This quote by James in another thread, and my group's recent experience raised a question for me:
The game expects the PCs to be 3rd level by the time they start in on Thistletop, and it also expects 4 PCs, so a lower level & lower number of PCs can certainly end in a grisly TPK here, alas.
That said... even if the goblin druid "wins" the battle... you have a pretty cool option...
** spoiler omitted **
I'm not clear on how the PCs could be 3rd level by this point. Admittedly, I haven't done the math, and I've been using a "you level when it seems right" method, and my players are cool with that. But in our last session, my group assaulted Thistletop...but they were only second level.
Before now, they've faced:
(They blew off Shayliss Vinder and didn't fall for her shenanigans),
The boar hunt (more roleplaying than adventuring, really),
Gresgurt--the goblin commando in the Barrett house,
The Glassworks--goblins and Tsuto, rescued Ameiko,
and the Catacombs of Wrath.
It might have seemed a bit long to level up, but does anyone know where they should have leveled?
At any rate, my group didn't have so much trouble with
It was actually a great session. We're using the Pathfinder rules. Our group consists of:
A Human Fighter who favors a longspear,
A Dwarven Cleric of Sarenrae,
An Elven Wizard,
and a Half-Elf Scout (my wife).
The Dwarf was nearly dead, he was out of spells, the Fighter was down to ONE hitpoint. He was facing down Ripnugget and he kept crapping out on his rolls and not hitting (though Ripnugget has a pretty good AC anyway). The Wizard had cast Grease on Ripnugget's Dogslicer and he lost it, so he picked up the horsechopper from a fallen commando. Several rounds passed where the fighter and Ripnugget kept trying to hit each other but they kept missing. The Dwarf and the Wizard had their hands full with two commandos and the Scout whittled away at Stickfoot, the giant gecko. We kept expecting the fighter to buy it at any moment--I roll the dice in the open...no DM screen. Finally the Scout tags Ripnugget (who was down to about 27 hitpoints) with a natural twenty. She rolled to confirm and rolled...a natural twenty...again.. Ripnugget dropped like a sack of potatoes, his spine shattered by an arrow lodged in the base of his skull. It was a cinematic moment.
Sorry, I had to share that. But anyway, now I'm wondering when to level them. The last session was their first session as second level characters so...now would seem a bit soon, wouldn't it?
Also, I wonder if there would be any way for future APs to include a brief note here and there that basically says, "If you have 4 characters and have played everything through in sequence up to here, this is about when your group should level." Or maybe even just a symbol stuck in at the appropriate point? I realize that these things aren't on rails and it is hard to predict when an individual group might level, but something like that might help GMs like me who don't want to count up xp for every slain goblin or dire rat...
Any thoughts?
CEO
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But anyway, now I'm wondering when to level them. The last session was their first session as second level characters so...now would seem a bit soon, wouldn't it?
I am doing a similar thing in my RotRL campaign. I had my characters level to 2nd after the Glassworks and plan to have them level to 3rd after he battle with Rippnugget. I actually went through the adventure and the actual XPs work out pretty closely to those points in the campaign. Since you missed the earlier 2nd level point, you are in a bit of a bind. Your characters are most likely going to have to be 3rd level before they hit the next level below Thistletop. One thing you might do is have them fight some of the NPCs in the next level and then become third level. However, you might have to add a little sidetrek to the end of Burnt Offerings in order to allow the characters to spread their 3rd level wings a bit before hitting 4th level in time for Skinsaw.
-Lisa
But anyway, now I'm wondering when to level them. The last session was their first session as second level characters so...now would seem a bit soon, wouldn't it?I am doing a similar thing in my RotRL campaign. I had my characters level to 2nd after the Glassworks and plan to have them level to 3rd after he battle with Rippnugget. I actually went through the adventure and the actual XPs work out pretty closely to those points in the campaign. Since you missed the earlier 2nd level point, you are in a bit of a bind. Your characters are most likely going to have to be 3rd level before they hit the next level below Thistletop. One thing you might do is have them fight some of the NPCs in the next level and then become third level. However, you might have to add a little sidetrek to the end of Burnt Offerings in order to allow the characters to spread their 3rd level wings a bit before hitting 4th level in time for Skinsaw.
-Lisa
Thanks, Lisa! I think I'll try that.
Any thoughts on my suggestion to include something like I mentioned above? (In which the AP mentions leveling at certain points or has a symbol or something--while acknowledging that there is no way to predict how every group will proceed through a given adventure, but more of a guideline based on a hypothetical party of 4 who play through in the order in which it is written).
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I, personally, dont like to award XP, I just tell them who got to go up one level before the adventure starts. But I do keep record of what they faced and the XPs they've earned, to keep track of when they *should* lvl up.
I do that mostly because I introduce a lot of side quests and it would take a lot of trouble to escalate the adventure to support the new levels.
Also, for me XP awards makes the game too fast paced, I like to see the PCs grow as friends and make bonds with the world around them. also its kinda wrong (for me) that a 20 years old fighter, with little more than 2 years of "road" is more experienced and skilled than the most graduate elite soldier of a given country.
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CEO
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Any thoughts on my suggestion to include something like I mentioned above? (In which the AP mentions leveling at certain points or has a symbol or something--while acknowledging that there is no way to predict how every group will proceed through a given adventure, but more of a guideline based on a hypothetical party of 4 who play through in the order in which it is written).
I actually had a similar thought and have not gotten around to mentioning it to James yet. Hopefully, I can remember when I get into work later today.
-Lisa
Just finished Burnt Offerings. This is where the group leveled up:
* After the battle with Tsuto at the Glassworkds
* After the Catacombs of Wrath
* Halfway through Thistletop before entering the lower levels
So, going into Skinsaw Murders the characters are almost fifth level.
Any thoughts on my suggestion to include something like I mentioned above? (In which the AP mentions leveling at certain points or has a symbol or something--while acknowledging that there is no way to predict how every group will proceed through a given adventure, but more of a guideline based on a hypothetical party of 4 who play through in the order in which it is written).I actually had a similar thought and have not gotten around to mentioning it to James yet. Hopefully, I can remember when I get into work later today.
-Lisa
Awesome! Good to know! Please let us know what you decide. I obviously think it is a good idea...especially if it can be implemented without taking up a lot of space.
I actually had a similar thought and have not gotten around to mentioning it to James yet. Hopefully, I can remember when I get into work later today.
Please do so! Longer adventures (which the APs certainly are) could certainly use a guideline that notes at what points in the adventure does the designer expect the PCs' levels to be at.
This would be extraordinarily valuable, and takes up virtually no space.
