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Take the leadership feat? Your cha is not that bad. Acquire a ranger cohort and some useful followers. Start a cult around you perhaps. Or get a cleric heal/buff/bot to fill the role the others want you to fill.


I went archer bard and am pretty happy. Take a look at treantmonks bard handbook for melee and archer builds.


jupistar wrote:
Mikaze wrote:
The difference between goblins and roaches being that goblins are sapient beings. Capable of choosing their own destiny.

I'll grant sentience. I'll even grant rudimentary reasoning. Show me sapience. Show me moralism. Show me a tribe or a family or any group of moralizing goblins or goblins with a conscience.

Mikaze wrote:
Sorry "shackled" is too loaded for your tastes. Guess "bound" is out too. "Restricted". Is my language vetted enough yet?

Getting there. Thanks.

Mikaze wrote:
All the bombs really do is discourage people from reading the entirety of your posts. They obfuscate more than clarify.

I grant the first and reject the second. I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. If I don't preclude your objections, then I spend a great deal of time tying off tangents, keeping subject matter on topic, and repeating the same points over and over again. If do, then you don't read it.

What's your suggestion on how to prevent the objections that distract and confuse the argument?

Mikaze wrote:

:\ You're the one getting bothered by other people's "rationalizations", "excuses", "poor reasoning", and "emotional language" where it concerns there preferences in the game. This has occured in numerous threads thus far, and I'm far from the only one you've spoken down to.

Chill.

Right. So I shouldn't worry if my discussions include rationalizations and excuses and poor reasoning. If I try to prevent it, I'm "taking it personal". You just love to attack, don't you? How about you chill?

Mikaze wrote:
Evidently it does, if you feel the need to rail on against looks up "rationalizations", "excuses", "poor reasoning", and "emotional language" in what are honest statements about how one views the game.
Nope. You have a hard time assessing evidence, it seems.

In the kingmaker game we let a tribe of lizardfolk live after we killed their chief. They had kidnapped a boy from our town and the chief was torturing him but it seemed that many of tribe were not for the act. We spared the village since they seemed repentant and did not interfere with our efforts to take the boy.

Is it possible to slay the adults of a ce tribe but keep the kids and try and make them lawful? Is the act evil? Probably not though it might prove a futile task.


I would play my pally like Captain America, an leader trying to show others how to act by his actions not his words. He is a soldier though and keeping any prisoner alive while on a mission could cause problems for the quest/mission. If the prisoner could hacker usefully info that might change things. If the prsioner was an honorable sort then that also is a different matter.

In any case out of combat I do not think detect evil is a liscense to kill. You need to have proof of an evil act before you attack. A pally in Cheliax is not going to kill the mayor's devil bodyguard if no evil deed is going on. Does he do something if he sees the devil torturing someone? Maybe. If throwing himself in to stop the devil ruins the mission/quest then he might have to hold off. Paladins (imo) should be played as soldiers of good and realize the mission should take priority over all else.


drawesome1111 wrote:
Have any of you actually played bard or is this theoretical?

I am currently playing a human (Ulfen) Bard (5th level) for the Kingmaker Path. I followed the archer bard that Treanmonk mentioned. It is pretty fun. I am the "know it all" of the group for one, and am ok in a fight. My buffs are great and even though grease may not be soo great at higher levels I still grease my allies while they are grappeled which is very useful. I find it better than the rogue, not with damage but with thew swiss army knife skill guy.


Evil can do deeds that might be percieved as such but they probably will not "acquire" a good alignment all of a sudden right? THen why should the good guys.

Just because this Diabloist was LE and never broke a deal before who is to say this won't be the one time he decides to do it. Besides they probably know by now not to trust a guy who makes deals with devils, I am sure he could be tricky enough to say one thing and mean another.

On the other hand if the Royal Mage cared for his nephew so much he should have done the job himself. That was part of the story you should have changed.


I am doing a ranged bard off of Treantmonks guide. I am currently 4th level and my cha is only 14 but dex is 18, str 14 and int is 12. I am a human from the Linnorm Kingdoms.

I don't worry about the low cha with my spells. I did not want to be 100% reliant on spells to bail us out so I chose things like grease and silent image, invisibility and glitterdust. If the opponent makes the save on some ofthose spells they some have a secondary feature which still makes them useful. Silent Image is probably the best low level spell. Make sure you take message and dancing lights for 0 level spells.

The archery aspect just makes sense. Since I am human and at 4th level I have point blank shot, precise shot, and rapid shot. My damage is not that bad with a composite (+2) shortbow. I will take a one level dip into fighter for the one feat bonus and the ability to use a longbow. Plus my con is blegh so I never get into melee range and usually make it out of combat in one piece.

Skills are just the icing on my awesomeness cake. Plan ahead for the versatile performance. I did not take diplomacy at first level but now due to the Oratory skill I am tricked out with that skill.

I will take Leadership soon due to the benefits it will have for our campaign (Kingmaker), but deadly aim and other fun archery feats are in my future. I know my guy will never be on par with some damage dealers but all I want is to hold my own and not have to cast all my spells during every combat.


sanwah68 wrote:
It was in the original Campaign Setting, which was a 3.5ed book and has been updated with the Inner Sea World Guide, which does not have that option :)

Cool. I just wanted t omake sure I was not crazy.


Cheapy wrote:

Crusader!

Or...Being a Paladin!

I could have sworn there was some feature that dropped your domains but allowed you to get a BAB like a fighter, d10 hps and/or get martial weapons added to your list.


Is/Was there an archetype or feature that let clerics give up their domains so they could acquire better melee features? I remember seeing something like this before but I cannot find it now.


I am playing a bard Skuld with Ulfen ancestry. What would an Ulfen surname sound like?