Meito's page

Meito wrote:

That's a forehead slapping moment! I cannot believe that a magus is not able to add additional enchantments to his black blade. I specifically remember reading that they are able to do so. To my utter dismay they cannot.:( That changes the build. Many thanks for pointing this out Bigtuna.

At the very least, this is a point of contention. Its not 100% clear either way, so its worth checking with your GM on how they want to handle this. If they decide not to allow it, you may also want to see if they'd be willing to let you swap one of the options on the Magus' arcane pool enhancement list to Agile.

I'm of the opinion that you CAN add enchantments to a black blade. Its a magical weapon, and doesn't specifically change anything about the rules of adding abilities to existing magic weapons (i.e. pay the difference).

At the same time, doing so is of questionable benefit, at least long term. Yes, you can add some useful abilities that you otherwise cannot (like Agile or Spellstoring...although IMO spellstoring is better on a sidearm anyway so you can just drop it after you unload it). Yes, you can pay a gold cost to sort of accelerate the "progression" of the BB. But it still caps at +10 total and +5 enhancement, so at higher levels, you're going to be completely wasting a chunk of the Magus' ability to enhance the weapon via his Arcane Pool if you added anything to the BB yourself.

You do run into the odd issue that the earlier you choose to add enchantments, the cheaper it is (due to the BB's scaling enhancement bonus), but in reality this is a non-issue. A normal character just isn't going to be able to afford to take too much advantage of this at any given level.

For example, you may be able to afford to add a +1 equivalent enhancement to the blade prior to level 5 (when it goes to +2 on its own and you'd no longer be able to afford to boost it to +3), but you certainly won't be able to add much else until much later on, and again, you save some but not...

I agree with all of your points MTCityHunter. In fact we both came to the same conclusions regarding the long term effects of enchanting the black blade. I know that my DM would allow me to enchant the blade because, like you mentioned above, its not 100% clear. For now I will simply stick with a kensai magus. This makes things easier and I don't have to worry about getting DM approval.

@Dukai
Thats a pretty simple, yet well thought out fix to my problem! Although I will not be using the bladebound archetype I will wright down your new magus arcana so that I might use it for future characters.

@AspectVoid
Thanks for pointing that out, however. I already removed the archetype in my updated character build. Bit of a bummer that the elven curveblade is not a eligible choice for a black blade.:( Oh well, it does make the build a bit simpler.

Meito wrote:

Feats:

Lvl 1 - Weapon Focus (B), Weapon Finesse
Lvl 3 - Greatweapon Spell Combat
Lvl 5 - Improved Initiative, Power Attack (B)
Lvl 7 - Intensified Spell
Lvl 9 - Weapon Specialization (elven curveblade)

Dont know this feat, is this feat allowing you to use the Elven Curvedblade and still use Spell combat?

Thats exactly what the feat does Slacker2010. The feat can be found in Advanced Feats: Might of the Magus.

Wow! First off many thanks for the responses and advice folks. Its greatly appreciated. I will now attempt to respond to everything ...

What stats are you using? If you are tanking, I would consider the crane style feats.

As of yet I do not know what my stats will be. We are going to be using either 24 point buy or higher, my DM has not yet specified. For now lets assume a 30 point buy. This would allow me the following stat array:

Str 10, Dex 16 -> 18, Con 14 -> 12, Int 16 -> 18 (stat boost x 2), Wis 10, Cha 14

Thanks for mentioning the crane style feats! Those are an excellent choice for a tank, however. The prerequisites are bit steep for a non monk.

What is this "greatweapon spell combat" feat. I have never heard of it before. Also, you can't spell combat with a two-handed weapon. You have to have 1 hand free the whole time. You'll need UMD to cast Mage Armor (since it's not on the Magus spell list). Also, need intensified metamagic with Magical lineaged shocking grasp. 1st level spell slot 10d6 touch. Now buy a bunch of pearl of powers level 1.

The feat is found in Advance Feats: Might of the Magus. The feat allows you to use a two-handed weapon with spell combat. I like the intensified metagic/magical lineage trick. The only thing that worries me is that if I use that combo will it be a detriment to my tanking ability?

Snip ....

That is a fantastic trick!

Pearl necklace of power!

Ugh, I cannot believe I left that out of the gear selections I had already made. >.<

We're facing some lack of information as build, feat, and spell selection can depend a lot on what other classes are there and how long the adventuring day is. Magus do face the problem of being a 15 minute wonder and then a so-so fighter the rest of the time. This can be worked around a number of different ways.

Some suggestions / fixes to what I see you have so far -

Magus can not use Wand of Mage Armor as Mage Armor is not on the Magus Spell list. You can get around this by picking up the Arcana that allows you to grab wizard spells or grab the arcana for a familiar and the improved familiar feat.

If you're planning on using wands, a familiar and improved famiar is the suggested way to go. Grab yourself a familiar that's able to use UMD and have your familiar use all those wands and scrolls. Familiars almost all require a GM check for UMD as the rules around this are a bit vague.

Another suggestion is pick up a Wand of Shield. Use that in the first round of combat and then drop it.

Weapon: Elven Curve Blade is a 2handed weapon and can NOT be used with spell combat. As spell combat has a requirement of light or 1handed weapon and a free hand for the full round.

Feat: Power Attack. I feel this is a trap. Others like it. My issue is that you're already suffering a -2 to hit with spell combat and stacking more negitives to hit with a 3/4 BAB class is bad. While it is doable when you use Arcane Accuracy, you just don't have enough AP points to do it often enough to make it worth while.

I do have a Magus I play that doubles as a tank.

snip ...

• I am not sure what the composition of the group will be other than there will be one spellcaster, healer, and one rogue-like character. Although I have been advised that the spellcaster and the rogue will be able to dish out very impressive damage.
  
• I am aware that mage armour is not on their spell list. This is why I will be maxing out UMD.
  
• Cannot have a familiar with the bladebound archetype.
  
• Using, then dropping, the wand of shield is an excellent idea!
  
• I know that power attack can be a trap. I have it because I love the idea of an elf power attacking with a giant rapier.:p Also, it will prove handy for the lower level, low AC, cannon fodder. Although if it proves to be to much of a detriment to the character I shall replace it with something else.
  
• I like the tripping idea along with enlarge person. The real issue is that I must use an elven curveblade due to background/RP related choices.

1) Don't think you can add agile to the black blade - so you really want dervish dance and a schimitar

2) magical liniage + intenficied is a class feature for the magus.

That's a forehead slapping moment! I cannot believe that a magus is not able to add additional enchantments to his black blade. I specifically remember reading that they are able to do so. To my utter dismay they cannot.:( That changes the build. Many thanks for pointing this out Bigtuna.

For traits I wouldnt worry about Reactionary, Kensai is going to be giving you a boost to your Initiative and with your High DEX I dont think its needed.

You cant pick up Weapon Spec at level 5, You dont get fighter Training until level 7 and this is where you can pick it up. At level 5 I would take Craft Wondrous Items if your GM allows. This will give you alot of bang for your buck.

I had alot more to write till I realized your using a 2handed weapon. Are you stuck on this? Your going to lose a lot without being about to access Spell Combat (major class feature). If your not going to use Spell combat I would suggest and EK would be a better Option.

Based on the above input I will have to revise my build. Please see below for updated character build.

Heh, Just saw this thread.

I actually am currently playing a LvL 9 (8 kensai, bladebound magus/1 unarmed fighter)

And he works as the party tank.
snip ...

Thanks for sharing your build Thefurmonger. I will take a look as soon as I can.

Another proposal (sketched out, not completed)

snip ...

That is an excellent build darkwarriorkarg! I might steal some of your ideas.:)

Race: elf (variant racial trait:Fleet Footed)

Favoured Class Option: Magus gains 1/6 of a new magus arcana

Class: Kensai Magus 10

Traits: Warrior of Old, Magical Lineage (Shocking Grasp)

Feats:

• Lvl1 - Weapon Focus (B), Weapon Finesse
  
• Lvl3 - Greatweapon Spell Combat
  
• Lvl5 - Improved Initiative, Power Attack (B)
  
• Lvl7 - Intensified Spell
  
• Lvl9 - Weapon Specialization (elven curveblade)

Magus Arcana:

• Lvl3 - Magus Arcana (?)
  
• Lvl6 - Magus Arcana (wand wielder), Bonus Magus Arcana (arcane accuracy)
  
• Lvl9 - Magus Arcana -> Critical Perfection

Spells (assume Int 20):

• Lvl0 - Read Magic, Detect Magic, Arcane Mark, ?
  
• Lvl1 - Enlarge Person, Shield, Shocking Grasp x2, True Strike, Grease
  
• Lvl2 - Blur, Mirror Image, Frigid Touch, ?
  
• Lvl3 - Haste, Force Hook Charge, ?
  
• Lvl4 - Black Tentacles

Gear ideas:

• +1 agile elven curveblade
  
• wand of shocking grasp
  
• wand of mage armor
  
• wand of shield
  
• pearls of power (1st lvl) x2
  
• belt of dexterity/constiution +2
  
• headband of vast intelligence +2
  
• ring of protection +2
  
• cloak of resistance +2
  
• amulet of natural armor +2

I am going for a very high initiative count and will be using the intensified shocking grasp trick.

Whew! There it is folks. Please have a look at the updated build. I would also like to say thanks again for all of the great ideas/help!

Hello Everyone,

First and foremost I would like to say hi to everyone as this is my first post here on the boards. I have been a long time lurker that has greatly enjoyed the many and varied topics posted here on the forums.

With that out of the way I can now specify the reason for my post; I am in need of advice. I am about to embark on a new game (staring level is 10, 24~30 point buy[not sure yet], standard wealth) in which I will be playing a Magus ... tank. I know that this might not be optimal but we promised our DM that we would each try something new and different for this game. I have read most of the guides and will admit that I am still struggling to come up with a build that I believe is effective. I am hoping that by posting here I can iron out the kinks. Please review the build that I have below and let me know what you think. All comments are welcome.

Race: elf
Favoured Class Option: Magus gains 1/6 of a new magus arcana

Class: Bladebound*/Kensai Magus 10

Traits: Reactionary, Resilient

Feats:

• Lvl1 - Weapon Focus (B), Weapon Finesse
  
• Lvl3 - Greatweapon Spell Combat
  
• Lvl5 - Weapon Specialization (black blade), Power Attack (B)
  
• Lvl7 - ?
  
• Lvl9 - ?

Magus Arcana:

• Lvl3 - Magus Arcana -> Black Blade
  
• Lvl6 - Magus Arcana (wand wielder), Bonus Magus Arcana (arcane accuracy)
  
• Lvl9 - Magus Arcana -> Critical Perfection

Spells (assume Int 20):

• Lvl0 - Read Magic, Detect Magic, Arcane Mark, ?
  
• Lvl1 - Enlarge Person, Shield x2, Shocking Grasp, True Strike, Grease
  
• Lvl2 - Blur, Mirror Image, Frigid Touch, ?
  
• Lvl3 - Haste, Force Hook Charge, ?
  
• Lvl4 - Black Tentacles

Gear ideas:

• +1 agile elven curveblade
  
• wand of shocking grasp
  
• wand of mage armor

* Black blade = elven curveblade (I will have a wand chamber built into the handle. Wand chambers can be found in Dungeonscape.)

I am going with the bladebound/kensai magus mostly because I think it's pretty darn cool. I also believe that the Kensai Magus will have a pretty stellar AC at higher levels (especially coupled with a Mage Armour and Shield spell). As you can see from the build I need some help with feat choices, gear and spell suggestions.

All help is greatly appreciated!