I am contemplating moving Adventure Paths to a second sheet to keep them distinct from single adventures.
Another alternative would be to simply change the sorting. Right now it looks like you're sorting by min level + name. If you change that to min level + max level + name, the single-shot level 1 adventures will float to the top, and the adventure paths would mostly be a in a single block underneath them.
It also looks like you're using level 1/level 1 for "unknown levels", which could be confusing. I'd rather see something more obvious, like level "0" or level "-1" to mean "unknown."
Just some thoughts. I do think this is a fantastic resource, and for any publishers who might be hesitant (not that I can imagine why you would be, but JIC): I just found out about Zeitgeist here, and I imagine there's a chunk of change coming EN World's way due to this list. So adventure publishers, you really want to be listed here.
For the mystery of flame (yeah, I know it's supposed to be "flame mystery," but I just think the other way around sounds better), the Fire Breath revelatoin states:
Final Playtest wrote:
The save DC is Charisma-based.
Well, I'm pretty sure I could have worked that out on my own ... isn't what I really need to calculate the DC an equivalent spell level for the ability? or am I missing something obvious?
The first thing to note is that this is one of those options that I feel would be best utilized by an NPC, but I do want it to be feasible for PCs as well. As such, the lack of combat focus is really irrelevant for my purposes: a PC looking to be effective in combat would naturally stay away from this focus, while a player looking for something different--something with a non-combat bent just to be interesting--might be attracted to it (as I see some folks here indicated). That said, I would be glad to see any suggestions people have for making it (slightly) more combat viable.
Secondly, I'm really surprised to see anyone complain about the Remote Viewing revelation. It's exactly the same as a Cleric with the Knowledge domain ... well, except that the Cleric would get to do it a level earlier than the Oracle. I would respectfully suggest that if you have a problem with that one, you should complain to the Paizo folks, not me. :-)
For the Truthteller revelation, I don't really see being able to do it at will being a problem. If it's too powerful as is, I think the proper solution is to make it take a full-round action (or even longer) rather than trying to limit the number of times per day.
Now, True Seeing at will may have been overreaching on my part, I'll grant you. Perhaps that one needs to be toned down to 2 or 3 times per day (plus 1 at 15th & 20th).
Also, I don't think I clarified that even things that are at-will are not supposed to be something you "turn on" in the morning and walk around with all day (a la the Warlock). I should note that the duration on all those abilities is "concentration."
Mystic Knowledge and Lore Master definitely need to be combined. Which would leave me an open slot for one more ability (possibly something combat-oriented ... I had hoped to find something in Mongoose's Divination book, but I came up blank; if anyone has any other ideas of places to look, please let me know).
Finally, to the point that these abilities can bypass many adventuring problems: well, sure ... that was sort of the point. :-) An Oracle with this focus can't do much else; they need to be useful for something. Personally, when I GM, I don't plan out how my players are supposed to get past the trap or the puzzle or the maze or whatever it is: that inevitably leads to frustration on my part, because the players always figure out a way around it no matter what I do, and, besides it doesn't seem realistic. Theoretically, the person who designed the trap/puzzle/map didn't specifically put in a loophole just so my players could get through it. As long as the party gets past the obstacle, I could care less how. Having a character use their abilities (which they chose and "paid for" via their character development) to short-circuit a puzzle or spot an illusion doesn't seem any different to me than when the Rogue uses her trapfinding to disarm the trap, or when the Bard uses his bardic knowledge to find an instantaneous answer, or when the Ranger or Druid uses wild empathy to make friends with the giant beast you had planned a whole combat around, or whatever.
But I thank everyone again for the feedback, both positive and negative.
Here's a new focus I've been working on. I'd love to hear any feedback.
Focus of Secrets
Base Info:
Deities: Calistria, Irori, Nethys, Norgorber.
Class Skills: An Oracle with the Focus of Secrets adds Linguistics, Knowledge [Arcana], Perception, and Use Magic Device to her list of skills.
Bonus Spells:detect secret doors (3rd), see invisibility (5th), nondetection (7th), detect scrying (9th), commune with nature (11th), legend lore (13th), greater arcane sight (15th), discern location (17th), foresight (19th)
Revelations:
Revelations: An Oracle with the Focus of Secrets can choose from any of the following revelations.
Arcane Sight (Su): You can use arcane sight (as per the spell) at will. You must be at least 3rd level to choose this revelation.
Combat Prescience (Sp): As a swift action, you can use true strike (as per the spell) on your next melee attack. You can use this ability once per day, plus one additional time per day at 5th level and for every five levels thereafter. Starting at 15th level, you can replace one use of this ability each day with applying the effect of moment of prescience to your next roll. The roll can be anything that the spell would normally apply to; however, Combat Prescience cannot be applied to your AC as moment of prescience can, because using this ability is a swift action and must be used on your turn.
Mystic Knowledge (Su): You add half your class level (minimum 1) to all Knowledge skill checks, and may make all Knowledge skill checks untrained.
Lore Master (Su): As a standard action, you may take 20 on any Knowledge skill check, even if you are untrained in that skill. You can use this ability once per day, plus one additional time per day at 5th level and for every five levels thereafter.
Orisons of Knowledge (Sp): Add detect magic, guidance, and know direction to your list of orisons. These do not count against your total Spells Known.
Remote Viewing (Sp): You can use clairvoyance/clairaudience at will as a spell-like ability using your Oracle level as the caster level. You can use this ability for a number of rounds per day equal to your Oracle level. These rounds do
not need to be consecutive. You must be at least 7th level to choose this revelation.
Scrying (Sp): You can cast scrying exactly as the spell, except that your focus is contrained to being a portable
object in your possession (for example, an ordinary mirror, a crystal ball, a piece of crystal, or pair of spectacles). You can use this ability once per day, plus one additional time per day at 10th level and for every five levels thereafter. At 13th level, you can cast greater scrying instead. You must be at least 7th level to choose this revelation.
Status (Sp): You can cast status at will.
True Seeing (Su): You can use true seeing (as per the spell) at will. You must be at least 11th level to choose this revelation.
Truthteller (Su): As a standard action, you may cast discern lies with no components. The only outward sign that you
are casting a spell is a barely noticeable glow in your eyes; a Spellcraft check at DC 28 is required for a stranger to detect that you are using this ability, although your traveling companions will quickly learn to recognize it. You can use this ability once per day, plus one additional time per day at 10th level and for every five levels thereafter. You must be at least 7th level to choose this revelation.
Legal Stuff:
The above information is released under the Open Gaming License, and I specifically relinquish all rights to commercial publishing. If the Paizo design team were to want to incorporate my ideas into their products, I would be honored. :-)
Designer's Notes:
The revelations include a fair number of at-will abilities, but let's face it: this focus is fairly wimpy. I felt the at-will aspect was necessary to help balance it out.
Mystic Knowledge and Lore Master are cribbed from the Bard's class features. I wonder if they are too weak to stand on their own and should be combined ... Lore Master kicking in at 5th exactly as it does for Bards.
I like Orisons of Knowledge, but I fear that it loses usefulness at higher levels. Perhaps the addition of orisons should be staggered across class levels? The downside of that is that you might not be able to get the orisons you need until you after you no longer really need them. Maybe allow them to be cast as swift actions at a suitably high level?
Remote Viewing is cribbed from the Cleric's Knowledge domain. It's a bit similar to Scrying, but I felt they were different enough to make it an interesting choice, just as a 7th level Bard might choose between clairaudience/clairvoyance and scrying for his 3rd level spell. Certainly it's doubtful that any Oracle would ever choose both of these, but I didn't feel that invalidated either as a choice.
I have observed complaints from the online community about the class being weak, especially at lower levels; most of their suggestion go into reworking the spell system to provide for more spells a day or a different spell list. I feel that such changes might be unnecessary if the oracle simply gained more revelations over the course of his level progression. Or perhaps make several minor revelations that can be used more often, or are always active. I personally do not see any need to change the spells known or the spells per day of the oracle.
I agree with this entirely. I commented on another thread that I thought a possible solution was to allow Oracles to choose two foci, similar to how Clerics can choose two domains. Although I can understand that some might feel that it splits the single-mindedness of the class, I feel that it adds some much needed flexibility. Obviously this is not feasible with the current limited number of foci, but as more and more are added, I think this will become more and more viable.
Gaining more revelations could work as well, but that means significantly expanding the number of revelations per focus, which in turn makes it harder to add new foci. I think I'd rather see a wide varity of different foci than a few foci with longer lists of revelations. Also, having two foci doubles the number of focus spells, which in turn partially addresses many people's concerns about the number of spells known.
I do like the idea of some smaller revelations that are either at-will or always on.
I know it's different but I see no reason why the "Battle Oracle" couldn't have 3/4 Bab as part of his "package".
Well, as presented, my idea is that the standard Oracle does have 3/4 BAB. As an option, you could choose the "Studious Oracle" or somesuch (actually, following the UA model, they wouldn't even have alternate names, but personally I like having them be distinguishable from the standard class names in some way) and get the 1/2 BAB + other stuff.
Maybe my attempt to shoehorn the Bardic Knowledge feature here is ill-conceived. Probably I should make that a revelation in the Secrets Focus that I'm working on and add something else here. Something to help keep them alive ... extra HP is so banal though ... ooh, how about giving them the damage reduction of a Barbarian? The only bad part is that it doesn't kick in until higher levels ...
Your ideas work for an oracle that represents something relatively inoffensive, such as an Oracle of Knowledge. But why would an oracle with a focus such as Strength (assuming that becomes a focus) be exceptionally knowledgable? Also, you just cut the BAB and HD of the oracle. How will an oracle with the Battle focus function?
Oh, you're definitely right that not all foci would work with this. But that's why I wanted it be something optional rather than a new take on the class.
Lathiira wrote:
Your version of the oracle (I note you took pieces of the cloistered cleric, always fun) might do well when a Knowledge focus becomes available. I'd playtest it up into higher levels; I'm still playing a cloistered cleric now converted to Pathfinder and I'd like to hear what differences come up.
Yes, a knowledge-type focus was exactly the sort of thing I was thinking of. I'm working on a Secrets Focus myself right now.
Beckett wrote:
I'd suggest that you just wait and see what the full class is like. It is very possible that version of the oracle will do something along those lines, (like the Ballte Oracle can get armor).
Well, I doubt that the full version of Oracle will include different BAB progressions, as that hasn't ever occurred before in any product from a major gaming company, at least that I'm aware of. But if the APG will include alternate classes such as UA did, then perhaps.
Sean FitzSimon wrote:
From a power-gamers standpoint, I don't see medium BAB and a loss of a hit die to be worth bardic knowledge and 3 good saves.
That's just me personally, though. Giving them some extra oomph would help, since they're much more fragile now.
Okay, that's what I feared. Perhaps I need to up their hit points somehow ... my original conception (i.e. before Pathfinder) had them at d8's, but I don't want to break the BAB-HD tying thing that PF has going on now. But I'll ponder something along those lines.
I've read through most of the thread, though admittedly not all of it.
AFA the debate about Cha vs Wis, I say, who cares? It seems a pretty trivial difference to me, and something easily houseruled the other way if you don't like the way it ends up. Personally, I prefer Wis, but if the class ends up with Cha, that won't bother me a whit.
But to return to the original point of the thread, many people were saying that the class felt a bit underpowered; that seems like a bigger issue that's more difficult to houserule around. (As it happens, I also agree with this criticism.) The suggested fixes have primarily been around giving more spells known, which is certainly one way to do it.
Alternatively, what about being able to pick two foci? Not sure entirely how it would work, but I'm pondering something like this:
At first level, choose one focus, which is your primary focus.
At second level, choose another focus, which is your secondary focus.
Whenever you receive focus spells, you get spells from both foci.
Choose a revelation from your primary focus at 1st, 3rd, and every 4th level beyond that (exactly as it is now).
Choose a revelation from your secondary focus at 2nd, 4th, and every 4th level beyond that (except 20th).
Final revelation is from your primary focus.
In this way, it's similar to Clerics getting two domains, except you don't get them both at first level, which I think is necessary to discourage single-dipping. It adds more spells known, which is good, and gives the class more flexibility.
The only real downside I see is that while some of the foci go together pretty well (e.g. Battle and Stone), others don't go together at all (e.g. Flame and Waves). That would be less of a problem once we have more foci, and you could always houserule that certain combinations are taboo.
This is strictly off the top of my head and almost certainly needs more thought (would you get to use class skills from both foci, or only from your primary focus? maybe you have to choose both foci at 1st level, but the secondary one doesn't really do anything until 2nd?), but I think it has possibilities.
I'd say base it on the spell level of the spell in question in their Cleric/Druid/Wizard/Sorc level. If it's in multiple spell lists, closest to Cleric is the direct port.
Well, that's certainly one way to do it, but it's a bit complicated. I'm pretty sure that my interpretation (that it's one spell of each level) is what the designers were intending, but I'd love to get confirmation from them on that.
I'm sure that the idea is that the first focus spell is a first level spell for the Oracle, the second focus spell is a second level spell, and so forth (just like Cleric domains), but I can't find anywhere in the class description that actually states that explicitly. Is that a mistake, or am I missing something?
First, let me say that I'm super-excited to see the Oracle class. I started to design a class several years ago to fill this niche but never got it quite where I wanted it. The Favored Soul had some of what I wanted, but too much of what I didn't. Then the Oracle comes along, and it's got just about everything--even the flavor text is almost exactly what I had in mind for my class (which I was going to call the Hermit).
The only downside for me is I don't like the Cleric BAB progression ... in my campaign, I never thought of this class as melee-oriented at all. I thought of them as mostly being good for NPCs, filling the role of mysterious stranger living alone in the woods as a source of mystic knowledge, but maybe also an interesting choice for a PC, if the player in question was experienced and looking for a challenge. The class would mainly be a source of utility spells, buffs, and knowledge ... perhaps a bit of healing, but mainly a non-combatant.
So the Oracle for me is very close, especially with the flexibility afforded by foci (although I do agree with another thread that "focus" is really not the right word to use here). But I would like to do a bit of tweaking. Now, I certainly wouldn't want to force my vision of the class on anyone, but I do want to be able to adapt the class for my purposes. So what I was pondering is a set of alternative class features, similar to what's proposed in the Unearthed Arcana (the more recent one, which is, I believe, primarily composed of open gaming content). ISTR reading that the APB would (might?) include something along those lines for the other classes, so I'd like to propose one for the Oracle. What do folks think of this?
Lose: Cleric BAB, d8 hit dice, shield proficiency.
Gain: Wizard BAB, d6 hit dice, good Fortitude save, good Reflex save, Oracular Knowledge (works exactly like Bardic Knowledge).
Does this seem balanced? It takes the Oracle firmly out of the melee camp, returns to the "all good saves" idea of being protected by the gods (like the Favored Soul), and tosses in some mysterious divine knowledge, which fits with the class name. I'm going to try this out as an NPC and see how it goes, but I wondered if others had any thoughts as well.
