plumber790's page

Hey all! Just got the AP for free on Roll 20 and I plan on running the AP next week. One of my players would like to play a race with a 30ft fly speed, my question to the group is, are there any encounters in Book 1 that are broken by having a Fly Speed?

So the Staff the caster has is a Fireball Staff, with empower, maximize and intensify built into it. Sounds f!%#ing rediculous, is this actually possible??

I've run this campaign to completion, and while my group wasn't as OP as yours, they still smacked the last big bad in 2 rounds (I GM cheated by having him with a contingency of heal and teleport so the big bad lasted a few more rounds).

If I were to run this differently, I would have had the winds surrounding the spire play more against the party. Maybe reducing their flight movement to 1/2 (or negate completely) and negate any missile ranged attacks (the bad guys aren't affected by this because the winds are supernaturally created by e-v-i-l). You could also, if I remember correctly, the winds contained evil spirits that would attack any flyers moving into them, so have those spirits partake in the fight. Further, I remember a dragon-type encounter just before the last big bad. Have them encountered together.

Just a few ideas. Hope it helps. :)

I actually really like the idea of the Dragon Harassing them earlier as planned, but leaving sooner to recharge her soul thing, and returning to help her master atop the tower for the final fight.

Hmm. Important question: How many mythic tiers do your PCs have (and how many will they have by the time they face AA?)

I ask as the general rule for monsters is that their CR is equal to their normal CR + half their mythic tier, and the same philosophy works on players fairly well. E.g. A 15th level character with 6 mythic tiers is expected to perform somewhat like an 18th level character.

Sort of.

Generally the mythic rules don't raise attack rolls, saves or spell penetration overly much, so flat out using higher CR published creatures (and correspondingly higher SR/AC/DCs) can get frustrating for the players (well, if they haven't optimized their characters out the whazoo), but given the mixture of surges and mythic abilities the PCs will mulch things that are considered 'appropriate' for their level alone.

** spoiler omitted **

Given the above... I'd suggest that everything in the last book needs to be buffed up a minimum of (half their tier)...

They only have 1 mythic tier from me buffing the Headless Horseman fight at the beginning of the 5th book. I gave him the agile template for funsies. They had a hard time with that one finally.

This is the gear list i've managed to recover from my players, still waiting on the others to fill it out.

Not sure how much help it will be but here is my rebuild of the final boss.

BBEG

Of course I built him specifically to challenge the characters in my game and the most difficult to deal with for me was a mim/maxed Aasimar Archer Paladin of Abadar.

Hope it helps.

Your breakdown of the fight is amazing, thank you so much for posting a link! I'll absolutely have to practice this fight so I don't slip up and forget something.

My wife (who is GMing Carrion Crown and knows the encounter) suggested a few things... which I'll elaborate in far more detail than she feels is necessary or warranted <_<

1) Pay attention to the weather conditions (p47). Anyone trying to circumvent walking up the tower and suffering the traps and effects along the way is going to need to make some nasty Fly checks to avoid falling out of the sky.

2) Per the Development section (p57), if the PCs are walking up, he will harass them with things like grease, hydraulic push, telekinesis etc

3) On the same page, the mirage arcane effect of the delusionary aura makes it appear that you that you're fighting in an open field... when you're still up on thee 50ft platform. Only reaching the edge of the platform causes the PCs to be able to make a Will save to disbelieve. Noting that AA can also use spells to punt them off and then "trap" the stairs up to fight the remainder/flying at his leisure.

4) If AA doesn't look beefy enough, and your players are somehow able to figure out a means of resting safely for 8 hours (which should be nigh impossible), feel free to have either the nightwalker general here... or even better, Marrowgarth be fought here along side AA. Because what is more epic than fighting a lich riding a dracolich... sorry... "Ravener" <_<

She also comments that while AA theoretically is a CR17 encounter, he really doesn't have enough HP or damage. In fact... let me slap something in spoilers...

** spoiler omitted **...

Tell your wife thank you for me! This is extremely helpful!

Ah. One of those.

If the party are geared up to the eyeballs and significantly over their WBL expectations(which are based on market value, not what it cost the PCs), then they will punch way over their level... And that's not touching the topic of questionable rules interpretations or "forgetting" to track resources at times (I've seen both).

The Inevitable approach would be to ask for their character sheets, determine their actual wealth and then go halfway between the level that lies on the WBL chart and their actual level. I.e. If they're 13th level with the wealth of 15th level characters, treat them as level 14. But that doesn't actually factor in degrees of optimization of character and gear, nor whether everything they have and are using is actually 100% kosher.

So my recommendation here is.... Don't bother nerfing the PCs. Buff the encounters until they feel climatic and like a fitting finale. By your description of the encounters to date, I'd recommend the Mighty template for AA, and a liberal application of extra hit dice and/or the advanced and giant templates for the minions along the way. And possibly more minions.

You, as the GM, are the arbiter and master of what the PCs face. If the published stats don't work for your table - change them.

I ran an campaign with a policy of "Bring anything", and at 12th level had the PCs enter a superdungeon where I literally threw away the MM (it was 3.5), as my 4 PCs were averaging 500+ damage per round. I created wow style bosses with escalating hit points as the PCs rose from 12th to 16th level by the end, with the final "boss" having 10,000 hp... But that was okay as the PCs were averaging 1000-1500hp a round by that point.

Things can get wonky at high levels.

Its a classic case of "give a mouse a cookie" instead they took my whole f*+~in arm off. Its honestly my fault for not looking into the specifics of what they were up to, but again, 10 levels ago i didn't think that this much abuse was going to happen...

Im gonna take your advice (especially since i'm a huge fan of the WoW boss fight) and buff the main villain to make him feel like an actual boss, and using the suggestion from the actual book, add in the minions it suggested with buffed templates as well.

Eat the encounter and call it a lesson learned. This is a group of characters that have abused the rules. Can't take back the broken gear they appear to have made themselves. Now you know to audit character sheets religiously, you are not the first GM that has been railroaded into one players skewed interpretation of the rules. If you are looking for an argument with the crafter, pull out a Staff of Fire from the book and ask how it is possible to do the damage he calls. Metamagics can't be added to spells cast by the staff and no way a GM would allow a custom metamagic enhanced staff to be made.

These are the type of players that are not looking for a challenging encounter, they are looking to destroy any and all encounters and laugh while they are doing it. These characters are not designed to celebrate a great roll or even a good strategy, they are all about the great "rule twist" they came up with.

The big complaint is the caster, but even the Archer is doing way too much for a lvl 10. Rapid Shot/Bab/Multi Shot..4 arrows at an average of 41 per arrow just means abuse. Not sure how a Fighter get +35 damage per arrow. Not saying they are cheating, but they are abusing and fudging rules. Again, too late for the campaign, but at least its only 1 game session left. Enjoy this one and maybe next game be a bit less lenient.

The archer I feel is easier to deal with, since all they can do is use the bow. One wind wall or any creature that can get into melee with them shuts her down, in fact she almost died twice to Mimics earlier because of this flaw. They managed to literally one shot a Glabrezu demon in one full attack.

I will have to get a gear list and update the thread so you guys can give further advice.

None of those would work with a staff though.

Sounds to me like your crafter might be abusing custom magic item rules without running them by you first. Check their items, make sure they have a source for each one

He is indeed abusing Custom Item rules and not telling me, these are true facts. In fact he has been making items, and casting buffs without telling me. I had to have him physically write them all down last session, cause he pulled a (BUT I ALREADY CAST IT!!)

Add more minions. Casters at high levels should always have permananced see invisibility. Casters at high levels may have been scrying you and can prepare for certain tactics. Does the cleric/wizard caster fly? Because pits work again freedom of movement. Dispel magic and chains of light. Lots of great combinations. Don't just try to target your players, unless an enemy has reasons too, but that doesn't mean that any boss isn't prepared and clever (and you should give him synergistic minions to up the action economy and make him stronger).

Yes our caster can cast fly, and likes to do so when too many minions are out and about/the terrain gets too messy. Chains of light won't work, the last boss is a Lich. Also, I tried to dispel her Freedom of movement during the last boss fight with the Witch Sisters and was told that it would dispel the protection from evil first? and that I couldn't pick which spell I wanted to counter?

I am notoriously bad at playing the enemy spell casters that make up the enemies of every boss fight in this adventure path, and id like to finally challenge my players with the final boss. That being said, my players are geared to the teeth (their Mystic Theurge has crafted out her ass to make all sorts of s&$~).

The party consists of

Cleric/Wizard crafter, who has at least resist 30 everything, everyday buffs herself with freedom of movement, protection from evil, arcane sight. Plus she has a staff or something that sends out fireballs that do upwards of 167 dmg in a single hit (this has annihilated the witch fights in the previous book)

Monk with over 40 AC when fighting Defensively. He can also teleport with abundant step, which makes it extremely frustrating when the boss teleports away to heal and he follows and then grabs them.

a halfling rogue with a Invisibility ring, ninja head band, some head piece that protects him from mind affecting effects and compulsion effects, and a corset to help him out of escape artist. He can also hide from basically everything, scent, life sense you name it he can get around it. He can also see invisibility. If he jumps a boss and gets his full round of sneak attacks he can do almost as much dmg as the clerics fireball, and nuke their stats, movement, to hit, and AC.

Fighter Archer who with no special gear only feats manages to also do 167dmg on a full round where every arrow fired hits.

And lastly a Kineticist who SUPRISEEE!! Can pump out an ass load of dmg.

they are all lvl 13 right now. I have never run this fight, and I really need help before we start the next book on nerfing the s**! out of my party so that they are nice and soft for the final boss fight. I'm tired of them walking all over every encounter.

Darnit, I was so excited when I saw the art for it!

Is there any way to make the Psychic from the cover? (ie) a character that can telepathically manipulate weapons? i'm reading through the PDF and I don't see anything like that, unless I missed it.