|
I saw an article this morning that Stephen Donaldson is going to write a third Thomas Covenant trilogy. I was once given the second trilogy as a gift, but never got around to reading it and eventually lost it.
So are these books worth the read. I'm always looking out for something that might be interesting. Any opinions are welcome. Thanks in advance.
I seriously disliked Thomas Covenant, the main character was a) a whiner b) extremely unlikable.
Just one of the few books that I didn't want to finish, and that says alot.
I really liked the entire series and asked him, the author (who is the dad of one of our gaming group guys, about some of his choices in the story once; like about why a leper and why such a whiney, dislikable character, but his answers were good and i agree with him. The character is very believable and while he is much the antihero archtype, he gets the job done and has some very good and lovable freinds like Saltheart Foamfollower; and the world changes through the series and it is really cool how people adapt and how Thomas tries to keep to his mantra.
The first series is a bit rough as you are dealing with Thomas dealing with his extreme personal crisis, but the series has enough depth and is truly a great story.
I highly recommend you read the first series first starting with Lord Foul's Bane, without that not much else will make sense; the Illearth war was a hard read the first time I read it, but subsequent reading were much better as I knew more about what was going on, by the time your get through the Power That Preserves, the story flows much easier and you should have a sense of involvement with the story.
yes, Thomas is a hard man to deal with; very unlikeable and self centered and self pitying, ect. But it is also nice to watch him develop and learn to care for others. If you have ever dealth with anyone with a long term illness or ever been divorced or separated for a long time and loved your wife; this series will pull at your heartstrings.
|
|
The first chronicles are interesting, but dark. The Bloodguard are a really cool bunch of characters, and it'd have been great to have known more about the magic secrets the old High Lords had (and why the current ones couldn't access them; sorry if that's a spoiler).
In the second chronicles, the world has pretty much gone to hell, and the series is very, very grim. I didn't enjoy it at all, but I did manage to struggle through it.
I agree with ericthecleric here. I read the first chronicles back in high school and loved them. Now that i hear(read) that a third chronicles my be coming out soon, perhaps i should go pick up the second chronicles this x-mas. One more thing, the Bloodguard were really cool. If anything, i wish the author would have went into more detail about the Bloodguard and their training methods. I kinda pictured them starting as orphaned children, developing their minds and their martial arts skills in a type of monastery. I would have also liked more detail about the Old High Lords-perhaps a flashback, showing the reader just how powerful they really were in their heyday.
Thoth-Amon
|
The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant rank as some of my favorite books of all time. Oh and real quick, the first book of the newest (and final) series was released back in the summer of '04. The next book is due out in October '07.
The whole series is dark but thought provoking and stunningly imaginative. What is evil and what if no one cared?
If you endevour to read them, please start with the first series. Nothing makes sense without that context.
...I am also deeply impressed with The Golden Age series by John C. Wright (although it is night and day different).
|
|
Now that i hear(read) that a third chronicles my be coming out soon, perhaps i should go pick up the second chronicles this x-mas.
Thoth-AmonHere is a link to the article I read:
http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/index.php?category=5&id=39095
Thanks Aberzombie, i found the quote interesting.
Thoth-Amon
the bloodguard got there skills from constant warfare with each other as they live in passionatly wild tribes, while they have more magical talent than just about anyone; they dont use it in battle as it would be in their belief system; profane as they only use their magic for worship. hmm, dont want to spoil it for you so stop reading here if you haven't read the story; the magic of the bloodguard is so deeply ingrained in them that it shaped the conditions of their vow; so strong it adventually brought about their faiure. In one of the books the race that the bloodguard came from met the Wielder of the Staff of Law and his lords and their army in battle and they became so awed by the lords that the fighting stopped and a group swore the oath as a tribute.
Personally, I think the giants are much more interesting
The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant rank as some of my favorite books of all time. Oh and real quick, the first book of the newest (and final) series was released back in the summer of '04. The next book is due out in October '07.
Indeed, the name of the first book of the Last Chronicles of Thomas Covenant is called Runes of the Earth. Here is the release schedule:
Tentative Last Chronicles Dates
° The Runes of the Earth - Oct 2004
° Fatal Revenant - Oct 2007
° Should Pass Utterly - 2010
° The Last Dark - 2013
after White Gold Wielder came out, I had assumed that the saga of Thomas Covenant had come to an end; being the guardian for the Arch of Time does tend to imply a certain end to the saga
after White Gold Wielder came out, I had assumed that the saga of Thomas Covenant had come to an end; being the guardian for the Arch of Time does tend to imply a certain end to the saga
Actually, over on Donaldson’s website he indicates that he always intended to write a third chronicles as a sequel to the second but that he and the editor where having issues at the time:
"The last "Chronicle" was published in 1983. What inspired you to return to Thomas Covenant and the Land after all these years?
Actually, I've had the story for "The Last Chronicles" in mind for at least 25 years. When I first began to imagine "The Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant," the ideas for this final project struck me at the same time. As a result, while I was writing "The Second Chronicles" I was able to prepare the way for "The Last Chronicles" by creating all of the loose ends and back doors I would need.
When I wrote the original "Covenant" trilogy, I had no intention of pursuing either the characters or the setting further. The story seemed complete to me as it stood. But my editor at that time was Lester del Rey, and he was the King of Sequels. As soon as I finished working on The Power that Preserves, he began to push for more "Covenant." Ignoring my protests, he tried to prod me by sending me ideas for a second trilogy. Well, these ideas were all bad (I thought they were inherently bad, but they may simply have been bad because they weren't mine). And they got worse as Lester pushed harder. Finally he succeeded at sending me an idea so bad that before I could stop myself I thought, "No, that's terrible, what I really ought to do is--" And there, almost involuntarily, I conceived the stories for both "The Second Chronicles" and "The Last Chronicles."
As I imagined it at the time, "The Second Chronicles" was a logical extension of the first "Covenant" trilogy. In the same way, "The Last Chronicles" is a logical extension of the second."
I have read the Runes of the Earth and enjoyed it. I liked the rest of the series also. The main character is a major jerk (to be polite), but by the end of White Gold Wielder he has come full circle. He is able to change enough to have someone fall in love with him (which is hard to believe after you read the first book).
Foul out.
I didn't read this series until about 3 years ago. I'll admit, it wasn't easy getting thru the 1st book, I mean who wants to read about a whiney jerk? But I got thru it & onto the reast of the series & loved it. It's great to see a character develop. I haven't read Runes of the Earth but it's on my reading list.
I really liked the entire series and asked him, the author (who is the dad of one of our gaming group guys), about some of his choices in the story once; like about why a leper and why such a whiney, dislikable character, but his answers were good and i agree with him.
I would be very interested to hear the reasons he gave you. Those books affected me deeply when I read them as a teenager. They shocked me, but they were the first fantasy books I ever read where the characters seemed natural and real and there was nothing romantic or interesting about the evil; it was just plain disturbing. Up until that point the only fantasy I had read was lightweight D&D novels and the LoTR, where I didn't feel connected to any of the charcters or care what happened to them except for Boromir and he died!
|
Without peer, these books have always been my favorite fantasy novels. They moved me to tears many times (Saltheart and Hotash Slay anyone?) I always thought of these as "adult" fantasy whereas Tolkien and Terry Brooks were "Young" fantasy. I bought the first book of the third 'quadrilogy', but I am saving it until at least one more comes out (and after I have gotten through my back log of D&D Rulebooks, Dungeon and Dragon subscriptions and the rest of the Dark Tower books!)
I strongly advise that you start from the beginning. I also advise you to keep reading even when you don't want to; it is worth it. I've had three friends refuse to read past the (spoiler ahead) 'rape' scene, because they found a certain main character revolting after they finished that part. But it does get better, and you may grow to love The Land as much as I do.
You know; I played D&D with Stephen's son for a while in our group; I asked Stephen once why he picked such a character as Thomas and why a leper.
I read all of these books between age 14 an 15, so what I offer is a young man's perspective. But I can tell you that those six books took me up, up and away, and I was the better for it. The Bloodguard, the Ranyhyn (sp?) and the giants provided the necessary light and likeability to Thomas' dark antihero soul. He did some bad things, and I very much hated him for a while. But I wasn't going anywhere but to the next page.
The one thing I recall disliking was the way in which he disbelieved this world in the first book. It felt quite plastered on... as if Donaldson said, "Rather than give good reasons for why Thomas would consider this fantasy world he's been living in for a solid month to be a persistent delusion, I'll just keep adding the same paragraph every thirty pages that reiterates his incredulity, citing little reason why."
If a new trilogy comes out... I'll wait for the third book to come out and then buy all three. I'll then read the previous six and move on to the new set.
I can't stand to read epic fantasy anymore, but I will gladly make an exception to see how these old friends, and this old world I remember so fondly from teendom make out.
You know; I played D&D with Stephen's son for a while in our group; I asked Stephen once why he picked such a character as Thomas and why a leper.
That's pretty cool, Vale. :)
Have you ever read Dragon on a Pedestal? A collection of his short stories? Some of them are quite good.
Read the Mordant's Need books FIRST: The Mirror of Her Dreams and A Man Rides Through. If you can read those two books without slitting your wrists, you may then ATTEMPT to read the Covenant books. "Mirror" was hard to get through (the heroes could do no right) but compared to "Covenant", it is positively cheerful.
If I had read "Need" first, I might have had more patience for "Covenant". I slogged through the first one and started the second, but I just couldn't finish it.
What really turned me off about the Chronicles was what Jade was referring to. It seemed like every other page, Thomas was telling himself (and us)," This isn't real, this isn't happening, I'll die if I believe..." Makes it just a *touch* hard to get into and stay in the story when the main character, though which we are supposed to experience it, jolts us out of it every 30 seconds.
You know; I played D&D with Stephen's son for a while in our group; I asked Stephen once why he picked such a character as Thomas and why a leper.
Dammit Valegrim, Stop telling us how you asked him, and tell us what his answer was! :P
Although I heard he picked a leper because his father was a doctor who worked on one of those leper islands. Don't know how true that is though.
Let us remember that the main character was a leper and had lost EVERYTHING, so I find it pretty easy to believe someone in that position would believe it was his mind trying to deal with his situation.
After the first trilogy I had trouble seeing how he would do in the second, until he sums it up like this: "How do you hurt somone who has lost everything? Give it back to him broken!"
Although I heard he picked a leper because his father was a doctor who worked on one of those leper islands. Don't know how true that is though.
That is true, and that's why he picked a leper.
Let us remember that the main character was a leper and had lost EVERYTHING, so I find it pretty easy to believe someone in that position would believe it was his mind trying to deal with his situation.
I'm certainly not saying that his disbelief was an impossibility, just that its rendering, for me at age fourteen anyway, felt a bit tacked on and underfunded.
I am a fan though, and I learned a lot from reading him. Especially his book of short stories, which BTW, contain a deleted chapter from The Illearth War called Gilden Fire.
I loved the first trilogy. The ani-hero archetype that Donaldson makes of Covenant is classic. He's one of those guys you love to hate. The magic of The Land is very consistent, the "creature types" (from Ur-viles to Forrestals) were unusual, if not unique. Very well done. I was a little sceptical about the second trilogy but read it. It was good, but not like the first. In fact, you really need the first to keep up with what's going on. As for a third group, I don't know. You can only milk a story line for so much before it goes really stale and Donaldson may end up crossing that line. I've picked up the first new one in hardback (1/2 price store) and will get around to it when the rest of my backloged reading, (like the Amber prequils that Gregory Betancourt wrote and I just found out about...)