Samuli's page

Congrats, Mark! I'll echo everything David Neilson said. Especially when you killed me.

Have you got a link to that other thread?

I can't find anything solid. It looks like improved familiars only get animal class skills? That is, some of their skills become worse when they become familiars (Nosois lose Profession (Scribe) class skill, for example).

Is this really how it's supposed to work? It seems counter-intuitive, and after asking around, this is not the way most people play their improved familiars.

Skills: For each skill in which either the master or the familiar has ranks, use either the normal skill ranks for an animal of that type or the master's skill ranks, whichever is better. In either case, the familiar uses its own ability modifiers. Regardless of a familiar's total skill modifiers, some skills may remain beyond the familiar's ability to use. Familiars treat Acrobatics, Climb, Fly, Perception, Stealth, and Swim as class skills.

Except that Nosois aren't animals. I think this issue was handled in some other thread for Faerie Dragons. Where they agreed that Riddywipple gets Dragon class skills.

Similarly, other improved familiars should get class skills based on their type.

My wizard finally got his improved familiar, a Nosoi. Being an outsider he gets the outsider class skills, instead of the animal class skills for normal familiars. Unfortunately, "due to their varied nature, outsiders also receive 4 additional class skills determined by the creature's theme".

Reverse engineering from Nosoi's skill bonuses, three of those class skills are Fly, Knowledge (History), and Profession (Scribe). Can I choose the fourth one? Or is there a better way to do this than reverse engineering from the bestiary entry?

I hope this helps. ;)

Yeah the more you talk about something on this board, the more often you see it somewhere....

So, next time you don´t want to see something, don´t tell anyone^^

^ Wise words for the original poster.

Oh, but this is exactly what I was going for. Soon the powers to be have to ban the trait, or the Society is going to be ran over by Chaldira worshippers! *muahaha*

For a iquisitor archer: str bow+ weapon bonus + deadly aim + bracer + pointblank + judgment + bane + destruction domain + (spell buffs like named bullet and others)...do the math : )

Activating judgment is a swift action, and it's only available a few times a day. The same goes for bane, and you need to identify the monster in question. The domain power is available only at level 8, it lasts for a few rounds only, and activating it is a standard action.

So, you're wasting at least one round setting the inquisitor up, and more if you cast any spells. The fighter - who has access to all the other goodies, and more - has already started dishing out damage, and can keep on doing that all day long.

At +2 Str, +2 bow, you've got +2 str +2 bow +4 weapon training +2 weapon spec for 1d8+10, which is why I was asking.

+2 Str, +2 bow, +2 weapon training, +2 gloves of dueling, +2 weapon spec, +2 arcane strike. Yep, he's an Aasimar.

Aasimars are pretty handy for darkvision, and being immune to dominate person, too. And Plumekiths get +2 Wis (in addition to +2 Dex), which is practically +1 to Will saves.

Greater/Weapon Focus, Gloves of Dueling.

Ditto. Also, Str is only 14, and the bow is +2.

In terms of best archer it is really a trade off

Defensively Zen Archers are best
Offensively Zen Archers are best until 11th level, except under certain circumstances (namely smite, and rangers against favored foes), when everyone gets improved precise shot.

That's interesting. I've been playing my fighter archer with rangers, paladins, inquisitors, and even clerics wielding bows. My fighter was always the most consistent damage dealer - even on low levels. Granted, I haven't played with the Zen Archer yet.

For comparison, at level 8 his attack routine is +21/+21/+16 (d8+12/x3). Manyshot and Point Blank Shot bump that up a bit. Also, he doesn't have Deadly Aim yet - that's going to make a difference.

Thanks for all the replies. Especially, the Pure Legionnaire was a nice idea. I'll have to do some research. I'll be back, if I find something that wasn't already mentioned in the thread.

I was thinking about creating a PFS character from the Kingdom of Man - just because the First Rule alone is so awesome.

I heard there are PFS legal prestige classes for Rahadoumi characters, but I couldn't find them. Any idea where to look from? Or, which source books would have more information about Rahadoum. Also, do you have any other mechanical ideas for a character following the First Rule? Clearly, clerics and paladins are out of the picture.

Oh, I'll just remove the scenario from the list. It's not like we would run out of them. I was thinking undeads or the Shadow Lodge story arc to level the characters before going to Rahadoum - my favorite place in Golarion after Taldor.

I'm just curious, are you running them as PFS, or just running the scenarios for a homebrew campaign.

I'm keeping it strictly PFS, in hopes of getting more players to the Boston Lodge. And I get to root my own ideas of PFS into their minds when they're still untouched by the community *devilish grin*.

...Unless I'm forgetting something, The Goblinblood Dead doesn't actually have goblins in it.

Oops, really? I've played it, and thought there were goblins. Anyway, that's easy to fix.

But there is Murder on the Silken Caravan.

Oh, I played that on season 0, as my second PFS game ever. I didn't remember the goblins. Thanks! Btw, with a lvl1 3.5 character it was brutal :)

I'm starting to run PFS games for a home group, starting from level 1. I already ran We Be Goblins! for them. The goblins were a hit, and that got me thinking if I should continue the theme. What scenarios are out there that feature goblins?

So far I know of We Be Goblins Too!, Goblinblood Dead, and Frostfur Captives, and Rise of the Goblin Guild. Also, part 1 of Rise of the Runelords has lots of goblins. Are there others?

Grappling

It's REALLY complicated, is like none of the other attack actions or subsystems, and is either totally useless (most cases) or extremely broken (when optimized to the extreme). Also, monsters with multiple attacks and grab special ability got the short end of the stick.

That's cool.

Thanks for the suggestion. The boon from #4-25 The Secrets Stones Keep is the reason why I want something more specific.

I know.

There are boons in #4-16 The Fabric of Reality and #4-25 The Secrets Stones Keep that I'd like to combine. It's somewhat unclear if what I'm planning will work.

The boon from #4-25 is not relevant for my question, so I'll leave it out. The boon from #4-16, and the question are inside separate spoiler tags. Let's try to keep the thread as spoiler free as possible.

Boon from #4-16

And the question

So, going back to the OP, only the Improved Familiars listed in the FAQ can use UMD, and only to activate wands.

Gotcha. Thanks. I hadn't seen the new FAQ thread you linked.

If you're referring to [url=http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2nv0h?Improved-familiar#1]this

thread, I didn't see a Paizo official answering any quoestion about wands or UMD. To me it looks like speculation that having hands would somehow trump the sentence about not being able to activate magic items.

Or, is there some other thread I've missed?

Once again. I know this has been asked before, but I noticed that the FAQ has been changed regarding familiars.

It is intended that animal companions or familiars can not activate magic items.

Meaning that no familiars benefit from UMD anymore? Really?

There is a notion of improved familiars with hands later in the FAQ, but it refers to the magic item slots available for the named familiars. The list is awfully similar to the old list of familiars who were able to use UMD. Is that still the intent? Can the following familiars benefit from UMD?

The brownie, faerie dragon, imp, lyrakien azata, mephit, quasit, sprite familiars, granted by the Improved Familiar feat, use the Biped (hands) section of the chart.

So, I assume this is how it's intended to work.

Let's take a 4th level Musetouched Aasimar Bard, with Pageant of the Peacock masterpiece, and Perform (Act) selected for Versatile Performance. Her abilities are 10 10 10 7 10 20, and for skills she has selected max ranks for Craft (Calligraphy), Disguise, Perform (Act), and Profession (Diva). She has Circlet of Persuasion, Magnifying Glass, and a cracked Pink and Green Sphere Ioun Stone for Bluff. Her feats are Deceitful and Skill Focus (Perform (Act)).

Her Perform (Act) is 4 (ranks) +3 (class skill) +5 (Charisma) +3 (Skill Focus, unnamed) +2 (Aasimar, racial) +3 (Circlet of Persuasion, competence), for a total of +20.

Her Bluff is, due to Versatile Performance, the same as her Perform (Act); that is, +20. The Ioun Stone doesn't stack because it's competence bonus, the same as the Circlet. And it's up to the GM if the feat bonus from Deceitful would stack. JJ said he might stack it, but I think it's safe to assume it doesn't stack.

When using Pageant of the Peacock, her Bluff score gets a +4 circumstance bonus, and is upped to +24.

When using Pageant of the Peacock, she can make an Appraise check using her Bluff score. Any Perform (Act) tools don't help, but the Magnifying Glass grants a +2 circumstance bonus on Appraise checks involving any item that is small or highly detailed. As circumstance bonuses stack, her Appraise score for that kind of a action would be +26.

Similarly, if she uses Pageant of the Peacock to substitute a Knowledge skill, the end result is the same +26. This time the +2 (unnamed) bonus comes from Bardic Knowledge, in addition to the +24 from Bluff.

Wonky? Yes.
PFS legal? Definitely.

So, it would be +14 to, for example, appraise something using Perform (act). Thanks.

Or, +16 if it was a knowledge skill, because the bonus from Bardic Knowledge stacks, according to James J. Gotcha (and we're talking about bard4).

The next question is, when you're bluffing that you can, say, appraise and you don't have a single rank in appraise, are you considered untrained?

Oh, I found this from James Jacobs, and this explaining what further what it means.

So, it would be +14 to, for example, appraise something using Perform (act). Thanks.

At 2nd level, a bard can choose one type of Perform skill. He can use his bonus in that skill in place of his bonus in associated skills. When substituting in this way, the bard uses his total Perform skill bonus, including class skill bonus, in place of its associated skill's bonus, whether or not he has ranks in that skill or if it is a class skill.

I'm somewhat confused on how this is supposed to work with the masterpiece Pageant of the Peacock, RAW.

By gracefully weaving your body through subtle forms and postures you can convince others of your breeding, eloquence, and refinement. For the duration of the effect, you gain a +4 circumstance bonus on Bluff checks, and may attempt a Bluff check in place of an Intelligence check or Intelligence-based skill check.

Now, if I have Cha 16, no ranks in Bluff, and 4 ranks in Perform (act), my skill bonuses for Bluff and Perform (act) are +3 and +10, respectively. I'm allowed to use my Perform (act) skill bonus in place of my Bluff bonus. So, when I'm using Pageant of the Peacock, it is a Bluff check with a skill bonus of +10, from Perform (act), and after that I get the +4 circumstance bonus on Bluff checks from the masterpiece, making it a total of +14 Bluff check?

To me, this seems to be the correct reading of the rules. I'm especially interested in the RAW, as this is used in Pathfinder Society.

To me it's this simple.

You get the high-tier rewards, if you face the high-tier challenge. If you're giving out chronicles without deaths caused by the higher sub-tier, they shouldn't get the high-tier rewards either. After all, you're handling the situation as if they would've faces low-tier challenges, and subsequently didn't die.

Thanks, Mike and CRobledo. I missed that part, and didn't use the correct keywords when searching the guide.

If you play sub-tier 6-7, then any PC whose level is not 6 or 7 gets the out of sub-tier gold.

Thanks. Where did you get this from? I didn't find it from the guide.

In your example, though, you wouldn't be allowed to play sub-tier 6-7. The rules now state that playing up or down is no longer optional. A 4 person party with an average level of 5 in a 3-7 is required to play down. So you'd play sub-tier 3-4, the level 4 player would get sub-tier 3-4 gold, and the level 5 and 6 players would get the out of sub-tier gold.

Huh? Where did you get this from? I didn't see any mention of party with APL between the possible subtiers couldn't choose whether to play up or down.

So, I didn't find the definition of out-of-subtier. Is it somewhere? When should I apply out-of-subtier gold, to which characters?

For example, let's say there's a party of four with levels 4, 5, 5, and 6. They play subtier 6-7 on a tier 3-7 scenario. Who gets out-of-subtier gold?

Always make sure there is a way for the PC's to proceed through the adventure (if they wish to continue that is), in this case the easiest method is Gather information checks (Diplomacy or Local) to see if they find someone who spotted her running down the street, have them make a few separate checks at a DC they can pass fairly easily to get led around town to the location they should arrive at

Isn't this modifying the scenario, and as such forbidden in Organized Play? For example, GMs are not allowed to add more monsters, change written tactics, or add more items. Surely this is a similar situation.

Thanks. I'll pass this on to other online players.

What happens to characters that are of Lantern Lodge or Shadow Lodge, and playing in a play-by-post game that happens to end after Aug 14? Has this been covered somewhere?

In general, where are the rules for online play? I wasn't able to find them.

Since it's basically either Weapon Focus or Martial Weapon Proficiency, the price is fine.

Oh, but it's not like Weapon Focus that gives you +1 to attack rolls. lesser bracers of archery give you +1 competence bonus to attack rolls. So, it doesn't stack with bard's inspire courage, for example. Also, cracked pale green prism ioun stone give you the same +1 competence bonus to attack rolls for 4,000 gp.

Having had the pleasure playing with Mark I'll have to agree with everything from the opening post. He is super fun on both sides of the table. And I really enjoy how he's both challenging and extremely fair as a GM. I see it as a combination of extensive knowledge of the system, and natural talent for gamemastering.

Mark, you rock!

Samuli wrote:

What if the target turns invisible? Is the weapon going to attack the correct square?

What if someone casts deeper darkness? Does the weapon know where the target is?

What if they're fighting underwater?

The spell doesn't mention the weapon having any special sensory abilities, so it would probably continue to attack the square where the target disappeared until directed otherwise. If the target reappears later... tricky. The weapon has no listed Intelligence so it might not identify this target as the 'same' target - yet if it were any other kind of effect, it would begin to apply again.

Underwater, the fact that it's spell damage rather than a true 'weapon' means that the ranged-weapon rules for underwater combat don't apply - the spell would work normally.

I edited my post after you replied. Sorry for the hassle :)

What if the target turns invisible? Is the weapon going to attack the correct square? How about after he becomes visible again?

What if someone casts deeper darkness? Does the weapon know where the target is?

What if there is dim lighting, is the weapon subject to a miss chance?

What if they're fighting underwater?

I have a character who tries to convert everyone to follow Chaldira Zuzaristan. He was already able to convert one of my other characters, and a second one is in progress.

Because Chaldira gives out the greatest powers there are, even cheating death itself.

Sammy T wrote:

S1-S3 scenarios: I'm not too worried who I sit with. S4 scenarios: I definitely size up the abilities of both the players and their characters I game with...and I don't want to do that.

But to be honest, from a roleplaying perspective even from a gaming perspective, it's not an individual endeavor. It's a team effort so you have to also be responsible for ensuring the team performs well.

That wasn't his point, or at least I didn't get it that way. I think his point was that he's bringing enough to the table, but because it's a group effort, that's not enough. The other characters should be able to pull off their weight as well.

And I feel exactly the same way. I know what my characters can do, and how they contribute to the team. But I see a lot of characters who I constantly worry about. Maybe they're starting fights when they shouldn't. Or they don't know the concept of retreat. Or they don't have any ability to see invisible, to handle darkness, or to fly. And I wouldn't want to worry about them (as a player, in-character that's cool).

Heck, if there are season 3 and season 4 scenarios to choose from, I don't want to pick the season 3 one just because I fear the other characters might die. Still, that's kinda what I did today.

So, a party with a cleric can walk forever (or until they fall to sleep)? It's not like the cleric would run out of channels, or his happy stick.

BigNorseWolf wrote:

If you're in a party with 4 wizards, they better be 4 damned good wizards.

Corollary: If they ARE damn good wizards, EVERYTHING DIES.

We had three Chelaxian summoners (cleric, druid, wizard) back in Season 0. We didn't really mind playing up. Or what other characters happened to be around. It got old pretty fast.

The sanos abduction can be rough. I had the players scrambling. Also consider one crit in the last fight can do well over 40 damage.

Oh, I meant low-tier with four players. Check the encounters ;) That, and the fact how they're timed. I'm tempted to give it two stars just for that, even though there are redeeming qualities in the scenario.

Four players in season 4 is risky.

Fortunately, in season 4 the encounters get modified for four players. Unfortunately, some scenarios are still a cakewalk for four players in season 4. The Sanos Abduction comes to mind.

Overall, I really enjoy the difficulty level in season 4. I might be in the minority, though :)

Usually, the amount of loot you get is determined if you meet the success conditions from that encounter. To give you a personal reference, the encounter you played, The Sarkorian Prophecy, has a two-clause (if A and B, then give the party X gold pieces):

I've been deducting gold in First Steps—Part II: To Delve the Dungeon Deep, and First Steps—Part III: A Vision of Betrayal. Granted, it was the Sarkorian Prophecy that made think was I being fair to my players (I didn't think you weren't - you rock!).

Now that you quoted the examples from Sarkorian Prophecy, I checked the First Steps text. Part II had text similar to the Sarkorian Prophecy. However, about part III:

After this discussion, I think I did the right thing. And it looks like it was a lot clearer than I thought/remembered. Thanks for pointing it out.

Sure, there probably are some gray areas somewhere, but most of the text is pretty clear.

There are a few scenarios where the BBEG (or one of the other encounters) is written to escape under certain conditions. If they're carrying some gear, should I give the players less gold because the loot got away?

PFS Guide tells DMs to reward creative solutions, and give full reward if an encounter is bypassed by roleplaying. But this is somewhat different, as there was combat, and the enemy escaped with the loot.

For what it's worth, I've seen DMs usually deducting the loot in this case.

This thread gave me an idea though. I'll retrain one of my characters to a Chaldira converting dwarven monk. Glory of Old and Lessons of Chaldira for everyone :)

When it comes to banning anything from PFS and I look at it like this.

1. Does it slow down game play? IN this case (Lessons of Chaldira) Nope
2. Does it allow one player to dominate a table and remove the spotlight from other players.- No
3. Have I seen "X" issue at tables - No (Not one single time so far)
4. Is "X" issue seen as a requirement to have for PC's of that build? - No
5. Is "X" issue more useful/powerfull compared to things in the same catagarory? (Traits, Feats, Spells) Yes

That's cool. That's just not how the design team operates. It can be clearly seen from the Bracers of Falcon's Aim case, for example. The answers to your questions for that item are identical: no, no, no, no, and yes.

I guess we've done our best here. I'd like to hear from a comment from Mike or the designer team.

I could make a trait that allows you to cast Major Image five times a day using your hit dice as caster level. It'd be overpowered in terms of game balance, but it'd likely be unpopular because the majority of players want something that makes them hit harder and faster instead of create illusions.

Excellent point.

One of the reasons I brought this up was that Lessons of Chaldira allows you to re-roll failed saving throws. That's pretty much the only thing that kills high-tier characters in PFS. So, personally, I see saving throw re-rolls even more valuable than an extra (secondary) attack, for example. I wouldn't have created this thread if it let you cast free illusions :)

No matter what level the PC's reach in my game (they are now 10th), the first thing the sorcerer does in any combat against an armed enemy is to hit the enemy's weapon with grease. The next round, he does it again against any other weapon or shield. Or maybe against the saddle the enemy sits in.

Put him in his place with your own sorcerer who does a better opening move than grease--which is really not a great choice. Make him regret wasting his opening action on something so poor as grease. I mean really, how high can that save really be? 19?

Or, better yet, stop putting the party in a position where the enemies always have their weapons in hand and whatnot. Anyone with +1 BAB can draw a weapon as part of a full attack, after all. Give the NPCs improved unarmed (or spiked gauntlets...) and let them draw their weapons AFTER the "Famed Grease Sorcerer" acts. Or, hell, use knights with locked gauntlets.

I mean, if they're at that level, and the sorcerer actually does open every fight with grease, let that become a part of the legend surrounding that character. Attach embarrassing lube-related nicknames to him and have the enemies taunt him with it. Have random street people recognize him and get a laugh out of it. Make it socially embarrassing to be a mighty sorcerer relying on such an innocuous and unimpressive spell. Let the party approach a quest giver for something to do... and have them get turned down because of the Greased Pig's reputation as a pathetic spellcaster. Grease is amazing at first level, but it's kind of sad if that's your first opening move at level 10, and enemies should totally make use of that when taunting the players. Let the kingdom's bards sing songs about the sorcerer's incompetence.

I'm not saying illegitimate, but it is so boring I want to cry. The player is a dear friend and great roleplayer, but this tactic is so useful that it never stops.

Stop letting it be useful. Give some NPCs lightning reflexes and decent Dex scores occasionally. Start using more ranged combat--grease only has a range of "close", after all. It won't be much help against a charging knight with ride-by-attack. It's entirely possible for that night to be out of the spell's range by the time he's done. There's lots of ways to work around grease, and if you want him to stop using grease then you need to adopt grease-resistant tactics.

I'm halfway to stopping play over how bored I am with sorcerers and witches who do the same thing in every fight. It's a class seemingly designed specifically to bore GM's.

Instead of considering it boring, treat it like a challenge to find ways to make grease less-than-useful.

Help me A) come up with some better counters to this tactic,

There are four main problems with the grease spell (used in the way you describe) at this level.

1) It only targets one item. Meaning that it only has a chance to disable one enemy. This is VERY poor action economy for a 10th level sorcerer, who has access to black tentacles if nothing else.
2) It has low save DCs because it's a 1st level spell. If the caster is using heighten spell to raise the DCs, then this is no longer a weakness--but a lot of players don't think about using heighten spell for that purpose.
3) It only has close range. Again, that can be addressed with metamagic, but VERY few players actually bother with that.
4) The effect it causes really isn't that disruptive to a well-trained enemy. Dropping your weapon? So what, draw your backup weapon. It's also rather easily avoided (give the enemy improved unarmed, let them use locking gauntlets, etc).

This really suggests six main methods of putting shame to grease.

First, you can choose to exploit the poor action economy of grease by using a larger number of weaker enemies. This may or may not work out well depending on the party composition. If you have people who can dish out a lot of AOE habitually, this is a poor solution. If instead the party is optimized for fighting singular bosses, then this method can work wonders.

Second, you can make use of the low save DC of grease. Lightning Reflexes and a level of Rogue gives you a +4 on your Reflex saves--that's a pretty minimal investment for a fighter but makes grease a lot less likely to work. Remember; not every fighter needs to be single classed, and not every rogue needs to be obviously dressed as such. Even better would be two levels of Rogue, since that also nets you Evasion and a rogue talent. Figure out what his save DC for grease is and find a way to get a reflex save on some NPCs that equal his grease save DC -10.

Third, exploit the close range of grease. At 10th level, he has a range of 50ft on grease. Let enemies attack from beyond 50ft. One way to do that is with archery (which is quite deadly in Pathfinder). Another way is to make use of mounted combat rules--it's entirely possible to build a mounted combat character that can one-shot the average 10th level sorcerer in one round when starting beyond the range of a close range spell.

Fourth, use enemies that just don't care about grease. Monks do not care one bit about grease. Neither, frankly, do rogues. An alchemist would also handle it wonderfully--a bomb-throwing alchemist begins throwing with his hands empty, and his bomb-making ability is a supernatural ability that isn't actually dependent on any target-able gear. Alternately, do a melee smash alchemist. Obviously another sorcerer could handle it fine. Even classes that are very equipment dependent can use locking gauntlets or unarmed combat ability to laugh off a grease spell.

The other two methods of dealing with grease are general methods of dealing with any spellcaster.

A) Use counterspelling. Let the enemies hear about the famed Grease Sorcerer, and have hired their own spellcaster to counter. Since grease is only a first level spell, even a low level spellcaster can put that 10th level sorcerer to shame with counterspell. In fact, letting a first or second level apprentice shut down his grease tactic would simply drive home the point about it.

B) Grease on an item must be targeted--use concealment to prevent him from actually targeting the equipment. Alternately, use incorporeal creatures who have a 50% chance not to be effected at all by grease.

B) learn not to hate it and all the other boringly repetitious stuff limited casters do,

Find ways to put them to shame, since they have abandoned the strength of the arcane spellcaster.

or C) decide to call it quits.

Too many ways to deal with the problem to justify that. Perhaps take a break from Pathfinder if it's getting on your nerves? Play another game for a few weeks until you get the spirit back?

EDIT: Perhaps what really bores the heck out of me is debuffing. Even a small party of four can afford to dedicate one PC to just prevent the the enemy from doing anything interesting while the others grind him down. It makes every fight boring.

Use and abuse counterspelling. Also, the Disruptive Metamagic feat can very quickly annoy spellcasting PCs.