"Aye!" Sven said, already moving. "And if they find us as they flee, then it'll be evidence that this wasn't just the result of their own shoddy workmanship."
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Sven shook his head. "At most something which helps with digging. But this is so shoddily made..." He looked over the mine as if though it were a personal insult. "We'll be doing the world a favor collapsing this."
"Right. We just need to get to the mine shafts. The question is, do we split up to do this?" Looking thoughtfully, he said "I think that the best bet is to move together. Weaken the supports so that they will collapse, but not immediately. That should maximize the damage done and give us time to leave before the crashing brings all the giants running."
Without any clear or present danger, Sven took a moment to look over the mine working with a critical eye. Specifically, he stared at the wooden support beams that were visible from the entrance. Turning to the others, he gave voice to what he was thinking. He was considering whether they could collapse the mines by taking out the support beams. Doing so would cause quite a commotion, to be sure, so they'd need to time it so that they could collapse as many as possible and then flee. Doing so would certainly interrupt the giants' operations, as they'd have to dig the mines out anew. And if they were left wondering why the mines collapsed? That would cause all the more chaos.
”Aye!” Sven said, relishing the idea of returning to his roots. ”Let’s see what shoddy hole in the ground they call a mine.”
”Its science, aye? Let’s experiment with the spells. See what works and go from there.”
"Far enough away from us that they can't immediately try to eat us." Sven suggested. Despite their newly gifted powers from the divine, he was not eager to engage in a fight without purpose.
"Aye, that it will." Sven agreed, as he listened to his comrades discuss what to do next. "Try to use dimension door." Sven said, as he thought it through. "Having them vanish without breaking the ice would cause no end to confusion amongst the giants, which will delay their return. The goal, after all, is to disrupt their operations as much as possible. If it fails, then aye, breaking a few spines will do the trick. We'll just need to move quickly to get away from them before they either attack us or bring the entire army down on us."
The treasure was quickly gathered, but of it all, it was the breastplate that Sven took the most notice of. ”What did they do to ya?” He whispered, running his fingers along the dents that covered the battered mithril armor. ”Strong enchantments here. Not as much defense what ye got there Hawthone. But Kurlag? This might well suit ye. Offers much more protection that those chain links ye’ve got on.” The armor?: reastplate of Vanishing
DESCRIPTION This battered +1 mithral breastplate bears a resemblance to a stylized turtle shell. On command, its wearer can vanish inside the armor, leaving the breastplate behind while she stays safely hidden in an extradimensional space. This space is barely large enough for the wearer to sit comfortably, but does provides breathable air and light to see by. The wearer cannot perceive the environs around the armor while inside. A second command word returns the wearer to the armor’s location, wearing the armor. If the wearer can’t return to the space the armor is in, she is instead shunted to the nearest empty space that can contain her, but no longer wearing the armor. If the breastplate is destroyed, the wearer immediately returns to the square the armor was in when it was destroyed. Successfully dispelling the armor likewise returns the wearer, though in this case still wearing the armor.
”Right. That does it. We free the beasties, and get the fook out of here. Kurag and Hawthone, ye two get to work on that. I’ll break what is needed to break so they lack the tools needed.” He said this with finality, lest the group lose the momentum they had gained.
Agreed, thank you for sharing. I love getting such context
”Felt it too?” Sven asked. He stood up straighter than before, his movements devoid of the aches and pains which had previously dominated his life. ”Torag.” He said, his voice filling the name with reverence. ”The Gods are watching us. We have defiled the most hallowed grounds of Minderhal, and have subverted their most treasured artifact to not be sanctified in the name of the Forge Father.” He looked around as he spoke, the cleric turned oracle eying the forge with a learned eye. ”And our creator has blessed us. He has invested power within us to see this work through. Minderhal and Torag are at war. And we must prove ourselves worthy of the gifts bestowed upon us.”
It was with a feeling of awe that Sven swung Agrimmosh. The Hammer of Unmaking was a tool of the forge, and in his hands it had already been dangerous. But before the Forgefather’s blessing, it had been dangerous only because of the power of the hammer. Sven had lacked the strength to truly wield it effectively. It had been enough, of course, to obliterate the average human. But against giants? His strength of arms was lacking. But now? Now with the full force of his youth returned, the hammer hit with sickening force. He was actively able to exploit openings and to swing with the power needed to make even their titanic foes feel fear. Even the little aches and pains that had come with age were gone. Turning to the last standing giant, the enlarged dwarf swung hard, knocking her back a step. He was about to go for a follow up attack, something that would have moments ago been beyond him, when the giant stepped forward and struck him back. To his amazement, which it hurt, it was far less than it would have been. Religious fervor filled him. While he looked no different than before bad prior, and while he was certain that it was not actual youth that was given to him, the mere fact that so much had been restored was humbling. Unable to help himself he shouted out ”Torag be praised!”
@GM. I have misfortune. It has to be used as a forced reroll before the outcome of the die roll is known. No saving throw allowed force a reroll. Can be used only one per person per day. For enemies attacking it should be used when a crit range attack is rolled (ie: 20 usually, 19 with some items, etc) For allies? Please remember you have 1 reroll per day. Use it well.
There was a brief moment when Sven realized that he was outclassed. For all that had been given to him, it was not enough. And the worst part was that he knew that it was him. It was because age had taken from him what he had taken for granted. In the height of his youth he wouldn’t have had his body reacting too. Damn. Slow. He was going to die and he knew it. So he prayed. Sven devoutly prayed to Torag, swearing an oath to his deity, that if he could but have the strength of arms that he once had, that he would use it in his God’s name. To Hit: +10/+5 (BaB) + 4 (Str) + 2 (Enchantment) + 1 (Weapon Focus) +2 (Weapon Training) -0/3 (Power Attack) = +19/+11 (+2 hit giants)
It took him by surprise when the Forge Father listened. Like a withered tree suddenly blooming, his hammer, at once both desecrated and sanctified, lashed out, faster than he had managed in many a decade. Whether it was because he was worthy of the boon, or because he was found wanting in strength for a mission too important to fail, he did not know. But either way, he was thankful.
Love the choice. Studied target, favored enemy and sneak attack? That’s deadly. Look forward to seeing your full build.
GM: you were kind enough to let me take Spell Finesse (Choose one of the following ability scores – Wisdom. All you spellcasting calculations are now based on this ability, including maximum level of spell you can cast, spell save DCs, and bonus spells per day. If you have spellcasting abilities from multiple sources, you can change all of them to this same attribute. Once this feat is taken and your new spellcasting attribute is selected, it cannot be changed.) Could this apply to mystery abilities too? I just want to take this: Channel (Su): You can channel positive energy like a cleric, using your oracle level as your effective cleric level when determining the amount of damage healed (or caused to undead) and the DC. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 1 + your Charisma modifier. I’ll drop this for it: Safe Curing (Su): Whenever you cast a spell that cures the target of hit point damage, you do not provoke attacks of opportunity for spellcasting. I’m not taking selective channel. No open feats for it. It’s purely for out of combat healing. I just like the idea that Sven used to be a cleric and thus this ability would still be present. If not, no big deal. But it doesn’t hurt to ask. :)
Right! Thanks. I knew something felt wrong. Much obliged. :)
Brother Hawthorne looks great. Loving that our AC and DPR is just about the same, but comes from very different sources. Perfect front line. :) And a good choice for Kurag. Ranger (plus) rogue with Druid feels natural. Also, what are our rules on HP calculations for this campaign? 10 (lvl 1) + 54 (lvls 2-9) +10 (FCB) + 10 (Toughness) + 30 (Con 16) = 114 I have it at that but somehow I recall this campaign calculating it differently…
I’ll make the updates. If things are too weak or too strong can modify. At the moment though I ran it through deepseek (chatgbt not available in China…) AI review: Your Fighter (10) / Oracle (10) Gestalt character is well-balanced for a Giantslayer campaign—strong enough to be effective without overshadowing the party or abusing the GM's trust. Here’s a breakdown of strengths and areas to consider: Strengths (Why It’s Good) Giant-Killing Focus
Feat Adjustments
This is a strong but fair character for a 3-player Gestalt game. You’re:
The GM won’t feel cheated, and you won’t be weak. If anything, your party will rely on you to handle giants—which is exactly what a Giantslayer hero should do! Final Rating: ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (5/5, thematic and effective).
You get both, separately. I personally try to avoid it because of the complexity of two casting pools, but you get both. It can be very powerful. A wizard / cleric would get full casting from both. Their only issue would be action economy. Likewise a Ranger / Druid would have spell slots and the like from Ranger and separate ones from Druid. Do I get all abilities from both classes? Do I get to pick either 1 as favored class for level ups? Does spell failure for armor still apply? Full abilities both! Usually FCB from one side. I’ve seen some GMs do both but I think the default is one.Spell failure still applies.
That would explain the luxurious beard! Yeah I will transform but it will take me a few days to figure out what I am going to do. Have a lot of options and have no clue really what direction to go. I look forward to seeing what direction you go. Honestly. Making builds is a lot of fun, and as you say there are so many options here. :) And as it seems like we will be making the changes mid fight, I’ll go ahead and update the main profile. Just checking before…GM am I good to go on that front?
Which will be awesome. It’s really rare to see people take advantage of the Dwarven FCB. For archetypes…maybe mouser? It would be a very thematic “anti giant style” of fighting. Otherwise straight swashbuckler fits quite well. Arrow champion is for switch hitting. Trades some melee abilities so that the rest work with bow and heavy pick. It seems designed to shoot first then close in to melee. At lvl 10, you’d get +13 damage with a heavy pick, and +2 damage with your bow from the class. But if you shoot someone first you can swap the damage on one hit with a feint. If you attack with your pick next round then your first hit does +26 damage instead of +13. Paizo makes this work by giving fast and easy weapon swapping. It’s an interesting archetype. I’ve never seen either in practice but both could work. Straight swashbuckler is also great.
Out of curiosity, as a swashbuckler what weapon and archetypes are you considering?
I could…but that is a feat and a mystery for just 1 use of channel. Sadly it’s not a good investment. Luckily, he has plenty of great healing without it.
For what it’s worth I used an old alias to map out the new profile with gestalt. Was a lot of fun. Tried to keep him as similar as possible to the current Sven. Only adding a buckler to equipment and not touching anything else. Keeping stats, skills, and feats as untouched as I could. Definitely much, much better in close combat. While there were a lot of flavorful and fun mysteries, decided to keep life to heal the party as best as possible (was very tempted to go metal. Thematically it works, and it goes very well with vital strike). Just wish that channel was actually useable (Cha8 means that it gets 0 uses per day). Tagged on dual cursed Oracle, because I know from experience that small parties *need* emergency rerolls. My other gestalt character nearly died from a single poor roll, and dual cursed Oracle solves that problem.
I’m not sure if we will win this if we don’t. Maybe? It’ll be touch and go. I’d personally vote for making the changes immediately. What do you guys think? Kurag…if you are alright some ideas for gestalt: Trapper Ranger / Inquisitor (Chivalry Inquisition)
Trapper Ranger / Hunter
Ranger / Scout Unchained Rogue
Speaking of which…I just realized now that I have the reclusive curse. Completely forgot that I need to roll saves against your buff spells…
*sigh* My apologies to you and your bard. It seems like the haste wouldn’t affect Sven. It’s a rough curse! Great benefits but ouch that stings.
Sven should be pretty easy to add fighter to. Battle mystery changes to life (Channel, Enhanced Cures, Safe Curing or Combat Healer). This ensures that he can heal the party easily enough. Fighter gives 6 feats (power attack, furious focus, weapon focus, shield focus, weapon specialization, Unhindering shield…or something like that). It also gives bravery, weapon training ( focused weapon) and advanced armor training (Armor Specialization) Reflex still remains dangerously low, but there’s only so much that can be done. Should be easy enough to make the changes whenever appropriate. All he’d need to do is find (or make) a buckler and he’d be set.
Swashbuckler would be great, especially as there are archetypes that trade out most cha parts. And thematically it would make us all distinct. Plus we need a front line. I’d likely go fighter for Sven. Also front line with Hawthorne, only heavy armor + hard hitting with his hammer. Something simple. Would trade battle mystery for life, just because our party really needs some healing and we wouldn’t have a cleric, while the fighter would make the mystery redundant. And that would leave Kurag as an archer/scout. Adding whatever second class he wants.
I feel bad being the one pushing for this if 2/4 of us don’t have experience with it. If everyone is game for it, of course I am, as it’s worked in other campaigns I’m in. But whatever our choice I’m happy just to continue.
Gestalt means 2x classes at once. When there is overlap you pick the best. Example: Gestalt Fighter Rogue. Lvl 1.
Generally used when you don’t have a full party. Not as strong as a full group due to action economy, but when done well it covers all the bases. For example, I’m in a 2 man gestalt group for mummy’s mask. Used to be a 5 man party, dropped to 2, so we did gestalt instead of recruiting more (did recruitments in the past for people who dropped out and decided against doing it again). It’s been working out quite well, with the 2 of us covering all party roles between us. It’s certainly a different experience.
I’d lean heavily into archer. Either fighter, slayer,…or at this level a silksworn occultist (full BaB, +6 enchantment bonus to strength, spells and powers, cha based). The last one could be a lot of fun, given that it is bard themed. But any would be good for both accuracy and damage.
With 3 of us posting, what’s the call? Another recruitment feels…well, it would slow things down. We could push forward with us 3. Perhaps go gestalt if 3 isn’t enough to get by?
Weathering the hail of blows with the skill that only came from centuries of Dwarven knowledge passed down from father to son, and years of personal experience, Sven stood tall in the face of the Giant’s rage. Hammer in hand he abandoned his usual precision. Inspired by Brother Hawthorne, he laid down blow after blow as if though he was once again the young beardling of his youth.
Perhaps bluffing would have been the wiser move. A thought which occurred to Sven as his hammer crunched into the door frame, an accident born from his massive size being magical in natural. Someone who had grown up that large would have not made such a mistake.
With a mighty *crack* Sven’s hammer impacted with the Giant’s head. He wasn’t naive enough to think that it would be enough to fell it, but it certainly created an opening for his kinsmen to act.
Sven walked over to try the door, to see if it was locked. It would easiest to just walk inside.
Breaking the door down would be far too loud. And picking the lock would be impossible if it was barred. With no other plan in mind, Sven walked over. His prayers had left him far larger than any dwarf, or even human, had a right to be. He knocked on the door at a height which was almost giant in reach. The knock was loud and clear. Satisfied, he waited to see if any within would come to answer the door. And once or was open…they could kill the giant and then walk inside!
Got the skills for both sides ”The mines sound like a great trap! If we can stage it to look like it is our base of operations, we can lure the giants in and then collapse it. Given some time and I could rig it.” He smiled as he said this. ”But let’s hit the smithy first. It robs the giants of another vital resource, and we might make use of it. That, and I am very interested in seeing how their methods work.”
”Sounds fair. Especially including Lucky in the deal.” Sven said. It was worth accepting whether he felt the wolf was sincere or not, as it at least opened up the potential for peace. But he wanted to know how much they had to watch their backs.
Sven glanced at Brother Hawthorne, for the dwarf had a silver tongue.
”We are both.” The old dwarf said. ”As my kinsman will explain, we are here seeking mutual benefit.”
Sven took a deep breath and nodded. He prayed to the Forge Father, so that he might be ready should the wolves turn hostile. Only then did he walk in, hoping that the precaution wouldn’t be needed.
"Right. We pull back. I say we go to the Winter Wolf Warrens. The Giants are all out in force, and if we hit anything else while they are on such alert we could face the entire camp. But none of them will have their eyes towards the wolves. Even their scouts will be rushing back because of this." Sven reasoned. He could see the argument that now was a time to use the confusion to set fire to another important building, but the old dwarf felt that the risk was too great.
Sven went to the entrance, ready to throw it open. "Right, let's do this. Throw it open, cause them to panic, and then we need to get the fook out of here. Everyone ready?"
We ready to move on?
"Aye." Sven said. "It would be good to hit them there next. Keep them guessing as towards what the targets will be, and it would maximize how much effort they'll be spending to get back up to speed." Not for the first time, he hoped that the dragon would remember that they were allies once the giants were defeated.
Sven shook his head. ”I’d love to. But every giant would run over due to the fire and they be faster than us. Seems like it would lead to a fight we aren’t ready for.” |