My party has finally finished The Skinsaw Murders, but one of my players got hit with a bestow curse from Ironbriar.
After discussing it quietly with the player, we decided not to go with one of the silly PHB curses (50% chance to lose each action... what's that about?) but something much more flavourful and scary.
So as Ironbriar fell (he ended up getting captured, and is currently on trial for his extensive crimes) he cursed Oriseus, our elf scout, with the following:
"Until you wash your hands in innocent blood, may your touch bring pain to all those around you!"
I felt this was an appropriately evil and nasty curse for a cleric of Father Skinsaw to inflict, and we agreed on the following: Until he gets a big spell laid on him (I'm thinking break enchantment or better), he's got a 1d4 negative energy touch attack... which he can't control. When someone leans in to heal him... ZAP! When he hands over coins to merchants... ZAP! It's not a massive thing, but when he gets to see his true love, Shalelu, again, he gets a whole lot of angst and roleplaying, which we're all enjoying.
However, there are a couple of ways to remove it. One- the simplest- is to go with Norgorber's wishes. If he murders an innocent, and washes his hands in their blood, the curse ends... and Norgorber is pleased.
Two- if advised by an appropriately powerful cleric (or something), he could find out about some quest to do in order to end the curse on him, which might be a side quest or even a solo mission, depending on how the rest of the party feels when they find out.
I was wondering, though, if anyone had any ideas on an appropriately heroic quest to remove a curse from Norgorber.
Lacking anything inspiring, I was going to go with the quest from Caverns of the Snow Witch, the old Fighting Fantasy gamebooks- basically, seek out a reclusive hermit and perform a few tasks for him in order to have the curse lifted. But Norgorber might start turning the curse inwards if he gets a hint of what's happening.
Any ideas?
I'd want the quest to be somewhat challenging, yet defeat the curse by technically meeting its criteria.
As an eerie mist fills the shrine, Father Kellam's chanting voice grows fainter and fainter. A sensation as of invisible wings surrounds you, and you feel a strong hand grasp your shoulder.
Words form in your mind, the voice deep and resonant. "Beyond the three pillars, the Valley of the Lepers awaits you. Sieze the unblemished skin of the Pure Ram of Selin and bring it to that accursed crevass. Then the Father of Murder shall lose all power over you! You shall know the Pure Ram when you see it, it shall be the seventh creature to drink from the seventh spring on Mount Elin.
"Now go!"
When he completes his journey and brings the healing ram to the leprous inhabitants of the crevass, his condition will be dispelled. of course, there will be others who seek the ram...
Why "Break Enchantment or better?" That seems a bit harsh.
What about Remove Curse? It, uh, removes curses...
Break Enchantment is a 5th level spell. Why does the PC have to use a 5th level spell or higher to end the 3rd level spell that Ironbriar cast on him?
But I can see that you were hoping this event would be "full of flavor". So regardless of what spell you allow to clear the curse, assume that the god of whichever cleric will cast the removal spell demands some sort of service from the scout. Maybe some sort of solo mission to sneak in and thwart some evil cultists somwhere who are threatening some good-aligned faithful folk.
Although since the guy's a scout, Ironbriar could have said "I curse you with clumsiness" and given him -6 to his Dex. That would ruin all the PC's days until he got it removed.
Why "Break Enchantment or better?" That seems a bit harsh.
Remove Curse is a pretty simple spell, and the PCs got Chaplain Tira Ronnova to witness their interrogation of Ironbriar. If it were that simple, she could have just removed it the next day, but it's really not so much a "curse" if it only lasts a few hours, then it's basically just equivalent to an extended Touch of Idiocy... not particularly scary for a "curse".
Although since the guy's a scout, Ironbriar could have said "I curse you with clumsiness" and given him -6 to his Dex. That would ruin all the PC's days until he got it removed.
Actually, originally just went with the ordinary rules and he did take a -6 Dex, but that annoyed him too much. So we worked this out instead.
I'd want the quest to be somewhat challenging, yet defeat the curse by technically meeting its criteria.
When he completes his journey and brings the healing ram to the leprous inhabitants of the crevass, his condition will be dispelled. of course, there will be others who seek the ram...
Something like this is great... I was also thinking that once Norgorber worked out what he was doing, he'd inform a few other clerics and servants, so some scary assassins, murderers, and clerics will be trying to stop him.
Remove Curse is a pretty simple spell, and the PCs got Chaplain Tira Ronnova to witness their interrogation of Ironbriar. If it were that simple, she could have just removed it the next day, but it's really not so much a "curse" if it only lasts a few hours, then it's basically just equivalent to an extended Touch of Idiocy... not particularly scary for a "curse".
Yeah, but how scary does it really need to be? Ironbriar only had to rack a 3rd level spell to force the poor schlub into a side-quest. Not to mention all the extra damage that might get dealt out.
But if the player is up for a side quest, game on.
Although it would be funny if he just stopped touching his friends and put up with the curse indefinately like the guy from Pushing Daisies!
Hey, is that where you got the idea?
For a 3rd level curse, that is waaay too powerful, but I would prefer to just assume that his god gave the poor over CRed schmuck a break. He's a pushover, so giving him a potent ability balances the cosmic scales a bit.
I've never been fond of the way that some situations that should be full of menace and wonder are summarily dealt with in D&D. Magic should never be dealt with in the same way that a guy would go down to the market to pick up a new quiver of arrows. If it's dealt with that way, then it's not magic anymore.
Although it would be funny if he just stopped touching his friends and put up with the curse indefinately like the guy from Pushing Daisies!
Hey, is that where you got the idea?
No, it isn't actually, but there's a free DVD of the first episode with one of the local papers at the moment, should I pick it up?
I've never been fond of the way that some situations that should be full of menace and wonder are summarily dealt with in D&D. Magic should never be dealt with in the same way that a guy would go down to the market to pick up a new quiver of arrows. If it's dealt with that way, then it's not magic anymore.
I agree, I've always liked the 'Conan' style of magic better... it should be scary, mysterious, and weird, not just a mechanical "wave hands like so, say particular words, achieve x result". Like calculus, but more understandable.
I agree, I've always liked the 'Conan' style of magic better... it should be scary, mysterious, and weird, not just a mechanical "wave hands like so, say particular words, achieve x result". Like calculus, but more understandable.
A valid point. Unfortunately, 3.5 D&D just isn't set up that way. If you want that feel for magic you're almost better off going with another game system.
99% of magic in D&D is codified in the rules. That way, it's available for both the players and the DM to use magic and have fun with it, while hopefully limiting abuse from either sides.
The potential drawback to that system is that the DM may feel limited.
I think the DM should have some flexibility.
But I know that some people feel that if the DM is using something that's not in the SRD or a published source, he's cheating. They figure it's not fair if the PCs can't at least "potentially" duplicate every bit of magic they see used against them.
Seems a bit inflexible, but maybe they've been burned by too many "rocks fall, everyone dies" moments.
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Quite an interesting thread!
And more important: I like your form of mutual respect which let's you state your point without the unfortunately frequent 'missionary' tendencies.
Back to the topic at hand:
I agree, I've always liked the 'Conan' style of magic better... it should be scary, mysterious, and weird, not just a mechanical "wave hands like so, say particular words, achieve x result". Like calculus, but more understandable.
Do you mean the Conan novels or the Conan d20 game? Unfortunately I was never able to get a closer look at the game.
Can anyone shed some light on it?
Any flavour or rule side differences which set it apart from other d20 products (apart from its unique setting)?
Thanks!
Cheers,
Guenther
Quite an interesting thread!
And more important: I like your form of mutual respect which let's you state your point without the unfortunately frequent 'missionary' tendencies.
Thanks for noticing. :)
Do you mean the Conan novels or the Conan d20 game? Unfortunately I was never able to get a closer look at the game.
Cheers, Guenther
The books.
I, unfortunately, haven't looked too closely yet at the game (RPGNow did a free download for "Thanksgiveaway week" which included the 'pocket book' of the rules). The classes are a little more martial, there's some interesting playing with the rules (you have favoured sneak attack, so you choose a weapon, and you do +1d8 with that weapon or +1d6 with others), there's no difference between divine magic and arcane magic, priests just make it a religious ceremony while mages do more wizardy stuff, there's a lot more combat maneuvers you can do (like 'draw your sword as a free action during part of a move action if you have BAB+1 or better', including stuff like hitting a weak spot, cutting through armour, all that kind of thing.).