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My concerns right now:

-the paladin is in my eyes too good (duh!) saves, smite evil, many feats, good BAB, many hit points and even spells. To live by the LG alignment isn't such a nerf inside the game mechanics.

-Power attack! Am I the only one who is sad watching a fighter do 150-200 points of damage and thus reducing a thrilling fight to becomne only a two rounds-must?

-Single stat efficiency. There's no need to be good in anything else than only one ability, the fighter focusing STR, the wiz INT and so forth...combine with the one above and DnD 3.5 seems to be the future... :s

-Leadership feat seems to be broken since the henchmen quickly become too good. What about the henchmen taking the leadership as well (and so on...)?

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I'd like the Paizo staff discuss scaling matters. That's what I find is the weakest part of the game right now. I want the game to be as thrilling as it is lvls 1-3 on all levels.


Usually when people tell me that something in Pathfinder is broken, I argue that the game is so complex that whatever build you can come up with, there has to be weaknesses which can be used by the clever GM or adventure designer. Also, many of the examples here on the messageboards only address questions and examples of rules in terms of combat, which make those examples to some degree arbitrary. One way to deal with that overpowered (fighter-) class could then be to stress role-playing, skill checks, natural hazards, poison, paralysis or other challenges, which doesn’t include combat by any means. So, hitherto I’ve never been especially bothered by peoples argument about something being broken in pathfinder.

This also shows how much I love the game and possible a how naïve I might be – struggling to defend Paizo/PF against whatever argument comes my way. No game has ever been perfect, why should PF have to be? It could be great fun nevertheless?!

Well, now my friend showed me a class build which included “Power attack”, a two-handed weapon, great Strength and the Paladin class. Together with the feat “Litany of Righteousness”, he gave me examples of how his paladin could do more than 200 points of damage to a single foe of the evil alignment. His question was if this combo of class, feats and abilities was a good example of something broken within the game. Of course I started to defend PF by saying something about that the paladin class HAS to have some weaknesses, for example they should be prime targets of someone using mind-affecting magic?

“Really?” he answered, “…but the paladin has good saves (Fort/Will) and can use his Cha-bonus on other saves (Divine Grace), is immune to fear (Aura of Courage) which also expands to his/her allies, immune to diseases and quite many conditions like fatigue or nauseated. The paladin also get some spells when he/she reach the appropriate level.”

I like my friends build and I’d like to think of him as a good player and that the reward for being such a good player should end up with dealing huge amounts of damage and beating the foes. If you are able to come up with a build that wins you the fight, I don’t want to punish my friend for being clever enough to find and use the most favourable choices.

But on the other hand, I want the game to be thrilling and challenging, whatever classes and feats we choose. Right now I can’t imagine an encounter that is truly challenging to a paladin. I can’t see the class’ weaknesses. Can you?

So, I need your help here..how to write an encounter that’s challenging to a paladin?

Thanks in advance!


In short:
1. A dramatic back-story that unfolds continually along the AP. Twists!
2. Challenges both to PCs (elaborate encounters) and Players (puzzles, information gathering, detective roleplay).
3. Devils

Well, I'm not that interested of either the possibilities with war, new exotic locations or some mix of monsters (exception: devils, aren't they the coolest and worst adversaries you can think of?). But – what I'd appreciate would be an overall more "player challenging" AP. That is – an AP that has lots of challenges/puzzles/choices for the Players to solve, and not only difficult and elaborate encounters for the PC:s (those are of course needed, but that would go without saying). A really good example of this is when the players have to interprete something. That would also highlight skilluse instead of fighting/magic-using, which would be something new.

I think of "Red hand of Doom" as a good role model for Adventure Paths. A feature I loved with that adventure was that the (game)world seemed to live on its own. It really mattered a lot what the players chose to do, and everything became much more intriguing (the opposite would be when you feel that the adventure is railroaded and that you as a player really don't have to decide what to do).

I consider the devils to be the best BBEG, since they lend themselves perfectly to the idea of someone scheming in the background and by it's potential as something that can evolve during the whole AP.


Thanks Legallytired, for your quick reponse.

Of course, since I'm being a stoopid moron (aaargh! why do I always have to be?!), the D&D 3,5 rules states it quite clearly in the PHB (page 164).

Furthermore I totally agree with you that a GM is supposed, in order to maximize tension, to roll the perc. checks. But, then what? How do your players (I believe you are a GM) understand that they've missed on something? How do you tell them the results from the checks?

I think there are at least some sites that the players might miss due to bad rolls.

But I might be wrong on this... ;)

Thanks again for puttin' me on track!


Hi (sorry if I mess up with your thread, but it's title seemed to welcome questions, so I dared put this post here)

First of all, I must say that I really love the stuff you Paizo-guys do, both the physical products but also all the work on the site and overall communication with fans!
Inspiring in more than one way. Big thanks from Sweden!

Second, I'm curious about how you deal with exploration/travel in the Greenbelt - specifically how long a character can travel, or explore before he or she suffers fom some kind of fatigue? Simply put: when do PC:s get tired and need rest? I'm using the old rules (3,5) but I can't find any rules covering this.

Third – if the PC:s explore one hex, but fail on their perception checks, how do you treat this in actual play? Do you tell the players that they have to spend another day in the hex or do you demand that the players themselves realize that they might have missed something? I guess that could sound something like this: "What, all of this land, totally unoccupied?! No things, no ruins, no monsters, no...nothing! Can't believe it, we'll have to explore this area once again! There has to be something here!"

/Karl Asp, Stockholm/Sweden