Did anyone else's PCs have a really hard time with the Fire Elementals from the Demonskar Legacy? My players were just able to take down one of them and the Blue Duke had to handle 3/4 of the other. I know its an EL 9 and they haven't rested from the EL 8 earlier in the day, but it still turned out to be an encounter that was too hard for them.
I ahve always thought the bigger elementals are more powerful then their CR allows.
Dedekind
Yeah, my players were at the right level for this and had help from Fario and Fellian. They still needed the Blue Duke to help out.... way too hard.
They had a hell of a time putting the fires out too since the hardcover assumes the Blue Duke will use 'multiple' cones of cold. He only has one and had to use it on the elementals.
Yeah, that one cone of cold did great, but it still wasn't enough.
I also had a couple of half-orcs firing bows at the elementals, but that was really token support.
Dedekind
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During my group's first attempt to play this game it went very interestingly. (F = fire elemental P = player)
Place yourselves on the battlemat!
F F
P
PPPP
The player at the front put his char down first and he was the wizard, everyone else put themselves way back. The wizard player went wtf? and then got smushed. He had just brought that char in that session too.
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During my group's first attempt to play this game it went very interestingly. (F = fire elemental P = player)
Place yourselves on the battlemat!
F F
P
PPPP
The player at the front put his char down first and he was the wizard, everyone else put themselves way back. The wizard player went wtf? and then got smushed. He had just brought that char in that session too.
D'oh!!!
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Did anyone else's PCs have a really hard time with the Fire Elementals from the Demonskar Legacy? My players were just able to take down one of them and the Blue Duke had to handle 3/4 of the other. I know its an EL 9 and they haven't rested from the EL 8 earlier in the day, but it still turned out to be an encounter that was too hard for them.
I ahve always thought the bigger elementals are more powerful then their CR allows.
Dedekind
Yes, indeed. A "favored" NPC (the PCs loved the guy for his story goodness) - Kamoro of No House - the only guy who could do any damage to the fire elementals with any significance (and even then, only about 4-5 points on average over the F.E.'s DR, was killed. One of the PC's in the party, Oskar Strakeln, a dwarven priest of Pelor and the party's uber-healer extraordinaire, was killed.
The rest of the party, seeing that combat was relatively hopeless (the telepath had a few good first digs, but got taken to 4 hp and then fled), went into Minuta's Board to help the scullery boy in there. Meanwhile, Zarn Kyass (flying) came in and launched a SINGLE (whoops, module mistake said "multiple") cone of cold. Another major NPC, a deus ex machina named The Empyreal Mendicant, was the main reason for defeating these things.
Now, this was a tough combat, make no mistake. However, it was less a function of CR (though I do think they are tougher than CR 7) and more of an issue that the party simply wasn't equipped to handle such a menace. The super-thief couldn't sneak attack it. The risen martyr fighter is more of an agility warrior and would not have been able to do enough damage, if much of any. The leader of the party, a sanctified rogue human slayer of Domiel, couldn't even blast them with her 3d6 light ray since it only hurts evil creatures. The minotaur - the only one who might have really pounded the elementals - was reprimanded by Ike Iverson and told to stay in his cell at the Cathedral of Wee Jas for "helping the dangerous anarchist Maavu" survive earlier in the day. (Minotaur is training to become a cleric.)
Nope, the party makeup is very combat-stealth makeup, and except for the half-dragon psionicist (who suffers due to his LA), they don't really have the arcane artillery backup that a party of 8th ECL would normally have to bring to bear in such a situation.
Now, the party is without a proper healer, and the leader (the Slayer of Domiel) just put forth a massive expenditure in party treasury for scrolls (she has a +15 UMD modifier) and potions for this next adventure.
Yeah, the one guy with the HP to deal with the elementals didn't have the Reflex save to keep from catching fire. And their Spring Attack is nasty. Plus the one wizard in the party was a necromancer who took evocation and illusion as his opposition schools because he wanted a "challenge".
He got himself very dead.
The players really struggled against the fire elementals. They have two clerics, a rogue, a ranger/rogue, and an NPC barbarian. So not really prepared for the combat (after waking up during the night)they managed to destroy the first elemental. The NPC was slain though. Only the arrival of the Blue Duke turned the tide of battle (that cone of cold sure helped). They still only just managed to defeat the second elemental.
It looks like this is one of those situations where a group with out a dedicated arcane caster (or two in my case) really struggle. Unfortunately I think you will see more of this trend as the game gets into higher levels.
I would have a serious talk to your players about this and ask them to brainstorm some ideas on how they can mitigate this type of situation.
Sean Mahoney