Just wondering, if Paizo does end up staying with the "3.5 version" of the OGL, will they put out a Pathfinder Player's Handbook, GM's Guide, and Monster Manual? Using the artwork from the setting and adding in a few "Golarion" specific examples in the books?
Just wondering, since eventually the "core" 3.5 books might get scarce, and while its fine to look up the OGL stuff online, having an actual book is kind of cool (and would be even cooler with a Pathfinder specific look to the book).
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A Player's Guide would be nice, we're already getting a couple things...
Campaign setting like: Pathfinder Chronicles Gazetteer
Monster Manual: Pathfinder Chronicles: Classic Monsters Revisited
So we're just 2 books short, I don't think we'll get an answer until 2009 when 4E hits. If they go 4E they'll release a 4E book. If they stick to 3.5, they can still release those books. :)
A Player's Guide would be nice, we're already getting a couple things...
Campaign setting like: Pathfinder Chronicles Gazetteer
Monster Manual: Pathfinder Chronicles: Classic Monsters Revisited
So we're just 2 books short, I don't think we'll get an answer until 2009 when 4E hits. If they go 4E they'll release a 4E book. If they stick to 3.5, they can still release those books. :)
Oh, I know about those, and they look great. I was looking more at something that would essentially completely replace the PH, MM, and DMG. You know . . . because I'd rather give my money to people that I think actually listen to the people currently buying from them instead of people that might, in theory, buy from them someday.
*snickers*
I still think a Player's book is pretty far off. We might see another Runelords Player's Guide-like product before we see a full PHB replace, in any case, I like the Core classes.
Sorry . . . still recovering . . . ::deep breath::
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What? :P
Hey, just because I trash everything Wizards of the Coast does on current other forums *waves to Candlekeep forums* doesn't mean I don't like 3.0/3.5. I'm actually insulted that they're dumbing it down and think spellcasters need per-encounter spellcasting. DMs should plan for their spellcasters limits when they set up their "daily" encounters.
Anyway, I digress. More Pathfinder please!
Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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Just wondering, since eventually the "core" 3.5 books might get scarce, and while its fine to look up the OGL stuff online, having an actual book is kind of cool (and would be even cooler with a Pathfinder specific look to the book).
Why do you think the 3.5 books will become scarce? Neither the 1e nor 2e core books are scarce. The only scarce books I can think of tend to be those with low print runs (e.g., original Dieties & Demigods with Elric pantheon, stuff published during the last days of TSR). Even setting aside the issue of migration to 4e, you still see a significant population of people that game for a period of time (high school/college) and then quit at a later date. Their 3.5 books will almost certainly enter the secondary market.
Plus, even if the 3.5 books do become scarce, there are already stripped down print versions of the OGL available for around $5.00. I'm not sure if it would be worth while for Paizo to print a PHB with new art and try to compete with each of the secondary market, the cheap print market, and the internet pdf. They'd get slaughtered.
An alternate PHB ala Aracana Unearthed might be more feasible, but then you're basically getting a new edition of D&D without actually calling it a new edition.
Just wondering, since eventually the "core" 3.5 books might get scarce, and while its fine to look up the OGL stuff online, having an actual book is kind of cool (and would be even cooler with a Pathfinder specific look to the book).Why do you think the 3.5 books will become scarce? Neither the 1e nor 2e core books are scarce. The only scarce books I can think of tend to be those with low print runs (e.g., original Dieties & Demigods with Elric pantheon, stuff published during the last days of TSR). Even setting aside the issue of migration to 4e, you still see a significant population of people that game for a period of time (high school/college) and then quit at a later date. Their 3.5 books will almost certainly enter the secondary market.
Plus, even if the 3.5 books do become scarce, there are already stripped down print versions of the OGL available for around $5.00. I'm not sure if it would be worth while for Paizo to print a PHB with new art and try to compete with each of the secondary market, the cheap print market, and the internet pdf. They'd get slaughtered.
An alternate PHB ala Aracana Unearthed might be more feasible, but then you're basically getting a new edition of D&D without actually calling it a new edition.
I was kind of thinking "new shiny" book would be scarce. You make a good point. Also, sorry, I was trying to be positive about 4th and open minded, but the whole "no, we aren't fragging the setting" a few days before they release a book preview fragging the setting kind of made me cynical again. Sorry 'bout that.
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I was kind of thinking "new shiny" book would be scarce.
Knight - I think you have a point about a 'shiny new' book should Paizo stay with 3.5 - it will be important both to keep drawing new players into the Pathfinder world (rather than relying on us 3.5 grognards to sustain the business), and to brand the work that they're doing in a significant way.
Hey - I'd even get on board if Paizo were to launch a 3.75e that adapts the good ideas from 4e but leaves the history/cosmology of the D&D ethos intact.
Strangely enough, I find much of my resistence to a new edition disappears when I think about Paizo doing it - in fact, I could get excited about that.
I think this is because I have a higher level of trust in the Paizo team, their quality of product, and their customer-focused approach/ communication style. Plus Paizo delivers more of what I'm looking for in a D&D experience than WotC has been providing lately.
I intuitively believe that the senior Paizo team are gamers at heart with a good mind for business (if only TSR had had that combo in the 80s), while WotC (out of necessity as part of a publicly traded company) is driven by business decisions that may or may not be in the best interest of D&Ders long-term.
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Lol.. no 3.75 please. If Star Wars Saga Edition is any indication of what 4th edition will be like, then the only major thing we have to worry about is what they do to the magic system to allow spellcasters per encounter
casting.
Noteworthy changes...
1. AC doesn't really exist anymore. AC and Reflex are 1 stat now and it's generated 1 of two ways. If you wear armor it's.. 10 + Armor + Dex + Misc, if you don't wear armor it's 10 + Character Level + Dex + Misc. So a 20 level fighter doesn't need platemail anymore. ;)
2. Fortitude and Will work like Reflex. 10 + Character Level + Ability Mod + Class Mod + Misc. (All classes get a starting "bonus" just like 3.0/3.5 the classes have 1 beefy save or multiple bonuses at level 1. Class bonus is also figured in AC/Reflex btw.)
3. No more skill points. Everyone can use every skill (unless restricted or not usable untrained.) Every class still has a skill list though. Of this list, you can "train" in it. Trained means you rolls 1d20 + Ability Mod + 1/2 Character Level + 5. Untrained skills just mean you don't get the +5. Skill Training feat let's you get the +5 at later levels. Each class gets to train in X + Intelligence at level 1. Skill focus now offers an extra +5 to your skill.
4. Movement is "square" based instead of feet/meter based. Most base movements is 6 squares, since squares have always been 5ft (or 1.5 meters depending on the game) it's still 30ft.. but they're clearly pushing miniatures and battle maps/grids.
Otherwise D20 seems to be remaining the same. Star Wars Saga is more like D20 modern now though, so I'd worry about D&D going that direction. Basically all of the base classes look soemthign like this.. Feat/Talent/Feat/Talent. No fixed "abilities" anymore (like a Ranger's Favored Enemy at this, this, and this level or a Rogue's Sneak Attack every couple levels.) The base classes at least to me seem much weaker, but that's ok because it Star Wars at least, most times you were going for a prestige class anyway. I'd be concerned they'd take this route with D&D, but it could be interesting for a rogue, ignore all the evasion type abilities and only take sneak attack bonuses.
I was looking more at something that would essentially completely replace the PH, MM, and DMG. You know . . . because I'd rather give my money to people that I think actually listen to the people currently buying from them instead of people that might, in theory, buy from them someday.
This is a great idea! Can I buy leather special editions also? (I'm being sincere.)
4. Movement is "square" based instead of feet/meter based. Most base movements is 6 squares, since squares have always been 5ft (or 1.5 meters depending on the game) it's still 30ft.. but they're clearly pushing miniatures and battle maps/grids.
When I run SW, I'm going to tell my players that a "square" is a Galactic Standard unit. :-P
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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I was kind of thinking "new shiny" book would be scarce. You make a good point. Also, sorry, I was trying to be positive about 4th and open minded, but the whole "no, we aren't fragging the setting" a few days before they release a book preview fragging the setting kind of made me cynical again. Sorry 'bout that.
No worries. I think the boards are at a point where you could start a thread about the special theory of relativity and it would turn into a 4e flame war by the 5th post.
Btw, what happened to fr that got you going?
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It's like, they're advancing the timeline 10 years, or 100 years, and destroying a bunch of countries and stuff. Translation: (imho)they're nullifying all the old fluff so you have to buy all the NEW FR fluff.
It's not so you have to buy it, people will buy it anyway. It's so they don't have to read the old FR fluff and worry about continuity. They few Realms supplements they released all had editor over sighters because the people working on them weren't familiar with the AD&D product they were supposed to be updating and writing about. Now they can get caught in huge continuity mistakes, editor oversights, and what not by the fans, and instead blame the change on the Spell Plague instead of dealing with all the hate they receive for sloppy editing.
I was kind of thinking "new shiny" book would be scarce. You make a good point. Also, sorry, I was trying to be positive about 4th and open minded, but the whole "no, we aren't fragging the setting" a few days before they release a book preview fragging the setting kind of made me cynical again. Sorry 'bout that.No worries. I think the boards are at a point where you could start a thread about the special theory of relativity and it would turn into a 4e flame war by the 5th post.
Btw, what happened to fr that got you going?
Pretty much what Heathy said. I'm a little burned out on railing against it, or explaining it, or what have you, but yeah, I'm just bummed the the setting has pretty much been gutted, or will be soon.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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It's like, they're advancing the timeline 10 years, or 100 years, and destroying a bunch of countries and stuff. Translation: (imho)they're nullifying all the old fluff so you have to buy all the NEW FR fluff.
Where's the cite for the info? I am interested in learning more.
Not sure if this was covered but someone said that 4e comes out in 2009. Actually it will be coming out in May of 2008. As all three core books will be available in time for GenCon '08.
When I run SW, I'm going to tell my players that a "square" is a Galactic Standard unit. :-P
I dig.
well, i would really like to see some "Pathfinder RPG rulesets".
Is Paizo (or any company for that matter) really allowed to re-print the 3.5 core rulebooks and sell them?
If Pathfinder stayed 3.5 (please do) while WotC moved on to 4th...
Could Paizo really publish the "Pathfinder RPG Rulebooks" wich are basically the PHB, DMG and MM 3.5 but with Mind Flayers, Beholders ect removed and some new Pathfinder monsters inserted? And the gods and planes in the DMG changed to Pathfinder's?
I really doubt this would be allowed.
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Is Paizo (Or any company for that matter) really allowed to re-print the 3.5 core rulebooks and sell them?
If Pathfinder stayed 3.5 (please do) while WotC moved on to 4th...Could Paizo really publish "Pathfinder RPG Rulebooks" wich are basicallythe PHB DMG and MM 3.5 with Mind Flayers, Beholders ect removed and some new Pathfinder monsters inserted into the new MM and the gods and planes in the DMG changed to Pathfinder?
I really doubt this would be allowed.
There are large parts of the 3.5 SRD reprinted in Monte Cook's WoD with minor if any changes.
There are large parts of the 3.5 SRD reprinted in Monte Cook's WoD with minor if any changes.
Really? Well then heck lets do this!!! :)
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Don't be fooled here. World of Darkness though is completely different then Dungeons & Dragons.
For the most part, WoD is a Modern setting with Vampires, Werewolves, and the occasional normal spellcaster. It MUST have it's own "rule set" because classes like Fighter, Barbarian, Druid, and Ranger would be silly in a modern campaign setting.
Pathfinder is a traditional fantasy setting and thus fully compatible with the core books.