Hey there ! I've been willing to try the oradin out since I first saw it a while ago now, and my chance has fanally arrived ! That being said, I haven't played a lot to Pathfinder and would appreciate an expert's opinion regarding my building plans.
The campaign will be Kingmaker, but we should start it at level 4. Only core races are allowed. But our GM allows us to play non Lawful Good Paladins.
I didn't list any equipment below because I don't know what the GM will allow us to get when it comes to magical equipment. He'll monitor that for sure.
Here is the build I'm planning on :
Half Elf, Ancestral Weapon (falcata)
Str 16 (up to 20 with leveling)
Dex 10
Con 14 (13+1 leveling)
Int 12
Wis 8
Cha 18 (16+2 racial bonus)
Note : Constitution is a bit low but the GM will allow us to retrain our HD during the campain, which I hope will be enough. Will is low, too, but being a Paladin should make it up for it, at least I hope so ^^
Paladin Hospitalier, Knight of the Coins, Warrior of the Holy Light - Abadar (LN)
Oracle, Life Mystery, Legalist
Traits : blessed touched, magical knack (oracle), noble born "endurance overcomes all" ?
1 Pal 1 - Fey Foundling
2 Pal 2
3 Pal 2 Ora 1 - Power attack, Life Link (revelation)
4 Pal 2 Ora 2
5 Pal 3 Ora 2 - Greater Mercy
6 Pal 4 Ora 2
7 Pal 4 Ora 3 - Selective Channel, Channel Energy (revelation)
8 Pal 4 Ora 4
9 Pal 5 Ora 4 - Aligned Channel (Evil)
10 Pal 6 Ora 4
11 Holy Vindicator 1 - Quick channeling
13 Channeling Surge
15 Cornugon Smash
17 Critical Focus
19 Bleeding critical
20 Pal 6 Ora 4 HV 10
Beside of being an oradin, the idea is to use channeling ofensively and to decrease ennemies saves by having them shaken (Cornugon Smash) and sickened (Bloodfire & Bloodrain) so I can use the Vindicator's special ability on crit, topping it in the end with better crit confirmation and bleeding critical. I know I probably won't reach level 20 but it gives perspective.
Do you see any flaws, or improvment I could make ? Thanks in advance for taking the time to read me :)
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Channel energy may not stack from oracle and paladin. Check with your GM there.
Bleeding critical is on theme but isn't significant at level 19. Staggering critical would be way better, should you get that far.
A lot of what you list as your idea comes online very late. You're still an oradin and likely effective enough before that, don't get me wrong, but looking forward to stuff that doesn't start until level 14 is a long wait.
Channel energy may not stack from oracle and paladin. Check with your GM there.
Bleeding critical is on theme but isn't significant at level 19. Staggering critical would be way better, should you get that far.
A lot of what you list as your idea comes online very late. You're still an oradin and likely effective enough before that, don't get me wrong, but looking forward to stuff that doesn't start until level 14 is a long wait.
The two channeling pools don't stack indeed, I'll need to monitor them separately.
Thank you for the advice regarding bleeding critical. I assume 2d6 are not that relevent at this level ?
I agree waiting until higher level to fully benefit of the build will be a long wait... If you see any other way to make the oradin more combat effective on lower levels I'm all ears - and eyes ;)
If you enter holy vindicator earlier, say after level 7 (you'll need to get alignment channel at L7, selective at L9) then your character-defining tricks start at level 11 rather than 14. Still late but probably not endgame. This also makes your channeling better because you're doing less multiclassing before you get holy vindicator adding to them both.
Entering prestige classes without delay usually makes their class abilities arrive at levels where they're useful but not overpowered. Waiting until level 11 is a mistake by that line of thinking.
2d6 bleed indeed matters very little at level 19.
It makes perfect sense, thank you !
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The trouble with Bleeding Critical is that monsters that have taken a critical hit rarely last very long (often dying before they bleed at all).
EDIT: I think you should try to work in Toughness (perhaps in place of Power Attack). Once you have several Life Links going, you may appreciate the extra hit points.
My only real experience with the Holy Vindicator is quite a bit different from your version here. Demonic Obedience to Shax for his 2nd boon called Life in Blood:
You treat bleed effects as fast healing. For example, if you suffer an effect that causes bleed 5, you do not take any damage from the effect and instead gain fast healing 5. This effect ends whenever you are fully healed.
Now your Holy Vindicator Stigmata is actually Fast Healing. Lol.
I would see if you could fit 1 dip in Scaled Fist Monk in there somewhere, you get a Bonus Feat and Cha to AC. And if you ever get disarmed, you can Imp Unarmed Strike/Stunning Fist.
I'm no friend of the Life Link ability unless there is some special build around it, e.g. having Fast Healing. In your case, you want to be a frontline melee combatant AND make due with an average constitution score AND soak up other people's damage as well? Suicide much? xD
I'd reconsider this. But if you are determined, I suggest the following changes:
Take the Spirit Guide Oracle archetype, take Channel Energy as revelation on Ora 1 (instead of Life Link), and take the Life spirit's Life Link at Ora 3.
This merely switches the levels at which you learn those abilities, but the Life spirit's Life Link is just a temporary hex instead of a permanent revelation, so you can change it daily, maybe to something more useful with a spirit of your choice later.
This build will make you lose your revelation at Ora 3 & the Life mystery class skills Knowledge (Nature) & Survival, but even with 5 skill points per level (Ora/Knights of Coin 4+INT) these are hardly worth taking over your other class skills (Perception, UMD, Heal, ...). The Spirit Hex definitely makes up for the lost revelation.
It will also delay when you get the 1st-level spell Detect Undead, as it requires you to be Ora 4 to get the Spirit bonus spells - the normal Oracle would get it at Ora 2. You'll get Lesser Restoration at the same level (Ora 4) regardless of build.
Big bonus: If you add your Holy Vindicator levels to Oracle (& it would be mad to add them to Paladin), the Spirit Guide Oracle will get all the Life bonus spells you would have missed out on with the normal Oracle! That is because an Oracle mystery requires you to be at certain Oracle levels to get the bonus spells, but the Spirit Guide Oracle grants you all of your Spirit's bonus spells as long as you can cast oracle spells of that level!
And remember that you can switch Spirits daily, so if you're interested, have a look at all the spirits here and check if you like the spells and hexes. The Nature/Woods spirits can be quite useful in the early game as they grant you druid spells like Shillelagh and Barksin.
p.s.: If you like abusing badly written rules: the Spirit Guide oracle never loses the hex it gains from a spirit, even if you change to another spirit the next day. However, you can't change your hex later either.
Here is a list of all Spirit spells level 1 to 7, that are not on the Oracle/Cleric spell list (or at a better level):
FLAME
Burning Hands
Fireball
Wall Of Fire
Fire Seeds
Fire Storm (level 7 instead of 8)
FROST
Frostbite
Elemental Touch
Elemental Aura
Ice Storm
Freezing Sphere
Ice Body
WAVES
Hydraulic Push
Slipstream
Wall Of Ice
Geyser
Fluid Form
Vortex
WINDS
Alter Winds
Gust Of Wind
Cloak of Winds
River of Wind
Control Winds
Sirocco
STONES
Stone Call
Wall Of Stone (level 4 instead of 5)
Stoneskin
Stone Tell
Statue
HEAVENS
Color Spray
Hypnotic Pattern
Rainbow Pattern
Overland Flight
Chain Lightning
Prismatic Spray
DARK TAPESTRY
Black Tentacles
Feeblemind
LORE
Identify
Tongues (level 2 instead of 4)
Legend Lore
Contact Other Plane
Vision
ANCESTORS
Unseen Servant
Heroism
Telekinesis
Heroism, Greater
BATTLE
Enlarge Person
Fog Cloud
Wall Of Fire
BONES
False Life
Fear
Circle Of Death
Control Undead
LIFE
Neutralize Poison (level 3 instead of 4)
NATURE
Charm Animal
Barkskin
Speak with Plants
Grove of Respite
Awaken
Stone Tell
Creeping Doom
WOODS
Shillelagh
Barkskin
Minor Creation
Thorn Body
Tree Stride
Ironwood
Transmute Metal to Wood
MAMMOTH
Enlarge Person
Rage
Stoneskin
Beast Shape III
Tar Pool
Summon Nature's Ally VII
TRIBES
Battlemind Link
Vision
SLUMS
Charm Person
Summon Swarm
Confusion
Mislead
Hold Person, Mass
Thanks everyone, that's a lot to consider ! :)
As for being in frontline melee and all, I hope hopping to have a high AC due to gear and Vindicator's shield, not to mention that I can use channel energy and empowered then maxed heal spells.
Quick channel + channel surge would allow me to give a huge burst of heal, or damage. As HV impacts both pools (Oracle and Paladin), I should have enough in store... I hope...
I'll definately look into the options you gave me, thanks again :)