To powerful of a Gestalt?

Ok so I have been wanting to make a shadow based paladin lately in a gestalt game. But I was curious if taking Paladin//Arcanist would be a little too powerful?

Arcanist save DCs are based on Cha which Paladin has in spades. My Build revolves around using the Shade template which adds a +4 deflection bonus to AC and +4 bonuses to all saves which is a luck bonus.

So I could get away with wielding Light Armor and not be too squishy as well as have ungodly good saves, full BAB a good HD and some skills (Paladins really should have 4+Int as a martial)

Is the following just too powerful?
Shade[CR 2, No HD]
Paladin
Arcanist

Elan
[Start Venerable for +3 to mental and no negs to physical]

Take fate's favored trait to make the luck bonus to saves a +5 on top of my Cha.

Taking a few flaws allows me access to more feats, so I could readily built for moderate spell usage and moderate combat with little trouble right?

Arcanist and Paladin are a nice couple, but that template is too much even if your character was a 15pt buy rogue.
Just look at it, +4 level adjustment and quite justified - +4 to all saves as a luck bonus that is pretty rare, deflection AC, nearly doubled movement, invisibility practically at will and spell resistance 11+lev and that's just the beginning of it.

The paladin is only super powerful against evil. Not all your opponents are going to be evil. So, you'll still need to spend ability score resources (assuming a pt. buy) to be generally capable. It's not a simple charisma min/max fest.

The template is extremely good but only works in when in shadows or darkness and is negated via daylight or bright light effects. but I agree Shade makes it a monster.
PFs Cr rules would put it as a 2 level adjustment which I agree is a little short especially if it can be bought off.

You are right Paladins only have advantage against evil, but as LG I shouldn't be killing foes who are Good, and foes who are Neutral are typically more likely to run away then fight to the death so I was thinking focusing on Intimidate.

While it didn't say anything in the provided link about this, I believe in 3.5 shades were evil. I don't know what it takes to become a shade in this but I seem to remember in 3.5 you had to sell your souls basically to become a shade. This doesn't seem very paladin like, not that I'm pushing for the stereotype Paladins have but I'm not sure that this makes much sense character wise.

Keep in mind I had a shade in 3.5 years ago and what I'm remembering may be off a bit, but I know for a fact he was evil.

Ok it does say you sacrifice some of your soul but makes no statement on being evil.
I suppose you could say that the shaovar have good intentions for the world but are more of the means justify the ends sort and that sacrificing part of your soul to champion what they consider the "greater good" is a very noble thing to do and I'm guessing you are going to need a deity who would agree. I'm mainly trying to help make this concept work from a role play aspect as mechanically this has some serious potential but some of the things you are trying to mix feel contradictory in concept.

While it didn't say anything in the provided link about this, I believe in 3.5 shades were evil. I don't know what it takes to become a shade in this but I seem to remember in 3.5 you had to sell your souls basically to become a shade. This doesn't seem very paladin like, not that I'm pushing for the stereotype Paladins have but I'm not sure that this makes much sense character wise.

Keep in mind I had a shade in 3.5 years ago and what I'm remembering may be off a bit, but I know for a fact he was evil.

As i have looked up the template and the flavor for it.

It actually never states this could not be done to someone before they became Lawful Good, a loyal servant of Shadovar who was sent down from their floating city and found God, found enlightenment or simply lost his memories and was retaught by the church this would allow him to have his Shade powers, searching for the missing piece of his soul.

Hm, good deal then, was worried you were just throwing together powerful options and didn't want you to get called out on anything when you went to play is all.

Ok it does say you sacrifice some of your soul but makes no statement on being evil.

I suppose you could say that the shaovar have good intentions for the world but are more of the means justify the ends sort and that sacrificing part of your soul to champion what they consider the "greater good" is a very noble thing to do and I'm guessing you are going to need a deity who would agree. I'm mainly trying to help make this concept work from a role play aspect as mechanically this has some serious potential but some of the things you are trying to mix feel contradictory in concept.

The nongood aspect was mostly so you never put the good before the Shadow Prince's needs or goals. But this is a personal thing so you could see the will of the Shadow Prince as the greater good very easily I believe their culture to be Lawful Neutral.

The only way the Shadovar lets people go out without escort is if they are high military rank or be a prince of Shadovar themselves.

Drop the templates and it Will be fine. Gestalt works Best if you dont do a cheesecake on it. I dont Think there is anything unreasonable in Arcanist/paladin pehaps the blade bound arcanist finally would have a place in the World TWF with blackblade in one and divine Bond in the other hand. If the templates are important ask the GM if you Can have only one class and be a shade paladin when all the others are gestalt.

For the record, the Arcanist's spell DCs are based on his Intelligence.

To learn, prepare, or cast a spell, the arcanist must have an Intelligence score equal to at least 10 + the spell's level. The saving throw DC against an arcanist's spell is 10 + the spell's level + the arcanist's Intelligence modifier.

For the record, the Arcanist's spell DCs are based on his Intelligence.

PRD wrote:

To learn, prepare, or cast a spell, the arcanist must have an Intelligence score equal to at least 10 + the spell's level. The saving throw DC against an arcanist's spell is 10 + the spell's level + the arcanist's Intelligence modifier.

I meant the Exploits are based off Cha, my bad.

Dropping the Template is doable, I could do 10 levels in Shadowdancer for a majority of these abilities but I really do like the shadow based powers.
There is only one template, elan is a race.

Paladin//Arcanist is fine as gestalt goes; probably a little on the weak end due to the sheer MADness of it.

That said, between the +3 to all mental stats with no penalty and the obscenely strong template (stronger than any PF template printed by Pazio that I can name-- Half Fiend/Celestial is fairly close, but not quite there), your character is broken.

Unless the game is being played on a very high power level you should be dialing something back before your GM does that for you.

If you wanted your race to mix in with the shadows concept a wayang could suffice, especially if you decide you like the dual wielding the black blade and divine bond as they get a plus to dex and int and if I'm not mistaken your wisdom score will be rather unimportant. Also they may be small but without the typical minus to str that small races have I don't see that as an issue, in fact I'd consider it a plus

I am not sure I agree with the stronger then anything Pazio has printed template. But I agree it is a very strong template.

I suppose I don't have to do the batman approach. The Paladin Arcanist seemed a very good base archetype with Shade being a nice compliment for a dark knight style character.

Have you considered using a 3pp class for your shadow abilities?

Shadow Warrior.

Shadow Assassin.

I am not sure I agree with the stronger then anything Pazio has printed template. But I agree it is a very strong template.

Well, fair's fair, I wasn't including the Mythic ones-- because yanno, Mythic. Agile is beautiful b&!$~++#.

Anything else though? Nnnope.

I'd take a hard look at the Wayang to get that feel.

The gestalt itself is midline. The template by itself is obscene. That said, there are non-Templated Gestalts that are stronger...>.>

But why Arcanist and not just a Sorcerer? You are less MAD, and you can even take the Shadow Bloodline to have a rather powerful thematic fit.

Wayangs are nice but lets look at their racial traits.
+2 to Shadow school DCs
+1 to Shadow Subschool Saving Throws (If you can cast shadow school spells)
1/day SLAs (2 1rst level spells and a Cantrip)

Alternate racial trait
Pseudo Invisibility for a max of 5 rounds per level 1/day

Honestly Feltchings are a bit more shadow focused then that, especially if they are not spell casters.

The gestalt itself is midline. The template by itself is obscene. That said, there are non-Templated Gestalts that are stronger...>.>

But why Arcanist and not just a Sorcerer? You are less MAD, and you can even take the Shadow Bloodline to have a rather powerful thematic fit.

Honestly I dont know why but I never really liked the Sorcerer much, it never really seemed that impressive. Honestly I would rather roll a Bard then a Sorcerer. They always just felt like a second rate Wizard. I love the Spontaneous Casting but the limited spells known really felt choking unless you went for only generic general spells that you could spam.

and yes I am aware there are stronger gestalts, that was not really the point of this. If it was I would have just converted Erudite and Artificer and gone Psionic Artificer//StP Erudite