There are several classes and prestige classes that allow you bonus damage based on an Ability modifier (CHA for Smite, INT for Precise Strike, etc.) I have never seen any language under any of these bonuses that indicate that you would not get the bonus if you are denied your STR bonus.
The rules-lawyer in me wants to say that all damage modified by Attributes are handled the same way, but it just seems to not fit in my head. Anyone have any thoughts on the subject?
I have never seen any language under any of these bonuses that indicate that you would not get the bonus if you are denied your STR bonus.
When would you be denied your STR bonus? If you had no STR you would not be attacking.
IMO if you are capable of wielding your weapon you should get all your bonus damage from INT/CHA etc. Simply because this bonus damage is based on how accurately or how fervently you strike the opponent rather than how much force you put behind the blow.
I have never seen any language under any of these bonuses that indicate that you would not get the bonus if you are denied your STR bonus.When would you be denied your STR bonus? If you had no STR you would not be attacking.
IMO if you are capable of wielding your weapon you should get all your bonus damage from INT/CHA etc. Simply because this bonus damage is based on how accurately or how fervently you strike the opponent rather than how much force you put behind the blow.
I agree with the above. I can't think of an example where someone would be denied a Str bonus (or a CHA, or INT, or DEX, or WIS) during his attack that would make him lose the bonus. I know you can lose your dex bonus with a daze spell - but only until your next turn. And some of your other stats can be reduced by spells (Feeblemind, Bestow Curse) but that is something that reduces your abilities more or less permanently and probably not what you meant.
However, if you can find an example of something that denies those other bonuses from Int or Cha, then I'd think that it would only deny you the use of that single bonus and not all the others, too.
In this ridiculous example: I have a 1 monk/ 1 pal/ 1 bard PC with S:16, C:16, D:16, W:16, I:16, Ch:16 wielding a rapier. He finds himself feebleminded (as the spell, not because of a lack of where he's going in life) and so his Int and Wis are 3's. He will lose the Wis modifier to his AC and the ability to use weapon finesse with the rapier, but he could still club someone with it and add his Str bonus and smite them if they were evil. I think - actually, thinking up that example just made me feebleminded...
When would you be denied your STR bonus? If you had no STR you would not be attacking.
Three examples spring to mind: fighting with two weapons, using most of the Master Thrower's weapon tricks, using a crossbow.
Several of these examples are counterintuitive (you cannot smite with a ranged weapon, for example) but I'm looking for a general ruling on such things, rather than a piecemeal one.
while it may be true that they may be used if you are denied your str bonus, they do have restrictions of their own.
smite (from phb 44): "... a paladin may attempt to smite evil with one normal melee attack."
this reads to me like it has significant restrictions, such as no whirlwind attack smites. and, no after trip with imp. trip smite attacks. two places where str still applies.
insightful strike (from complete warrior 12): "She applies her Intelligence bonus (if any) as a bonus on damage rolls (in addition to any Strength bonus she may have) with any light weapon, as well as any other weapon that can be used with Weapon Finesse, such as a rapier, whip, or spiked chain. Targets immune to sneak attacks or critical hits are immune..."
this continues with other restrictions to the insightful strike. again, in general, all places where str still applies.
i suppose it is all in how you visualize the rules. but it seems to me each form of bonus damage has individual rules to its effect in combat.
tog
There are several classes and prestige classes that allow you bonus damage based on an Ability modifier (CHA for Smite, INT for Precise Strike, etc.) I have never seen any language under any of these bonuses that indicate that you would not get the bonus if you are denied your STR bonus.
The rules-lawyer in me wants to say that all damage modified by Attributes are handled the same way, but it just seems to not fit in my head. Anyone have any thoughts on the subject?
There is no link between your strength bonus and the special ability linked to another characteristic, you can smite with a off hand attack for exemple.