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Mike Silva wrote:
Shut up and take my money!

As soon as i read it i thought the exact same thing!


Generally (there are plenty of exceptions no but hurt shhh) these forums are a monstrous waste of time. do what i do ignore them if you see a heading that looks interesting check it out then leave when it turns to suck.


now try asking me that again with a 6 charisma (nothing wrong with car like that mythic hero however seems uncommon)


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Well my thought was mythic characters should be at least OK all around. i mean even Hercules wasn't an idiot he wasn't terribly personable but i wouldn't say he had penalties. pretty well all the Greek heroes were good all around maybe not PHENOMINAL all around but not morons or completely socially lacking.

so now why am I going to reward dump stats? Why again does your mythic hero have a 6 charisma? doesn't seem terribly mythic. really i think the mythic stat bonuses should be to lower stats make the character better all around instead of bumping str form a 22 to a 24 etc.

I don't think you can get rid of sad and mad without reworking the system frankly. i suspose you could get rid of them being based on stats.


I have an ideal for mythic how about you use the lowest stat instead of the highest. fewer point (maybe give more from other non stat stuff) but then it would cut back on min maxin a bit too.


I posted this on another thread but my idea was to break out a bigger die D30 from 21-30 d40 etc... granted they are hard to come by but supply and demand and what have you


guess i should post this idea here instead of their ha!

Heres a thought assuming mythic levels are a way to go above level 20 cap and just grant abilitys and hp how about the option to allow mythic levels to allow one to gain class abilitys for characters such as multiclass characters. say i am a 1st level monk 19th level paladin and for some reason i really want the cap stone on pally i think it would be nifty if i could take a mythic level and pick that up.


Heres a thought assuming mythic levels are a way to go above level 20 cap and just grant abilitys and hp how about the option to allow mythic levels to allow one to gain class abilitys for characters such as multiclass characters. say i am a 1st level monk 19th level paladin and for some reason i really want the cap stone on pally i think it would be nifty if i could take a mythic level and pick that up.


^banned for compareing ninjas and pirates... o wait wrong thread agian darn it!


sounds like its cursed to me so cheap


joey tribbiani how you doin?


i wanna know why he' nekkid


^banned for not winning.... o wait wrong thread


sweet ill be ordering the first 2 soon then :D


if i wanted to get the full collection of the pathfinder psionic books what would that include?


Jal Dorak wrote:
vidmaster wrote:

(has not read anything blindly posting)

well i think that the tacticians would win in lower levels because their characters would be more optimized mostly but i think at later levels the role players would win because of all the accumulated role playing exp hence they would be higher level.

Oh. I thought this thread was about who would win in a no-hold-barred cage match. ;)

Playing that out, the optimizers would probably train really hard with a professional trainer in a good gym, perfecting one specific style of aggressive combat.

The roleplayers would spend their time talking to the media about how good they feel, how their story is unique and that their going to win this for their fellow gamers and their sick loved one(s).

The bell rings. The roleplayer bows his head for a moment of prayer or reflection (depending on belief system). The optimizer would come out flying, solid blow after blow overwhelming the roleplayers paltry defenses and out-of-shape body. The roleplayer would muster a reserve of inner strength, rising from his knees, blood dripping. Just as the fight looks like it is going to turn around, the referee declares this is a Texas Chainsaw Tag-Team Match...against 42 genetically-engineered Trolls!

The ref rings his hands in glee as the slaughter begins, and starts prepping his next campaign...I mean, match.

This is Vidmaster and i approve of this message


(has not read anything blindly posting)

well i think that the tacticians would win in lower levels because their characters would be more optimized mostly but i think at later levels the role players would win because of all the accumulated role playing exp hence they would be higher level.


am i the only one that thought of darkness cast on himself.... keeps all light out. although hell look like a big inky blob of black walking around


i have to say deadman your actually stretching what he said with that last comment past what he said. you defined the court as just and fair. i have to agree with jupistar. the fact that you are taking a subjective stance alone is consequentalist. deontology doesn't care about your individual perspective. its whats absolutely right.

breaking people out of jail is wrong because if everyone broke people out of jail it would be chaos. whether or not you felt it was right.
you undermine the system. a system you agreed to. now if you didn't agree to follow the system because its unjust or evil so be it your not breaking your own laws. but if you live and abide by this places laws and even uphold them then you agreed to follow then and that they are right and just.

what if it was your own life you know your innocent but your proven guilty should you break yourself out from a deontologist point of view?
lawful is lawful.


see i think it all varies to much for the individual. we all see the world differently. as would paladins. their human to i think we would all play oen slightly diffrent and we might all make morale chooses form our standpoint.

think of superman comics superman almost always does the perfect thing
the whole situation of would you throw one person in front of a train to save many? superman would say nope ill save them all.

realistically we can't do this we just have to rely on our experiences and teaching to decide on our choice.

now if your agureing that breaking a law isn't lawful well thats silly. but is he inclined to do it make him forever chaoitc no but that one action might have been.

dm will just have to decide if what the paladin did was wrong or better if the paladin thinks he did wrong.


sounds very supermanish finarin panjoro. its still a chaotic act

my paladin would first argue in court provided that didn't work request a stay of execution to get more time try to declare a miss trial try to find out who is framing the guy. talk to someone higher up request help from whoever i could. and if all that wasn't enough i would call the dm a dick and move on.

but really heres the diffrence between a lawful person and lawful absolute.
people make mistakes alignment just bring them home at the end of the day. a paladin may do something outside his alignment we all make mistakes. i as a dm would not penalize them for makeing a chaotic action as a mistake in order to do something that is good. unless they take it to far.

theres a diffrence between a human's alignment and say an angels alignment an angel IS lawful good everything they do is lawful good they cannot do anything that isn't lawful good. therefore the angel could not break the man out of prison if it was a legitimate respected authority. a man could cause he can deviate from his alignment a bit. all men are diffrent even all paladins can have slightly diffrent philosophys. but the lawful good thing to do is what the absolute would do. (and im sure theirs paladins out there that value the lawful more the the good just as ones that value good over law)


lets hit this with some Socrates
Socrates was a morale philosopher he was tried (some would say unfairly) but even though he had potential for escape he gladly drunk the hemlock and died proudly. even tanked the poisoner for doing such a good job.

Socrates said that even if the court wasn't fair he choose to live in Athens he choose to live by their rules he could of moved but did not and he choose to go through their court system in order to make the morale choose he must accept the result of the jury.


who's law's are we talking about anyways? medevil laws? fantasy laws? or are we talking about nowadays american laws? what if its a kingdom the kings word is law.
a better scenario might be what if you are a paladin and a evil king takes over by succession.
In medevil times i think trials went more like so
http://youtu.be/zrzMhU_4m-g.


as long as they have all the class features to be replaced i think that is how it works


i think dex for ac damage and hit is a bit to much int to damage makes since and is a good balanceing tool. plus smart figthers yay


ok heres another ideal to make the base monk scarier if those two feats wouldn't fix a few problems in and of themselves.

Allow the ki point spent for an extra action to give another standard so you could ideally use the standard as a move then use whats left as a full attack kind of like pounce but you couldn't do it as often (limited by ki points)


Deadmanwalking wrote:
vidmaster wrote:

you know actually alot of the paladin code questions relate back to 2 philosophical theorists with opposed views. its between kant and john Stuart mill.

kant says that your ethical behavior should be outside of the rest of the world circumstances don't matter. so never lie no matter what for example. so breaking the law to save a man would violate your ethics therefore would not be a morale act.

I disagree. If circumstances matter nothing at all, then you should save him, because saving an innocent is the right thing to do. Whether that's what society approves of or not. Right is right. Or at least that's an equally valid Kantian argument.

Kant's philosophy doesn't actually say one way or the other on this one. It just says that the consequences and practical problems don't matter, it's purely a question of what you'd do without said consequences. So if your personal code says 'always obey the law' then that's what you should do, and if your personal code says 'always defend the innocent' that's what you should do.

If your personal code contains both? Then you're in trouble, and need to decide which principle is more important.

ok i agree kant doesn't say one way or another what another but he does give you a way to decide if it is correct or not by asking yourself if everyone in the world subscribed to this action would it be a better world. so if everyone saved the innocent it would be a better world however if you look at it like if everyone helped people escape from execiton then its a bit rougher. the only thing i am trying to say here it more often then not these morale situations depend on the person making them. you can't judge someone else action morale or not except by your own standards but not necessarily theirs.

but really im going to have to agree with snorter

edit: ooo i missed jupitars post i like his best and put what i was thinking much better then i did.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

you know actually alot of the paladin code questions relate back to 2 philosophical theorists with opposed views. its between kant and john Stuart mill.
kant says that your ethical behavior should be outside of the rest of the world circumstances don't matter. so never lie no matter what for example. so breaking the law to save a man would violate your ethics therefore would not be a morale act. while mill would say you should save the innocent man if you have to lie cheat and steal to do it.
im in a rush ill go into more detail later


i would suggest keeping one domain. domains are what give the cleric flavor imo. maybe loss one domain both domains do seem a high cost even with spellstrike.


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come on now whip it
whip it good


you guys are funny


i think even the greeks didn't appreciated sophists... and they started it


if you memorize it in your first level spell slot then its your first level spell... at least thats how i would see it.


No i got the worst paladin EVER. He disarmed a 9 year old with a dagger and proceeded to kill the young gang of kids (they were theifs but like ages 9-13) he even asked me if he could use power attack my response: sure why not.
not only did i strip him of his paladin hood i moved his alignment a tick towards evil.


yeah i house rule the heck out of that feast


that calebtgordan fella is a smart one listen to him its solid advice


i would say use a class-less system and marginal advancement (that ive seen on other forums) where you just increase 1 thing at a time like a bab here a hit die here skills there. start at 10 across the board and let people buy them up as they do things give exp for certain things that they do etc. alot of dm work it would seem


i wouldn't mind other input and edits from others about if they think the D30 idea would work

frankly i still don't see what people mean by the game breaks down at higher levels. i've ran two campaigns in 3.5 that ran into epic and still managed to keep them working and we all had a good time. (ran up to 30th)

Hmm and would we feel its apropriate for non casters to start doing the impossible at epic levels (something akin to the juggernaught in epic) unstoppable (can even knock down walls of force) and immovable even a teleport won't make him budge.


yeah die rolls can make some pretty crazy characters but it doesn't make the game un-dm-able you just have to adjust the encounters to make em a bit tougher.


star metal (to be renamed)

this remarkably tough and remarkably light armor is exceedingly rare and hard to forge.

(functions as if it was as light as mythril and as hard as adamantine.)
high cost +10 to dc to forge it

dark matter (think adamantine x5) but exceedingly heavy so only very strong characters could use and maybe a feat. (dense heavy armor prof)


i think your right leave the target numbers the same

as far as making you worse i think it might work if you still consider the rolls the same against non mythic creatures so a 25 on a d20 would not be a crit to a mythic creaute but would to a non (kind of in respect to the old epic rule of auto killing weak minions.)


i don't think i need fluff yet but it could be something like as you become mythic your fate (luck w/e) broadens.

i haven't decided if its necesary to improve the base ac modifiers yet from 10+ everything to 15+ everything as bonuses should naturally increase without that help and it would end up setting it back instead.

i still worry about the whole saving throw bab thing one of the ideas i liked was the bab starts to improve the secondary attacks instead of the main one. my thought was maybe the whole +1 every 2 for everyone and then full bab classes would also increase their secondary attacks more until they caught up to their main and mid bab would have a slower version and ofcourse low bab would not.


mythic template

preq: unsure as of yet something in nature of bab +21 spellcaster lvl 21+ or skill rank + 21

You are not considered mythic you now use the d30 rules


This is my idea for epic level rules after hearing some of the complaints.

The big problem i've heard about epic is the system starts to fall apart i think the problem is when characters start getting +20 to rolls the d20 roll itself matters less.

so my idea is at mythic level (21-30) instead of a d20 you start using a d30

mythic monsters would use d30's as would mythic characters they would threaten crit on 30 instead of 20 19-20 would become 29-30 etc. now generally the downside here would be criting far less and failing far less (the failing far less often is a good thing for mythic) however with feats like improved crit and maybe a mythic improved crit they would still work them self back out say a bow would be 30 then impr 29-30 them mythic 27-30.

skill check would remain the same difficulty and higher ones could be imagined.

it may not be necesary but certain saves ac etc could have the fomula bumped up from 10 to 15

and for level above 30 so 31+ you would use a d40 and bump up the numbers agian.

to deal with spell casters one idea ive posted before was having every 2 caster levels increase the save for their spells by 1 i wouldn't make higher spell slots past 10 i would just allow meta-magiced up spell slots.

The advantage would be that now mythic characters chances of failing on menial tasks has gone down. there is now a greater variance on rolls so you can still keep that sweet spot feeling of hitting missing on the middle.

I would like feed back on this idea so please post away ill post some more ideas how to round out this method later


byc is also crazy as his post contributed nothing


clearly you put to much power attack into your response...


hmm guided hand is kind of very specific though with a cleric levels. id rather have my version and let them keep dex to hit and drop the wisdom to hit feat.


awesome love the combat manager so cool so useful


will beastiery 3 be added to it soon?


I was thinking over the monk and the deulists and the complaints that they do not do enough damage. but adding dex to str would be suposidly over powered as would wis to hit and damge would amke the monk and deulist a one stat class. so how about these feats to that should make since thematically and work mechanically (sorry for the non formal write up)

Insightful Strike.
type general (figther bonus combat)
requirements int 13 bab +1
You may replace str with int when adding damage on a melee finesse weapon. This damage is ignored by creatues immune to crits and sneak attacks. (i think this has been done before but ive not seen it in feat form just class ability form)

Zen Strike
General combat
Req wis 13 bab +1
same as above except wisdom but may add imp unarmed as a preq instead of bab +1

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