very useful feat there - Obtain Familiar.
"Obtain Familiar
Pre-requisite: Knowledge (Arcana) 4 ranks, arcane caster level 3
Benefit: You can obtain a familiar in the same manner as a sorcerer or wizard (see the sorcerer class description and the accompanying sidebar, p. 52 of PHB). As with a sorcerer or wizard, obtaining a familiar takes 24 hours and uses up magic materials worth 100 gp.
For the purpose of determining familiar abilities that depend on your arcane caster class level, your levels in all classes that allow you to cast arcane spells stack."
This feat is potentially very useful for Bards, Warmages, and Sorcerers and Wizards taking Pr.Cl. levels.
As an aside, I'm not quite sure how to adjudicate this feat in combination with those Pr.Cl. which give less than full spell advancement. Does one only count those levels which increase one's caster level?
| Cap'n Jose Monkamuck |
Hunterofthedusk wrote:How does a familiar's advancement chart interact with PrC's that grant caster progression? I know classes that allow familiars (suck as the sorcerer and the wizard) stack for purposes of the chart, but does that include classes that increase your spellcasting capabilities, or is the familiar left in the dark while their master proceeds into a PrC?Yes, familiars do get "left behind" (unless the Pr.Cl. specifically says that familiar advancement continues). However, if you have access to Complete Arcane, there is a very useful feat there - Obtain Familiar.
"Obtain Familiar
Pre-requisite: Knowledge (Arcana) 4 ranks, arcane caster level 3Benefit: You can obtain a familiar in the same manner as a sorcerer or wizard (see the sorcerer class description and the accompanying sidebar, p. 52 of PHB). As with a sorcerer or wizard, obtaining a familiar takes 24 hours and uses up magic materials worth 100 gp.
For the purpose of determining familiar abilities that depend on your arcane caster class level, your levels in all classes that allow you to cast arcane spells stack."
This feat is potentially very useful for Bards, Warmages, and Sorcerers and Wizards taking Pr.Cl. levels.
As an aside, I'm not quite sure how to adjudicate this feat in combination with those Pr.Cl. which give less than full spell advancement. Does one only count those levels which increase one's caster level?
It seems pretty clear to me. All the levels of the PrC, even if they do not grant an increase in caster level at that specific level, do stack for the feat.
Not that it is a big deal either way, I'm not really a fan of familiars. Although for those of my players that do like it I allow them to take leadership and make their familiar a cohort. This lets the familiar gain either extra HP, or if it is intelligent enough, class levels.
| Noir le Lotus |
If a character have a familiar, you stack the levels of classes that grant a familiar to determine your familiar advancement.
So yes, taking a PrC will stop his advancement (according table p. 32 if the PHB).
But don't forget that several habilities of the familiar depends on the character level and not the class level.
Familars have half hit points, the base saves and skill points of their master, no matter how many wizard or sorcerer levels the master has.
Ex : if a fighter 19 / wizard 1 (BAB 19, HP = 200) has a familiar, this familiar will have BAB 19, 100 HP, the base saves and skill points of his master.
| Chris P |
Regarding Force, it should be considered a "special energy type". It is not physical damage, like a punch or a bullet. It is magic damage, and often allows Spell Resistance. As such, it is magic effect, and ignores DR. Spell resistance applies as normal based on the spell, and a very very few creatures actually do have resistance/immunity/vunerability to force damage. One trait of force damage is that it is duo-dimensional; that is, it exists on both the material plane and the ethereal plane, and as such ethereal creatures (such as incorporeal undead) are affected normally by it, as if they were physical. They can not pass through walls of force, and the psionic power which covers your weapon in a coat of force allows you to hit them normally with it, rather than 50/50 miss chance.
I don't have access to the RAW right now and you're probably right but I always thought that Force damage was not an energy damage but it's own kind of damage. The benefit was that it was duo-dimension and that no creatures that I can think of have resistance to it. On the flip side I thought it was still subject to DR and SR. That was kind of the balancing factor. Although like I said you're probably right.
| The Black Bard |
Hence my quotation marks around "special energy type". It operates more like an energy than a physical attack, at least in regards to the few monsters that actually have special rules regarding it, like the Force Dragon.
If force effects should have any comprehensive trait, it would be "reliable". Magic missle doesn't miss, wall of force is unbreakable, force effects hit incorporeal creatures reliably, etc, etc.
The general rule is that magic ignores DR, even if the magic deals a physical blow, like the Bigby's Hand spells. However, some spells in the Spell Compendium throw that into slight confusion by explicitly stating in their text that their particular attacks count as magic for the purposes of overcoming DR.
Probably not helping to find a solution, but I wanted that information present in the discussion.