Three of my players wish to start two new organizations in Cauldron. The 4th level rogue wants to start a thieves guild and eventually take on The Last Laugh for control of Cauldrons underworld activities. He plans on taking leadership at 6th level. I also have a paladin and a cleric of heironeous (both 4th level) who really want to start a temple to their god. The cleric also plans on taking leadership at 6th level to help accomplish this. My question is does anyone out there know how much it should cost these players to start up their respective organizations? They both need to find suitable buildings to accomadate their needs. Has anyone had their players start up their own guilds/temples in their SC campaign?
Thundergawd
The paladin in my campaign (also of Heironeous) wanted to start a church as well. First there was the matter of getting real estate. IMC, real estate is rented by the city to the owners. Thus, anytime real estate comes up it is auctioned off by the city to the highest bidder. The only real available piece of land was the ruined church of pelor. Knowing this, the paladin began soliciting donations and saving his money. After soliciting donations from the townspeople, including merhcants (paladin had great diplomacy rolls), as well as borrowing a lot of money from his fellow party members, he had enough money.
Around Flood Season (during the festival) I had the auction for the ruined church of Pelor. Lord Vanderboren and some other nobles bid on the property. A bidding war ensued and the vacant lot was purchased for around 12,000 gp. Then came the matter of building the building back up. The paladin travelled to Redgorge to hire stonemasons and paid them ~5,000 over the course of building it. Construction began at the end of flood season and was completed right before Secrets of the Soul Pillars. During this time, construction materials became scarce because of all the destruction that had befallen the city and the paladin pumped another 5,000 grand or so in materials.
The paladin also took leadership, which attracted a cleric of Heironeous from Sasserine. He became the high priest and since the paladin was spending all of his time adventuring, the priest ran the church. Over the course of the campaign, the cleric crafted some minor wands and potions, but these were paid for by more funds from the paladin.
So all told, it cost about 25,000 to build and buy the temple (located near the Chuch of St. Cuthbert). This doesn't include all of the items crafted by the church.
It has been pretty advantageous for the party. Not only does it make the PC feel like a real paladin (donating all his money for the glory of his god), but the church has helped his leadership score and coupled with his great acts, has attracted many followers. In the post-Foundations Cauldron, the Church of Heironeous will play a mighty role.
Hmmm....sounds like some good role-playing potential there. Chp. 6 of the Complete Adventure talks about organizations, but not really how to set one up. It would seem to me that an organization might not even need a regular building at first--just some like-minded individuals who are willing to band together.
The core of these organizations would probably be the cohorts if your characters were willing to take the Leadership feat at 6th level. Particularly for the Thieves' Guild, secrecy and not having a regular location might be an advantage in the beginning, until they feel they're strong enough to take on the Last Laugh and survive.
Just as a rough guideline, my players in the SCAP rented an entire floor of a residential flat for 500gp/year--but its a huge floor with numerous bedrooms, a fireplace, a bath, good security features, etc.
I have some homebrewed guidelines from my old 1st edition campaign regarding the payment of mercenaries, hirelings, constructing building costs, maintenance, etc. that I prefer to the stuff in 3.5 If you want it, e-mail me at farewell2kings (at) gmail (dot) com and I'd be glad to share it. It's not revolutionary stuff, just some guidelines for me, but I've got them in Word file and I have adopted them for 3.5, so you might find something useful therein.
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The paladin in my campaign (also of Heironeous) wanted to start a church as well. First there was the matter of getting real estate. IMC, real estate is rented by the city to the owners. Thus, anytime real estate comes up it is auctioned off by the city to the highest bidder. The only real available piece of land was the ruined church of pelor. Knowing this, the paladin began soliciting donations and saving his money. After soliciting donations from the townspeople, including merhcants (paladin had great diplomacy rolls), as well as borrowing a lot of money from his fellow party members, he had enough money.
Were there any objections(non violent of course)from the clergy of Pelor? I had some trouble along that line.
Around Flood Season (during the festival) I had the auction for the ruined church of Pelor. Lord Vanderboren and some other nobles bid on the property. A bidding war ensued and the vacant lot was purchased for around 12,000 gp. Then came the matter of building the building back up. The paladin travelled to Redgorge to hire stonemasons and paid them ~5,000 over the course of building it. Construction began at the end of flood season and was completed right before Secrets of the Soul Pillars. During this time, construction materials became scarce because of all the destruction that had befallen the city and the paladin pumped another 5,000 grand or so in materials.
The paladin also took leadership, which attracted a cleric of Heironeous from Sasserine. He became the high priest and since the paladin was spending all of his time adventuring, the priest ran the church. Over the course of the campaign, the cleric crafted some minor wands and potions, but these were paid for by more funds from the paladin.
So all told, it cost about 25,000 to build and buy the temple (located near the Chuch of St. Cuthbert). This doesn't include all of the items crafted by the church.
It has been pretty advantageous for the party. Not only does it make the PC feel like a real paladin (donating all his money for the glory of his god), but the church has helped his leadership score and coupled with his great acts, has...
actually the church of pelor had moved into another (similar looking white circular) building over by the church of Wee Jas...so it wasn't really an issue. The church of Wee Jas wasn't too pleased about the appearnece of a new church, and Kord was indifferent/condescending. But Cuthbert and Pelor were glad to see one of there fold in Cauldron.
Thanks everyone! These are some great ideas I'm hearing here. Already the wheels in my head are beggining to turn. If anyone else has any ideas/experiences to share feel free to add em in!
Thundergawd
I think your group is going to have a lot of fun. My players would just make my day if they initiated something like that, but they're content to act like wandering exterminators, at least for now.
Well, I definately would want to allow them to follow the course they would like to do. This sort of thing is what great RP is made of. I would also talk to them and explain that Leadership would get them very loyal henchmen, but that may not be necessary for starting a church (would be more so for a thieves guild).
All that said, I don't have any experience setting these things up and would be interested to see what you guys do and what others have done.
Sean Mahoney
Traps & Treachery, by Fantasy Flight Games, includes a PrC for a Guild Master. I used it in my last SCAP campaign, but I modified the alignment requirements to "Any non-good". If you're interested, you can by the PDF at DriveThruRPG.com for $4.99.
The PrC includes a progression that helps the Guild Master run a guild and be part of society as well. The rogue in my campaign used her cohort as the face of the guild, and absolutely none of her followers ever met her face-to-face. She had a hat of disguise, so anytime she needed to go to the guild, she looked different.
As for the guild, she started a smuggling business, paid her protection money to the Last Laugh, and made sure she never actually stepped into their territory. He cohort was an aquatic dwarf, and they smuggled items through the water ways in the Crater Lake.
She had purchased a building on the lake, one with a pier. Her cover business was a sight-seeing boat ride, where people could pay to go out over the lake, and enter a submersible glass cage, part of the salvage boat that she had.
After the party cleared the Kopru ruins, she actually made a deal with the Kopru. She used her resources to seal the cavern and flood the ruins, returning the area to the Kopru. In return the kopru allowed them to use the area as a storage area for her smuggling business. Her aquatic workers each wore a ring of farie fire, so as to be easily recognized for the kopru. (The party mage eventually noticed the ring, and couldn't for the life of him imagine why someone would want to use something like that.)
All of her work, in the under world and through her business contacts, helped her to get enough support to become the first Lady Mayor at the end of the campaign.