Caster Level of SLAs not based on Spells


Rules Questions

Shadow Lodge

8 people marked this as FAQ candidate. 1 person marked this as a favorite.

We've got an FAQ covering the effective spell level of SLAs not based on spells:

FAQ wrote:

Cleric domains, sorcerer bloodlines, wizard schools, and certain other class features give spell-like abilities that aren't based on spells. What's the effective spell level for these abilities?

The effective spell level for these spell-like abilities is equal to the highest-level spell that a character of that class could normally cast at the level the ability is gained.

For example, a 1st-level elemental bloodline sorcerer has elemental ray as a spell-like ability. Because a sorcerer 1's highest-level spell available is 1st, that spell-like ability counts as a 1st-level spell. A 9th-level elemental bloodline sorcerer has elemental blast as a spell-like ability. Because a sorcerer 9's highest-level spell available is 4th, that spell-like ability counts as a 4th-level spell.

...and similar text made it into the CRB:

CRB wrote:
If a character class grants a spell-like ability that is not based on an actual spell, the ability's effective spell level is equal to the highest-level class spell the character can cast, and is cast at the class level the ability is granted.

However, based on debate in at least two threads (here and here), there appear to be two different readings of the CRB text.

(1) "is cast at the class level at which the ability is granted"
(2) "is cast at the class level from which the ability is granted"

The first case indicates that the caster level does not increase as the character gains levels in the class that granted the ability, while the second indicates that it does always equal the character's class level in the relevant class. So:

1) For SLAs not based on spells, should the caster level remain fixed, or increase as the character advances in the class granting the SLA?

Also, a second related question due to the proliferation of selectable class powers:

2) If a SLA can be selected at different levels, should we base the effective spell level (and possibly caster level) on the level the ability was gained, or the level the ability was first available? For example, if an occultist takes the Evocation implement school at level 6, gaining access to Energy Ray (Sp), is the effective spell level 1 (because the Energy Ray power can be gained as early as level 1) or 2 (because a 6th level occultist can cast 2nd level spells)?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Thanks for posting the FAQ request. I like how you phrased it.

But as I said before in the other threads, if you read the SLA spell level FAQ as saying the spell level is fixed at the point that you gain the SLA, it is hard to see how the caster level can be anything other than fixed as well. Of course, you could read that the SLA FAQ doesn't say that the spell level is "fixed" either :)


1 person marked this as a favorite.

This all makes me wonder what the spell level is for a character who can never cast spells... like if a fighter had a SLA. Level 0? Personally, I think that even if the SLA level is set at 1 or 2, whatever, CL should equal class level in the class that granted the SLA. After all, a 10th level wizard has a CL of 10 even when he casts 1st level spells.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Except the quoted text from the CRB, states:

If a character class grants a spell-like ability that is not based on an actual spell, the ability's effective spell level is equal to the highest-level class spell the character can cast, and is cast at the class level the ability is granted.

which I read as "when the ability is grant" and it's fixed at that level. Note that the spell level and caster level are really only germane with regards to spell resistance, DC, and a few other things. The FAQ at least to me clearly seem to want to fix the spell level at the level it is gained, and since the wording is similar for CL, I read it like it is fixed as well.

Shadow Lodge

I understand why you're reading it that way. As pointed out in the OP, I don't think that's the only way to read it.

While the wording does seem to suggest that the effective spell level and CL are both either fixed or variable (and spell level is clearly supposed to be fixed, per the example in the FAQ) I don't think that's necessarily intended.

For me, the best argument in favour of a variable CL is that CL generally increases with class level (or character level or HD for abilities not tied to a class). It seems really weird that the devs would carve out this little exception almost as an afterthought - a rule added to the CRB as an errata in response to an FAQ, where the CL part of the rule wasn't even addressed in the FAQ.

It's also weird that an occultist's Purge Corruption focus power would have a different caster level from their Flesh Mend power just because the former references Neutralize Poison and Remove Disease and the latter doesn't reference the Cure line of spells.


The level of the spell is fixed.

FAQ wrote:
The effective spell level for these spell-like abilities is equal to the highest-level spell that a character of that class could normally cast at the level the ability is gained.

The problem is that they did an FAQ when they should also have done an errata on the CRB.

Remember the FAQ shows intent about how things are supposed to work.

I will press the FAQ button so that hopefully this is changed to be more consistent.

I would reword it like this if I were them:
"If a character class grants a spell-like ability that is not based on an actual spell, the ability's effective spell level is equal to the highest-level class spell the character can cast, and at a caster level equivalent to the current class level."

Sometimes they avoid errata so words are not pushed over onto the next page, but looking at the book that line has a lot of space so adding a few extra words will not push anything over. It is about 10 spaces of text.

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