Jim Groves's page

Thrilled to have you watching, Jim. Please keep those inside stories flowing if you can spare the time.

I can't tell the one that I mentioned until I make sure they've gotten to that point!

Edit: Wow, I really like the set-up, with being sponsored by the Hook and Tookah, for exclusive buyer's rights in exchange for room and board. I also really like all the characters. I'm going to read a little bit every day, time permitting. I got to the farm today. Really strong beginning and a neat way to bring the group together.

If you have a problem with someone putting honest, hardworking beetles, who just want to dig holes and raise their itty bitty beetle children, in harms way, give Jim Groves a call.

And as for the health and wellbeing of said beetles, well that’s entirely up to a certain adventuring party. Don’t blame me if you all woke up and chose violence this morning.

Then again, I admit that I may or may not have included a custom magic item specifically tailored to one of you in this room and deliberately buried it in the middel of the happy little beetle home. If that’s really what’s there, blame me and not Jim.

That was a long time ago and now I'm in a much better, healthier place.

Hi guys.

I think I'll take a look around. I just got here, so it will take me a bit to catch up. Hope you're having fun.

I look forward to getting this. I was really impressed with the first Blood Lords chapter's Foundry module.

It's not a coincidence that I have not posted in the forums for a long time. That is not meant to be dramatic or negative, just that this product made want to actually share some thoughts about it.

I am not affiliated with any party or any distinct individual related to this product. I paid for it.

I'm not sure about whatever happened with previous offerings (Frozen Flame, etc.), but I am really impressed with what the VTT Team / Sigil has done here with this specific chapter. There is an amazing attention to detail which surpasses the AP Chapter products sold for use by other popular VTTs.

Looking at the cost on top of the PDF, there is no question of the value here for me. I have used VTTs (Maptools) since before Roll20 and Foundry were a thing. I know the effort it takes to put on a good presentation. As a Foundry user this was worth my money.

If you disagree with the cost of the PDF AND THAT reflects on how you feel about this digital VTT product- that's a different conversation. One of which I'm not going to get into. To each their own.

But Sigil / Foundry VTT is not fleecing anybody with this specific digital product. I never bought a premium module for Foundry before this specific one, but lordy, my personal time has value too. (I have bought them for Roll20) They put some effort in for the additional expense (on top of the PDF) they're asking for.

Again, not shilling for any party. I'm being authentic here.

PS: I don't usually do reviews. I might this time because this is a digital product based upon a separate written product. There is degree of separation here I might be comfortable with in order to post a review. If I do decide to, it'll be the next month or so after I have ran the adventure on Foundry. You never know what kinks you might find. That said I can praise the product today because 10+ years of VTT experience gives me an insight to what look for. I installed it and examined it carefully. Everything so far exceeds my expectations. My motive for posting is to encourage others to be objective so this type of product will continue to be offered.

FIRST SESSION

I was nervous. I drew all the maps out for the Citadel in advance, but I felt shaky with a new rule system. We got a late start because one player, Oak, didn’t get the message that we were playing at a different house that was more centrally located to the recent of the group. He got caught in a traffic jam doubling back and it set us back on our time to play by about an hour and a half. This is significant because I like to do an intro to the starting town and have the PCs meet a bunch of NPCs and get to know the locals. Goodness knows I’ve done the Swallowtail Festival in Sandpoint often enough. The delay prompted me to get right to adventure with minimal set-up. This…actually worked just fine. The players said they enjoyed that things started relatively quickly.

Humorous side note: Eider, the Druid, mentioned that he had a Druid ability called Wild Empathy and explained how it worked to me. “Players never get to use it though, because Paizo adventures never have animals that are in a situation where it would do any good to actually try it.” Thinking of the goblin dogs, I kept my silence. I nodded absently as I got my dice out and maintained a poker face.

My personal spin on the beginning: The meeting starts at noon, so I indicated that the Wizard’s Grace opens early with a boar and lentil brunch with one free drink for adventurers who intend to respond to the Heroes Call. I mentioned important townsfolk being present, but with the late start I didn’t try to push a social encounter. Afterwards, they headed over to town hall. I distributed the image of town hall and the Monument Circle from page 62. I casually mentioned that the circle is where the town gets a lot of it’s fresh water, except for wells on private property. I kept any mention of the town’s history very low-key. The Player’s Guide covers that topic, but I causally mentioned that Breachill was founded by the “Good Wizard Breachton” and that was the reason Breachill was very community oriented and adventurer friendly. I’m not withholding the background, but rather letting them find it or pursue it. “I even got a picture of the guy,” I said and shared the statue picture on page 65. The players didn’t interpret these facts as anything but background and took the information in stride. Which is good, they’ll have fun stuff to learn about after the fact. Voz’s journal will be fascinating for them, but it would be a distraction right now.

Once at town hall, I had the townsfolk express curiosity about them. The Players/PCs were a little surprised at the turnout, but I mentioned a very slight festival atmosphere, and that most of the town showed up just to hear the latest news and other people’s problems that could become their own. Many townsfolk had never seen a leshy and were oooh and aahing over First Light. Garrett the bard used the opportunity to perform for free.

The PCs did meet Warble. Eider the goblin-disliking dwarf pointed at her and called out, “Excuse me! Excuse me! There is a goblin standing here among us!” Townies explained her role, and one of them called over to Warble. “Miss Warble! Come on over here, this dwarven fellah would like to meet you!” Eider steadfastly refused to appear mortified, but was mortified. Warble glanced at his shield and immediately understood the kill marks (see his description in the first post) and that he was likely a war veteran. Her ears drooped like a J.K. Rowling house elf, and I indulged Eider giving her a cool, warning stare without reprisal from the community. (It worked out as you’ll see).

Children were delighted with the leshy monk and a little girl asked the other PCs if she could hug him, because “he’s so cute.” Eider replied she would have to ask First Light herself, which she did. First Light (whose voice echoes in his empty gourd head like Alphonse in Full Metal Alchemist) acquiesced saying, “You may hug me, but I will not hug you.” I remarked that all subtlety was wasted on this 6 year old girl and she hugged him like a doll.

Everyone proceeded into the meeting. I distributed pictures of Greta and Councilman Posandi and got them on my pre-drawn town council map. The start of the meeting went by the the adventure’s text. Because I had five players, I added the elite array (or whatever ever it’s called) to the mephit, to give it a little ooomph. I was worried it would proof too tough, but not at all. I shared the image on page 4, because it’s exciting and is a good look at a mephit. They clobbered it in short order anyway.

What both the players and I learned from that encounter is the mephit is not the big challenge. It’s the fire! They focused their efforts singularly on the mephit for the first two rounds before they realized the fire was spreading half again every turn. Then the tension started and the players started to really focus.

I have some experience from writing encounters and running ones written by other authors. In this case, the players have 7 rounds before people start dying (which is not a particularly heroic feeling). They don’t have time for trial and error to figure out the special fire mechanics. They have just enough time to perform those mechanics. Plus, in cases like this, I have found myself or other players explaining all the mechanics over and over again at the start of every player’s turn. It’s not that the players are not paying attention but it’s a lot of choices unique to the encounter to take in all at once. I could have written these on 3 x 5 index cards, but I distributed little option sets to their phones and iPads. They help explain what their options are. That way, they could really focus on strategy without being confused by me. The whole encounter ran really well and didn’t bog down. I did not share the encounter timeline. They knew the clock was ticking but not how long they had to evacuate and/or put out the fire. Here are some examples of what I used.
Extinguishing Fire
Saving Spectators
Town Councilors
Bucket Brigade

Those two rounds of focusing solely on the mephit let the fire get out of control and despite heroic efforts, they never regained control of the situation. Councilors were evacuating spectators and helping to form the bucket brigade. I allowed two buckets to pile up on the southern entrance. They split their effort to make sure spectators got out. Garrett the halfling bard fell unconscious and I fudged and had Warble heal him (as a cleric) on her way out of the building. Eider had to run out and to get some healing and sent Truddy out. Oak bailed out the north door because they put that fire out. First Light passed out and Oak ran back in to save him. Garrett passed out for a second time and Eider pulled him out. They lost half of town hall and two spectators died. Hero points were being spent. The group was disappointed that two innocents died, but I affirmed that they had saved 38 people and kept the fire from becoming worse.

I accidentally awarded them the 50 sp each (which had a higher success criteria), but I have no regrets. They all almost died fighting the fire valiantly and the death mechanics and hero points were used for the very first time. On the upshot, their friendship (albeit grudgingly in the case of Eider) was cemented with Warble after her efforts to help. The group was also thirsty to bring someone to justice. First Light has the Haunting Vision trait, and I shared this with his player / PC and the whole group got to see it out-of-character. First Light’s Latest Haunting Vision
Inspiration Follow-up Image

Greta hired them and I made sure that the instructions to bring the arsonist back alive was explicitly clear. As I mentioned in a previous post, the guards could not identify Calmont, but did see a hooded figure who was shorter than a human. A successful Survival check by Oak verified the tracks led to the Citadel, and because of his high roll the group knew they were looking for a halfling.

When they arrived at the Citadel I shared the image on page 2, but also shared an altered image that I (sloppily) edited. Citadel Altaerein External Walls and Breaches
This to show the general shape of the Citadel and the three wings and external entrances. They elected to go in through the traditional front entrance. Oak noticed the doors could be noisy and snuck in to scout, ducking back out after not being noticed by the goblin dogs. I added a 4th to balance the encounter for 5 players. Note: I don’t universally boost all the encounters for a fifth player (it’s not easy at 1st level!), but I do to a select few encounters that I think need it. Most of the group immediately wanted to find another entrance, but Eider whose player was saying Paizo never gives an opportunity to use wild empathy, decided to try it. I also confirmed that while they’re nasty, they’re just animals. Eider took it nice and slow and offered food which was accepted. Wild empathy didn’t work because he bombed the roll and truthfully lowballed Charisma, but the dogs remained indifferent. The party nervously walked past them. They bee-lined through to A6 and ignored the room (for now) to look through the iron gate. One player remarked in wonder, “I didn’t think we’d be facing a dragon this soon!”

So ends the first session. The players said they loved it, especially the burning fire “skill challenge.” One player reported that they were super dubious about hero points but now thinks they’re great and that they add to the game.

Second Session is in the can but I need to write it up first.

Here’s some of the rule questions I had to address, house rules, and modifications to the chapter I’ve made. A lot of them came through the ever valuable GM’s thread for Chapter One.

Starting Rule Decisions

Trudy the bear has an Intimidate special ability as an animal companion. The new Intimidate skill rules impose a -4 penalty if you don’t share a language or use a language. I thought imposing that on a PC’s animal companion was basically nerfing their companion’s ability right out of the gate. “It’s got a cool power that immediately sucks because it doesn’t work a lot of times.” I decided Roaring Bear is a universal language if you’re capable of being affected by Intimidation. No penalty. I reserved the right to change my mind.

First Light wants to be a Dexterity based monk, which makes sense for a 3-foot tall plant. Can grappling be Dex based? Well, grapple can be an unarmed attack (it’s not exclusively an unarmed attack, but it does require a free hand), and unarmed attacks in turn have the finesse trait. Plus grapple specifically has the attack keyword, which reinforces that weapon properties like finesse may be applicable. Finally, weapon properties like finesse feel like an example of a more specific rule compared to a general rule (that Athletics in general are Strength based). Plus First Light is a small creature with limits on the size of creature he can grapple without additional magic aid. This doesn’t feel game breaking. NOTE:Some comments are welcome, but I don’t want a protracted rules discussion in this thread which makes it hard to read the story. I encourage people who want to discuss this specifically to start a rule thread and add a link here if they feel they would like to share. I reserved the right to revisit this with the player, so I’m not stuck.

First Light also wonders about Flurry of Blows and his Seed Pod ability. Seed Pod is specifically a ranged unarmed attack. In fact, it’s the only one that I can find, which does make me a little concerned that this might be an unintended loophole/rule interaction, but….. Flurry of blows mandates that the monk use unarmed attacks but doesn’t mention that they have to be melee unarmed attacks. I decided to allow it, for the sake of looking and being cool. That does mean opening to Stunning Fist to Seed Pod at 2nd level. I am going to monitor this one and I reserved the right to change my mind to the player. On the balancing side, Seed Pods have a short range increment. Again, I’d rather any long rules discussion go in the rules forums and just add a link in this thread.

House Rules I wasn’t going to have any (because I wanted to see how the game runs with limited modification), but I was asked about Bulk. We all hated weight based encumbrance in 1st edition. It wasn’t fun and it only served to detract from feeling heroic. On the other hand, there are special situations (survival scenarios, or situations where being isolated are actual story elements) where I could see weight based encumbrance being worthy of consideration, but those were rare. The group universally agreed that Bulk was nowhere as bad as weight based encumbrance, but I elected not to enforce Bulk. No one in our group is a rule abuser, so I said to keep what their characters are carrying within reason. It’s never been a problem before or even super-unrealistic. Note, I use the term “weight based encumbrance” because I differentiate that between armor based Speed adjustments. Those aren’t a problem. Finally my players have always sought magical solutions to keep weight limits in the realm of the justifiable.

Story Element Changes When the fire is resolved, the town guard will NOT be able to identify Calmont on sight. What they can do is inform the PCs and Greta where they saw a hooded figure standing and a vague suggestion of which direction they were headed. They also can report that the individual was too short to be a “human person”, but was definitely humanoid. When the PCs go to that spot, I made it an easy or very easy Survival tracking check to find the trail, which leads to Citadel Altaerein. On a really decent roll, they can verify that the footprints are barefoot and likely a halfling. (I guess I could have made that information the result of a critical success on an easy roll, but I really wanted to make sure they get that information). This eliminates the “investigate Voz before going to the Citadel problem”, while likely narrowing down who they’re looking for, i.e. a halfling. Knowing it is a halfling is really ideal, because it steers them away from looking for a goblin suspect. Incidentally this worked like a charm.

Because I think the shadow of the Goblinblood War works against the concept of peaceful goblins, I decided that over the two year history before the start of the campaign, the Bumblebrashers sought permission from the town to live in a 5 mile vicinity of town. They maintained good behavior for one year, whereupon they were granted permission to occupy Citadel Altaerein at their own risk. Likewise, it’s been fine with the goblins living in the castle for the last year. This smooths out the changes between first and second edition with players who have a really predetermined biased against goblins. Trust was granted, but it was further developed by goodwill that was earned over time.

The red smoke signals and missed appointments with Helba had only been since yesterday evening. Long enough to get Warble’s attention but not seem like Warble and Breachill were being neglectful of their allies’s welfare.

I was really, really tempted to move the Citadel from town. In my mind, if the Bumblebrashers are only one mile away, why are these two communities not fully integrated? Yeah, I know that if they were integrated there would be no need for the smoke signals, but that’s not my point. But…against my better judgment I left it alone. That said, I’m nothing if not fair. It ended up being no big deal and the players didn’t even bat an eye. I was the only one bothered by it and I kept my own counsel, so I concede the point. And hey, I didn’t need to worry about the escape tunnel now.

Special Technique: I have an iOS App that lets me annotate or edit PDFs, and by virtue of that I can extract artwork out cleanly into a jpg. By cleanly, I mean without text around a face portrait. I save these graphics to a photo album on my iPad. We all use Facebook and Facebook Messenger (but if you hate FB I’m sure you could do this with another message program). I created a dedicated Age of Ashes Artwork thread with the rule of no chatting, and during the game I attach artwork images to messages and shoot them to all of their phones and iPads. It only takes a few seconds, so I do it live during the game. It gives them a lasting visual record of creatures and locations they come across between sessions while I don’t have to clumsily fumble with the book to show them art, all while trying to cover the text with my hands. We also have a dedicated Age of Ashes miscellaneous chat thread to talk about the game, joke about it, talk about rules, and confirm next sessions and locales.

Enough introduction, let’s move on to the first session!

This is a journal for my personal Age of Ashes game. I see other folks sharing journals and wanted to join the fun. It might also give people some insight on how I’m running the game and the decisions I made. There will be spoilers! My players stay out!

Let’s meet the PCs! All artwork was done my buddy Ben Bruck, a fellow freelancer. Ben took an art class and this was a fun exercise for him.

Eider Eider is a male, dwarf druid with a bear animal companion named Trudy. This is the player’s favorite class and I think his favorite ancestry, and I got a really nice, rich background for this character. He grew up in the Five King Mountains and was born into an affluent family. Eider’s father, only ever referred to as “the Profit” owns and manages a highly successful weapon manufacturing business, which affords the family five distinct homes, one assigned to each season. Eider spent most of his life near the autumn home near the Palakar Forest, developing relationships with foresters and dryads that dwelled nearby. This behavior was tolerated by the Profit in hopes that eventually he could turn it towards financial gain. During the Goblinblood War, his dryad friends appealed to him to act to defend their dryad and woodland friends in the Chitterwood which was eventually consumed in flames. Eider enlisted, but after the war arranged to fake his own death and send his armor and weapons back to his father. Eider is a disillusioned dwarf who sees the pursuit of gold and silver as a soulless endeavor, while alternately finding no solace or comfort in religion. He is loyal. He hates goblins, holding them ultimately responsible for the destruction in Chitterwood and bears a mark of every goblin, hobgoblin, and bugbear he’s ever killed on his shield. My personal take on him is that he’s someone who has lost his faith in people and institutions (other than his bear buddy, Truddy), but who would desperately like to find it again. While his anti-goblin attitude sounds problematic, I’ve talked to the player about it. This is a growing edge and the player intends to allow his character to see goblins in a different light when circumstances permit. Since all the players have played in Golarion for years, I felt this was a good approach. That is, allowing the change in some goblin communities to be treated as a new thing. As long as it isn’t used to derail the campaign, I’m fine with that. Change and growth is one reason we role play.

Eider’s Paper Mini Artwork

Truddy Animal Companion Paper Mini Artwork

First Light First Light is a gourd leshy monk. Like Eider, he too comes from the Five King Mountains. He was conjured into existence by a grove of druids, mostly dwarves, and is the same grove that Eider belonged to, giving them an in-character connection. First Light refers to his dwarven companion as ‘Papa Eider.’ His actual name is “The First Light of Dawn over the Five Kings Mountains as it Reflects on the Placid Waters of a Lake”, but goes by First Light for expediency. He is an old soul who views life and death as part of a natural cycle. His purpose in this life is to protect the wilderness and to acquire wisdom. Certain concepts of mortal life still allude him, like humanoid gender, social class, and is pragmatic about social niceties. For example, First Light believes change in behavior is the best form of apology. Despite being very tranquil, First Light has the Haunted Visions AP background, and therefore has come to Breachill out of fear of his prophetic dreams. This player has always wanted to play a leshy for years and years, and I’m pleased that it’s a fully supported ancestry.

First Light Gourd Leshy Monk

Garrett Greygallows Garrett is a male halfling bard and devotee of Cayden Cailean. He also possesses a very unique background and I’m excited to see how it plays out later in the campaign. Garrett was this player’s character in Hell’s Rebels, who he enjoyed very much. The campaign was completed to the very end, but the player wanted to play him again. I normally would discourage this, but the players came up with an intriguing and clever way to sell it to me. Garrett is like Conan the Barbarian. He’s on point when driven by goals and quests, but indolent and less worthy when left listless and without purpose. After the Silver Ravens liberated Kintargo, Garrett went to pot, overeating, drinking to excess, and spending his wealth on female companionship and excess- anything to stave off the emptiness. Finally Garrett sought redemption from his fellow Silver Raven, a cleric of Alseta. Through a miracle spell Garrett has been returned to a 1st level character and has set out to rediscover himself and this time maybe find a life he can be content with until the end of his days. Very much a redemption arc. The fact that the former PC companion worshipped Alseta was a delightful bit of coincidence. Plus that wonderful future chapter that returns to Kintargo! He’ll walk again in the steps of his previous heroic endeavors! This is going to be fun. In play, Garrett is a plucky little fellow, brave, eager to be a hero and ergo has come to present himself at Breachill’s Call for Heroes.

Garret Greygallows Halfling Bard Paper Mini

Galub Jameela is a female dwarf fighter. Yeah yeah, that’s a fun name of a dessert. It’s an in-joke because the player tried repeatedly to make Galub Jamun and always having it turn out bad. It turns out they didn’t realize that clarified butter and melted butter are different things. ANYWAY, we’re working on just calling the character Jameela, which is a nice name. This (very good) player doesn’t usually emphasize character over plot but is otherwise great fun. This time they’re trying to go deeper, but Jameela has a simpler background than the ones I’ve previous described. Her clan also comes from the Five King Mountains and is very patriarchal. While women are not consign to baking pies, men are traditionally the clan warriors and smiths. That’s not standard in Golarion, but this is an unnamed NPC clan that might not come up in play very much, and it gives this player a foil or something to use as motivation. Jameela has raised three children to adulthood by herself, is very family motivated, loyal, and ready to prove that she can do anything a man can do. As a quirk, she is fairly suspicious of magic, but like Eider she might come to outgrow it. She is a battle axe and board fighter, and the player is excited about how cool the fighter is now.
Jameela Female Dwarf Fighter Paper Mini

Oak is a male half-elf Rogue Wizard multiclass (rogue primary and wizard secondary), which is a class this player has wanted to play since D&D 2nd edition. Our group has not found that combo well supported since way back when. His full name is Okanos, and truth be told, this player didn’t have the time to create a detailed background. I don’t let that be a gate to playing however (we all have other lives to live), and we may flesh out his background during play. Oak is a Hellknight Historian who arrives at the Call for Heroes in hopes make connections in community that will allow him to research and gain access to Citadel Altaerein. Lucky coincidence! In terms of art, the player was hoping to wield a bladed scarf but we discovered late that those have not been brought over to PF 2, yet. We’re working on some temporary rules until something official comes out.

Oak Half-Elf Rogue Wizard Paper Mini

Example of finished mini

Example finished minis 2

Instead, maybe Calmont came upon the goblins, but knowing that there was too many of them, he managed to inveigle the tribe into letting him join them. His ultimate plan being to betray them once they reveal how to get to Alseta's Ring. That way there can be a big confrontation where the PCs call him out on his lies and his crime back in Breachhill. The advantage of this set up is that he can be playing his con for as long as necessary for the PCs to arrive without it seeming unrealistic.

I’m quoting Cellion here, but actually I’m replying to all of the “Clamont holds an entire tribe hostage with a dagger” questions and posts.

I would change your perspective on the situation. Instead of looking at as a situation how Calmont is managing to hold them all hostage, ask yourself why the Bumblebrashers would allow it to happen? I can think of a reason.

Warble is the articulate goblin. She has some understanding of humanoid culture (referring to humans, dwarves, elves, halflings and so on). That said, it’s likely that the rest of this tribe has not acquired her level of nuance and sophistication. That may come in time, but that’s not the reality right now.

I’ll stop beating around the bush...

The goblins let themselves to get bullied by Calmont because they’re terrified of the ramifications of what happens if they jump him and he gets hurt. What will the people of Breachhill think? What if Calmont gets killed? Whose going to believe them, especially in the wake of the Goblinblood Wars? All it takes is a few people to start saying, “I knew we couldn’t trust them.” Or “I’m worried about my kids, what if a goblin freaks out over something and bites somebody?”

They’ve lived two years near humans and have worked hard to gain a modicum of trust, but that’s not a long time and they don’t have the ability to present themselves as well as Warble.

And now you got this guy, Calmont, he’s in the wrong neighborhood. He’s starting trouble. He’s got a knife. They don’t want any trouble with the people in town. They don’t want this hard earned peace to come crashing down. They’re not submitting to Calmont, they’re trying to de-escalate. Calmont’s a jerk, and they barely speak Common, and none of them want human town guards to show up and start jumping to conclusions.

Plus they’re backed into a corner and nobody wants to get shanked. They didn’t start a new way of life just have it ruined by a hot-headed halfling.

Jib916 wrote:

Woot! Thanks Logan, Jason and Mark! Keep up the great work <3

Mentioned this on the product thread, but we on the design team love you all and really appreciate your passion for building fun stories with Pathfinder, and we wanted to make sure to get this to you as early as possible and for free! Please also thank the amazing editors and the magically-fast-at-layout Sonja for how quickly they were able to help us get this to you!

ADDENDUM: Thank you Editorial Team and Sonja! You are fantastic!

Mark, Logan, and Jason,

Thanks for doing this and releasing it ahead of the book. I don’t say this as a freelancer, but as a GM. I’m running Age of Ashes in a few weeks and while I don’t need these rules, I feel better having these tools available. In case I want to customize something.

Well done and thank you again.

Jim

I'm loving this. Well done. No reservations.

EDIT: I mean let's playtest it of course, but I love the concepts behind it. I feel it's on the right track. I especially love that the team has considered that many players avoid spells with saving throws or that do not have partial effects. You read these optimization guides and those authors all particularly point out those "no effect on save" spells as mediocre choices. This is a good response to the perception that you wasted your turn if the enemy succeeds on their saving throw.

Hi Mark,

It looks like you're making some elements which we would traditionally consider to be mythic and essentially hard coding them right into the core rules. For example, swimming across the ocean or fighting sea monsters like Beowulf. Is that a fair assessment? If so, I like it.

Is there anything you can say about how skills will interact with combat and CR? Often it felt like they weren't strictly compatible (or didn't scale in unison).

I've had this question for a couple years now and I guess this is an okay day to ask it.

When I look at the description of Xhamen-Dor and extrapolate what it's original form might have looked like, I come up with a big reptilian creature with lots of tendrils coming off of it. I think that description has been alluded to in a couple different sources.

For those following along, there's a handy illustration at the PathfinderWiki

In Strange Aeons, we learn about the relationship between Hastur, Carcosa, and Xhamen-Dor. I won't go into any more details to avoid spoilers.

I'm an older gamer like yourself. One day it occurred to me that the description of Xhamen-Dor resembles the illustration of Hastur drawn by Erol Otus, that appeared in the original AD&D Deities and Demigods, which contained the Lovecraft and Moorcock material. Handy reference here: Erol Otus's Weird Hastur

My question: Coincidence? Kindly homage?

If this has been asked before, my pardons. I don't follow the thread regularly. This is just the easiest way to ask the source.

I'm not posting as a freelancer or a "company man". I haven't posted on the forums much in a long time. That said, I wanted to voice my support for this new edition in the making.

I came from a more narrative background. I think could sort of tell from the type of adventures and encounters that I write. I'm not the sort of player or GM that is going to complain if I have a little less algebra to do in my head while enjoying a game. It would be nice to be a little less dependent on electronic tools to keep track of a lot of elements. I say that not as an abstract comment, but someone who GMs weekly right now. I absolutely use HeroLabs and it's tactical console. It's like a microwave oven for me now, I can't see living without it. That is a very telling statement about a game.

Pathfinder is a decade old now, and it was an extended lifespan for an older system. There are lot of things we've learned about RPGs since that time. I'm ready to try new things and see new ideas.

So, I support Pathfinder 2.

@ John Lynch:

That's a fair perspective and I won't try to talk you out of it. Perhaps we should have went with one way instead of both. That said, the discussion is good because you understand the rationale now, and as far as I'm concerned you came up with an approach that works very well.

I am not a fan of her redemption.

I really wouldn't consider it as the default assumption.

Hey all,

Also, having discussed this a friend, it's my belief that Book 1 plays better than it reads. That sounds like damnation with faint praise, so let me qualify that!

Actually, as phrases go, I really really like that! Not offended in the slightest.

Book 1 is all about solving a mystery that is presented to the players very shortly after they arrive at the colony - namely, "where are all the colonists?" It's a compelling question, and one that will drive the players to make decisions based upon what they learn and what they believe is going on. That's good adventure design.

Thanks!

However, as the Judge, who knows what happened to all of the colonists, there's not a mystery for us to solve. The investigation is free-form, which means there's not a narrative thread for us to follow - that narrative is constructed during play by the players. It therefore defies conventional narrative structure, having a beginning and end point but very little requiring any point in the middle happening before or after any other. Finally, the reward that lore monkeys are looking for - the nuggets of what Azlanti culture was like - are necessarily light in this book. We'll get more, as stated above, but it just isn't there yet.

No, there isn't as much direct lore. I really had to save for the other folks. That said...

You just made me look at the chapter differently, even though I wrote it. (I'd love to say it was my master plan, but I'll be honest!)

The PCs are coming across a mystery, but you can almost think of it as an interruption of a story already in progress. The story of the first colonists. A story which thus far is not coming to a happy end. The two main adversaries are not expecting the Peregrine or the PCs. Nothing has been planned for their arrival. They're stumbling across an old crime scene and monsters have moved in the neighborhood. When they first walk on the beach, there's little that is conspiring against them. (That changes of course)

Oops, better watch the spoilers in this thread. You get the drift.

The PCs are introducing a change in a narrative already in progress.

I'm looking forward to reading where the AP goes, and what secrets we can learn about Azlant, but I also understand why some people haven't been wowed by the opening. I would encourage people to give the book a chance, though. It does as good a job of encouraging player agency in a published format as I've ever seen.

Well thank you, one of the nicest compliments I have gotten. I hope they give it a chance too, just so they can experience the cool stuff the other authors prepared.

Corvus is correct. Take this as poetic and figurative language and not literal. Eliza stared in the face of her own personal devil and she made a choice, to save herself, and maybe to be on the winning side.

She also had her brains rattled by an extremely powerful and alien consciousness—although I hesitate to play that up too much, because there that is more background rather than something I can point to with game mechanics. And some folks really need you to point to game mechanics before they can accept it.

Part of the underlying logic was an author/developer discussion I had with Adam. I hope he doesn't mind me sharing it. He felt that Ochymua should have Eliza dominated because he doesn't trust her. I argued that at 3rd level, its possible to make that DC 15 Sense Motive check. By having her act of her own volition, it allows the possibility of some roleplaying to occur (or opposed Bluff checks), instead of "Oh, she's dominated, just hit her." Maybe the PCs will go straight to combat anyway, but there is some wiggle room. Its up to the PCs and the GM and what happens at the table. It is reasonable for Ochymua to still dominate her (at Adam's request and recommendation) but give her a little slack and just follow along. Sure its a risk on Ochy's part, but it pays off in the story because Eliza is trying to earn his approval and trust. [What Ochy really thinks is entirely up to the GM]

All that necessitates an evil alignment, which is why I wrote her backstory as Corvus explains above.

As far as redemption, I don't like to write in absolutes of alignment. I am not sure that Eliza can be redeemed, but I was prepared to mention the possibility so the players can have the maximum number of options to explore—rather than tell them what they can't do.

As I write this, I am reminded of Harold, from Stephen King's The Stand. Very minor story spoiler.

Hey all,

I think Adam Daigle and Robert Brookes already gave excellent answers, but as the author of Book One, may I add a few thoughts?

Book One is about the fledgling colony and is meant to set the scene. That was my job, but I say that without being defensive. You have to understand, I always had a rough idea of what is to follow my adventure. We authors receive each others outlines and we know what the other folks are working on. Additionally, I'm proud to say, with Adam's help and leadership, the authors actually talked to each other a lot more than usual—and we influenced each other's ideas. We strived for continuity. I made every effort to foreshadow.

But.. perhaps this says it all. In another thread someone remarked that there are no sub-rules for colony management and administration. That was by design, because that is not the destiny and fate of the PCs (again, unless the GM wants to provide for it). They have bigger and more fantastic things ahead of them.

That said of course, there's nothing wrong with settlement building. Ultimate Campaign is there just for that reason. What we're providing with these chapters is an adventure to shake the foundations of the earth and provide details and insights the likes of which have never appeared elsewhere.

With thanks to Adam, his bosses like Erik and James, and to my fellow authors.

I think the idea of an interview process is absolutely fantastic.

I fully support Adam's decision to start right on the deck of the ship and looking at the island, but I think once folks have the text, they'll see that the background I wrote is 100% compatible with the idea of an interview process.

Actually, I don't think this is a spoiler, but I actually either state or strongly imply that such a thing actually happened. I don't want to say too much, but you'll see. Everything you need to run a Chapter Zero preparation arc is in place in the background. There are discussion about what the Bountiful Venture Company is expecting and the rights and responsibilities and opportunities for colonists.

I think people will be pleased.

I'm new to Pathfinder and I want to get my four kids involved in tabletop RPGs. I plan on this being our first adventure path and I'm really looking forward to it. Can anybody suggest a few source books to give me some more background information that I can use to flesh out the setting a little bit more?

Hey Jasper.

Other folks have given you good replies. For background from another perspective, I would look at early American colonies like Plymouth Rock and particularly Jamestown. For example, I literally researched the Mayfair and its cargo manifest, just for some details.

There's quite a few details drawn from historical information. I wouldn't claim historical accuracy because the needs of the story have to come first, but real history can be a pretty good inspiration.

(I'm the author but I'm not interested in self-promotion...but if I don't say that, then I'm just some guy on the internet offering his pet theory about the content)

It's saves word count, but I also think it's just cool to give folks monsters and see them used in the adventure. I try to do it as much as possible. Ben was an enormous help with the creatures on this adventure. Because he's a friend in real life, he was also second set of eyes on some of the NPC stat blocks.

Fourshadow wrote:

The Spiritualist?! WOW. All of the Spiritualist archetypes are dynamite.

Happy to hear it!

I am enjoying the spiritualist stuff quite a bit too. My wife plays a spiritualist (a class she loves) so these inclusions were quite a treat. Good job. :)

As far as I can tell, there is no nexus trait noted for the elder thing city in Part 3, Paris in Part 4, nor the Jaundiced Tower in Part 5. Based on flavor text, I think the elder thing city has the nihilism trait and Paris has the disorder trait. I have no idea what the Jaundiced Tower's traits are.

I'll help answer questions here, but Adam Daigle's answers always trump my own.

Oof, this should have been explicit, the fault is mine. That said, you got it right based upon flavor, so I'll confirm it.

Aevan-Vhor (the Azlanti/vampire nexus) possesses the trait of decadence. While you can find the other traits, it revels in its own abandon. Hunger, desire, and self-revulsion are all themes here.

Bohlvarai (the Elder Thing/shoggoth) nexus possesses the nihilistic trait. This is a ghost town in the truest sense. Parts of Edgar Allen Poe's poem, City in the Sea comes to mind.

Alternate Paris reflects disorder, with warring factions and a police state... Lost mad souls wander the streets. The Music of Erich Zaan is an obvious source of inspiration, but I would alo recommend people check out one of the less mentioned Carcosa stories written by Robert Chambers, In the Court of the Dragon, which also takes place in Paris.

Finally, the forming Thrushmoor nexus also possesses the nihilistic trait. It was necessary to repeat one and the possible transformation and awakening of the King in Yellow / Hastur makes this highly appropriate.

Hope this helps!

Thanks for the lost colony adventure.

What did you use as inspiration when you were writing it. :-)

Oh... Lost. Roanoke as a historical event. Early American colonies like Jamestown and Piymouth Rock. Plus some collected data we had on Azlant, which will deepen with later chapters.

One goal was to provide a good look at Azlant. Perhaps the primary goal, and the Aboleth I suppose were inevitable. Wouldn't make sense to not involve them. Later authors will really get into the Azlanti lore, as my job is to set the stage. We had a lot of talks privately about what Azlant was like. This was a very exciting project for the freelancers involved, and I think we were grateful that the senior folks in charge of content gave Adam (and by extension us) a long leash. There are tons more lore left waiting for future AP's, but you'll get a generous dollop of new insights.

Now, truly, I must beg off further comments. If it says NDA, just say 'No way!'

@Garrett,
I didn't mean any offense. It probably feels like strangers on the internet are telling you that you're wrong and that you don't know what you're talking about. I'm sorry.

They can easily fit into Lovecraftian themes with almost no effort. You're not crazy.

We just didn't try to double down on that, so that we are oversaturating folks on Mythos. Hopefully we succeeded and hope you'll take a peek. To check how well we did.

Best wishes and please know your opinion is respected, and no disrespect or patronizing was intended.

Again, I am going to defer to Adam. I just wanted to say this.

To build on Adam's post just above mine, I worked on both adventure paths, so I feel that I have some perspective. They're fairly different. Yeah, I can understand how people relate the alghollthu to something Lovecraft might have created, but the tone and vibe are different.

To me, "Lovecraftian" means more than just some monster with tentacles that lives in the water. It's psychological and often draws on elements of altered perceptions.

This specific chapter reminds me of tv show, Lost, more than it does say—John Carpenter's In The Mouth of Madness. That feels like the apples and oranges comparison you guys might be trying to force. That said, aboleths are aboleths.

The Lost Outpost has elements of mystery and suspense, which builds and deepens with the subsequent chapters.

I think people will be pleased to hear that the authors worked closely together under Adam's leadership to pull the entire story together into a cohesive epic with as much continuity as we could manage. I'm every bit as excited for the other chapters as I am for my own.

I now return you to your developer, and I'm going to hush up. :)

Hi there,

There is a small mistake on the Core Rules Environment Page.

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/coreRulebook/environment.html

It lists the DC to notice quicksand as DC 8. This was changed to DC 15. I'm not positive of the exact date, but it was the fifth printing or earlier.

Thanks!

Hey all,

I'm not looking for help, but I wanted to post this and FAQ it.

The incutilis in Bestiary 4 has some issues. It has a Reach of 0-ft., which is appropriate for its size. The Puppetmaster Special Ability however, states it can use its tentacle attacks independently of a its zombie puppet. Except it can't, because of the reach. Even if the zombie were to grapple an enemy, the incutilis would have to occupy the same space, which the zombie host cannot do. Which means it would have to disengage from the puppet and move into the opponent's square, which would end up taking a whole round and pretty clearly is not what the Special Ability was intended to do (at least the way I read it, if you take a literal interpretation it becomes a pretty lame-o creature). And it would get killed before it ever actually executed that stunt.

A quick fix is to adjust the Special Ability so that it has 5-ft. reach while mounted on a host.

Also, zombies are staggered. Might make sense that an incutilis zombie is not, since it has an active brain driving that nervous system.

Thanks!

Wow, this sounds like an exciting edition to the Bestiary line. I love some of the ideas coming out of this.

I'm particularly keen on the mention of "troops of goblins". I sincerely hope that this means we're going to get an actual troop template or statblock finally, with goblins being the example.

I thought troops from "Rasputin Must Die!" (by the awesome Brandon Hodge) were truly inspired. I've been waiting for something like them, for personal homebrew and even freelancing, ever since.

So excited!

I like this preview. :)

I just find it strange that there are so many people complaining that real world morally heinous acts pop up in a magical land of make-believe. When they spend most of their time, in the same world of make-believe, killing anything that moves until they can get their mcguffin.

I think that is a misrepresentation of the position taken. I think it is widely accepted that this land of make-believe has morally heinous elements. They're necessary for conflict and drama, components of storytelling.

Seriously, I can't speak to all of the forums but I don't see this position being argued in this thread.

Rather the discussion is about whether player characters should be engaging in morally reprehensible acts. The PFS campaign is not an appropriate place to explore that. Hell's Vengenance, for example, is a campaign where it is appropriate. Society missions have shades of gray, in terms of morality, but there is very little "gray" in slavery. Not to the slave anyway. The standard for PCs is not the same for NPCs, in an organized play campaign. Home games are an entirely different matter.

Why haven't people cryed out that Geb is allowed to exist when it has farms full of humans being raised as a food source for it's undead citizens?

They haven't been given an outlet to do so? It stands to reason they might when confronted with a scenario or module or AP where that was a theme.

Perhaps the campaign should change PFS to a G rated game, and we can go around making deliveries for local businesses or saving cats from trees.

I think that is an extreme comparison to having other player characters owning other people as chattel.

Like a young person complaining that because they're prohibited from vandalizing buildings and strong-arm robbery against the elderly, they must now be confined to making lace doilies and knitting. No, they still go camping, play basketball, read comics, and play video games.

Slavery is an extreme act, and prohibiting it does not alter the PFS since its inception. I honestly never heard of anyone owning slaves in PFS since the last 12 hours.

The hypocrisy (and narrow-mindedness) of humanity just staggers me sometimes.

Slavery is not an appropriate activity for PCs to engage in, especially in a campaign that is inclusive and open to everyone. Including young people. Frankly we're not that many generations removed from the practice, and the hurt it caused is incalculable.

I can understand why slavery exists in the campaign, because it is a societal evil which can be opposed, and therefore makes an excellent foil for storytelling.

While one can debate what is actually evil on a cultural level, PFS is not a course on Sociology. Lines must be drawn at some point. GMs are asked to entertain, not teach, let alone handle a topic like this with sensitivity.

Domesticated animals are not slaves because they lack self-awareness. That doesn't preclude treating them with kindness. My dog is not my slave, but I must set boundaries for him for his protection, health, and safety. Animals do not belong in a discussion about institutional slavery.

@ Rednal,

I saw your review and I just wanted to personally thank you. Not just for myself, but for Neil, Thurston, Jeff, Jonathan, Sean, Chris, Andrew, and Jason Nelson.. and our artists and layout folks.

This one was really a team effort and everyone involved made it a great product. I'm really glad you enjoyed it.

Happy Birthday John!

You are a scholar and a gentleman, and a genuine pleasure to work with. Hopefully I can attend PaizoCon this year and we can have a proper conversation.

I remember John as a potential rival but he has demonstrated to *me* time and time again that he is the best at what he does—the cheerful, thoughtful, imaginative developer for a program that brings joy to countless people all over the world.

A toast to John Compton.

Great job Jim, love the adventure so far, especially Ithanothuar. :-)

Also the Grundlescorn Sisters, great stuff!

Thank you. You are very kind.

James Jacobs is actually responsible for Ithanothuar, and I think the addition is inspired.

I *DO* take credit for the Grundlescorn sisters.

This just goes to show that all products are the result of teamwork and collaboration. Behind every great writer is a great (and hard-working) developer.

Awesome work, buddy!

There seems to be a very great deal of hand-waving involved in setting up the PCs into being interested in Skirgaard, in travelling there and in arriving at the hit and run tactics phase of this campaign.

Sorry for the thread necromancy, but I just saw this and thought I would comment. It was an intentional decision, Robert. Speaking mostly for myself, I couldn't see a lot of travel encounters that the PCs couldn't bypass without much difficulty, and I pitched it to the developer that way. Rather than invest the word count in just getting to the area, I focused everything in the location.

Hey Magnuskn,

My regrets on the incorrect specifics. I did try however, to answer in the spirit of the question.

I have not seen the very last chapter, but I have seen all the previous five. I have a little better access than some other posters, since I wrote chapter five myself.

I know what you're talking about in terms of Curse of the Crimson Throne, but you concern is unwarranted. Kintargo remains an integral part of every chapter (including the last one). The PCs do take some "field trips" outside of it, but not to exclusion. Chapter Five for example the players coming and going from the city a bit to the neighboring countryside, alongside actual city encounters. The city remains however, their base of operations.

I am confident that Chapter Six will have the players starting and finishing in Kintargo, with their hellish excursion sandwiched in the middle.

Hell's Rebels is very much an urban campaign with some fun side trips which will serve to keep things fresh and varied just when I think the PCs will most appreciate a short change of scenery.

In the false Akhentepi tomb, what happens if they successfully disable the trap (not by finding the hidden torch trigger, just made the perception and disable check in the boxed trap section) but then try to open the northern doors? Will that still trigger the waterfall, or is that turned off with the trap? What's in that room if the trap is turned off?

That is a good question!

There is nothing beyond the north doors besides a small space and a grate that leads to the aqueduct. It is a dead end.

First, the doors should be difficult to open and if the players were able to successfully locate the trap, they might (at your discretion) realize that the closed doors were part of the trap mechanism they discovered and disabled. In that case, they'll know not to bother.

If that is too kind for your taste, consider telling them if they succeeded on their Perception check by 5 or more.

If you don't want to tell them at all, do bear in mind these are not normal doors. They're part of a trap mechanism. forcing them open should be difficult. You might want to have them break them down or set a Disable Device check to open them. Say... DC 20, which is the same DC check to disable the trap.

If they do open the doors, flood the chambers for 4 rounds but don't trigger any of the other trap effects. After all, they found the trap fair and square and disabled it once. This should not be an opportunity to "trigger it anyways".

Hope this helps!

James, you did a great job here. I echo Amanda Hamon Kunz's feedback. For example, the part about ambient moisture is a trap that you perpetrated upon yourself. I know what that's like, because I'm very detail oriented too. Sometimes, however, we make life difficult for ourselves by trying to explain too much. I'll speak frankly, when it comes to rule trolls, everything you say may be used against your actual intention. Ergo it's necessary to be frugal and efficient with our words and to avoid extraneous details. A simple approach may be to say the blade reforms after a round with an option to make the process faster with water, and forego mentioning anything about ambient moisture.

That's not a dig against other posters, rather I say that simply out of pragmatism. We protect GMs from unnecessary rule challenges when we provide tight mechanics.

The infravision trick was neat but Amanda has a point, newer players may not get it and wonder why you are providing a weaker and slightly more complex power than darkvision.

All that said, did I like it ? Absolutely! You found some neat new design space and that is important. Congratulations on your first up on this road. I look forward to your future entries!

Now this is a cool design challenge!

@Charlie, Sub-Creator, Lord Gadigan, awesome posts!

(As were previous ones)

I should have said I welcome essays but don't want to demand them. I love to hear about why they were awesome. Soooo helpful. The comments about Gallowspire especially.

I just didn't want to go negative. But i get that a little is necessary to contrast.

Reading and taking notes!

I'd like to vote against Council of Thieves. Just terrible, not so much an adventure as a loose collection of notes, and anti-climactic after the much better books 4 and 5.

It's not a vote. I appreciate the thought but I would rather hear what you do like for a chapter six. Please?

As the only book 6 I've run, I (and my players) had the exact opposite experience.

Bob, is there one you do like? There is no disqualification if you just read one that you really liked.

Hey Folks,

What's your favorite Chapter Six of any AP? If you have more than one, you can list them in order of preference. Please be specific in you can.

Transparency: We learn from studying the work of others. There's a lot to be learned from trap design, use of templates, and monsters with class levels. Balance of story versus combat. That's why I am asking.

If you want to say why that chapter 6 is a favorite, I'm all ears, but a short answer is a good answer too. No essays required.

What not to do: Please don't tell me you don't like high level adventures and what the "sweet spot is". Please no editorials on what Paizo should do in the future (I have no say in that). Please don't argue with each other but respect that people have different opinions. Just tell me YOUR opinion.

Bear in mind this is *me* asking and not Paizo. If you want to speak to them, feel free, but pretty please also answer my question too.

Thanks in advance, I appreciate t!

What were the plot elements in question?

Send me a PM and I'll answer, or ask in another thread and send me a pointer. Its not relevant to this book and it would be an unnecessary thread derail. Although, I can't guarantee it is worth your time. It was not a particularly provocative decision that I think anyone is going to care about.

I defer all similar posts with the same response. I like the Occult Bestiary. Lets use this thread to talk about this cool book that was actually written. ;-)

I'd like to know who wrote the dreamthief hag. I'd like to thank them.

In 2010, I lost to Matt Goodall in RPG Superstar (he went on to write "Cult of the Ebon Destroyers").

My pitch was "Doom of the Dreamthieves" which was about extra-powerful night hags that raided Absalom from the Dimension of Dreams. It was a ridiculously complex planar adventure that couldn't actually be written without Occult Adventures (so the pitch was YEARS ahead of its time, the core rules sort of lacked the support it would have required). The proposal had other issues. It was waaaay too long for 32 pages and it drew upon plot elements that the Development Team wanted to quietly forget. "Doom of the Dreamthieves" had fans though! Some people wanted it! I failed very boldly. (Best final round RPGSS advice I can give is to know how many encounters you need to write your adventure).

So, when I saw the dreamthief hag I was touched. In a good way. It made me smile.

Now, having said that, I hope no developer makes a special effort to publicly say there was no connection. Because that would make me sad.