Syralus's page

meabolex wrote:

Unless I'm missing something, this ability is completely broken in PF. In 3.5, you simply couldn't overrun via a charge, so this was a non-issue. Some brokenness about this ability:

1. Charge states that you must move to the closest space from which you can attack an enemy.

2. If you overrun an enemy, you move through the enemy's space.

3. To move through an enemy space, you need to be adjacent to an enemy in order to enter their square.

4. That adjacent square is closer to the square where you began your charge than the enemy's space square.

5. You can't move beyond the adjacent square because charge said you must move to that adjacent square (the closest space from which you can attack the enemy).

So, either charge is wrong (unlikely, copied pretty much verbatim from 3.5) or overrun is wrong (likely, because it's a PF specific change from 3.5). You can't follow both rules without violating one of them. Also, there's no mention of applying a +2 bonus to CMB checks for overrun. There is one for bull rush.

Just sounds broken |:

Edit: read some of the above links, apparently it is broken and they're going to errata it at some point. That sucks.

Oh, I see what you mean now. I assumed that by "target" they meant whoever was at the endpoint of your charge, but I see now that there's a contradiction in the movement wording. Yeah, they should fix that.

I read this pretty clear.

Charge Through allows you make an Overrun as a free action as you charge. Charge.... Overrun.... Charge. Pretty simple.

If you read both feats, you receive a +2 bonus on checks made to overrun a foe. This +2 adds into your CMB to beat your targets CMD per....

Performing a Combat Maneuver: (Second Paragraph)
When you attempt to perform a combat maneuver, make an attack roll and add your CMB in place of your normal attack bonus. Add any bonuses you currently have on attack rolls due to spells, feats, and other effects. These bonuses must be applicable to the weapon or attack used to perform the maneuver. The DC of this maneuver is your target's Combat Maneuver Defense. Combat maneuvers are attack rolls, so you must roll for concealment and take any other penalties that would normally apply to an attack roll.

So it goes as follows...

1. Declare your charge target (X will be the example target)
2. Declare your going to make an Overrun attempt vs a creature between you and your target (T will be used in the example)
3. Roll your Overrun, adding your +2 bonus for CMB
4. A. If you succeed, you continue your charge through to the original target.
B. If you fail, your stopped dead in your tracks on the initiating side of the charge.

YOU ...... T....... X (Step 1)
YOU T ...... X (Step 2 and 3)
T...... YOU X (Step 4A)
YOU T ...... X (Step 4B)

It's still a Charge, meaning you treat it as a normal Charge BUT you make an Overrun action for free as your conducting the Charge.

The only thing I find that isn't clear concerns the Attack of Opportunity if you beat the Overrun targets CMD by 5, thus causing them to be knocked down. Nothing I have read is clear about who gets that AoO. Is it an AoO for the rest of your party or is it an AoO for you right then and there?